LGA to JFK less than 4 hours for int'l transfer
Feb 21, 2017, 6:15 am
#16
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Your alteration of my quote made it a prediction.
My initial statement was accurate. I was referring to ex ante whether people would book a 4 hour difference between flights at different airports during morning rush hour, where the second flight is an international flight, and given LGA congestion. It isn't clear if the OP is on separate tickets. A 40 minute delay pulling up to the gate, a long taxi line, and an accident on the Van Wyck could make a misconnect.
i hope you're right, though, and that the OP makes it!
Feb 21, 2017, 7:48 am
#17
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Of course, all "can I make it" questions are predicated on the unstated assumption that the inbound is ontime and the understanding that if on separate tickets and not covered by AA's separate ticket policy, the risk of losing the onward ticket and that parade of horribles.
Generally, four hours is enough. I would suggest Uber. UberX will be slightly cheaper and much more responsive than a cab and Uber Black will be slightly more expensive and equally more responsive than a cab, e.g. no matter the cab situation at LGA, the Uber wait is 2-3 mins.
Traffic may be bad, but at worst, that turns 45 minutes into 90 minutes. However, with no checked luggage, that still leaves plenty of time even presuming that xJFK does not include Pre-Check for whatever reason.
Always preferable here is to book into JFK even if the fare is somewhat higher just because it eliminates one hassle factor.
Generally, four hours is enough. I would suggest Uber. UberX will be slightly cheaper and much more responsive than a cab and Uber Black will be slightly more expensive and equally more responsive than a cab, e.g. no matter the cab situation at LGA, the Uber wait is 2-3 mins.
Traffic may be bad, but at worst, that turns 45 minutes into 90 minutes. However, with no checked luggage, that still leaves plenty of time even presuming that xJFK does not include Pre-Check for whatever reason.
Always preferable here is to book into JFK even if the fare is somewhat higher just because it eliminates one hassle factor.
Feb 21, 2017, 8:46 am
#18
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For one thing, OP almost certainly doesn't have a connection but two flights on two separate tickets. Depending on the airline for the JFK flight, if he does not arrive in time that whole ticket will be cancelled. I agree that four hours is enough to make this work, but the question really is will he have four hours? OP needs to understand the consequences of having booked two tickets.
Feb 21, 2017, 8:52 am
#19
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Your alteration of my quote made it a prediction.
My initial statement was accurate. I was referring to ex ante whether people would book a 4 hour difference between flights at different airports during morning rush hour, where the second flight is an international flight, and given LGA congestion. It isn't clear if the OP is on separate tickets. A 40 minute delay pulling up to the gate, a long taxi line, and an accident on the Van Wyck could make a misconnect.
i hope you're right, though, and that the OP makes it!
My initial statement was accurate. I was referring to ex ante whether people would book a 4 hour difference between flights at different airports during morning rush hour, where the second flight is an international flight, and given LGA congestion. It isn't clear if the OP is on separate tickets. A 40 minute delay pulling up to the gate, a long taxi line, and an accident on the Van Wyck could make a misconnect.
i hope you're right, though, and that the OP makes it!
If the OP's arrival is on time, he'll comfortably make the connection, with an abundance of time to deal with waiting for an uber or taxi, dealing with traffic on the Van Wyck (during the evening rush, not the morning rush), and dealing with regular security if pre-check is not available. If the OP's flight is 40 minutes late, he'll still comfortably make the connection. Much later than that, and it can start to get more problematic, although I'd still predict that he'd make the connection more often than not with a two hour connection (although at that point the construction traffic at LGA plus traffic on the Van Wyck could prove to be significant variables).
As to the consequences of missing the connection, you and others have rightly raised the issue, but that's not what the OP asked and not what I was addressing.
[Edited to add: I have edited this post because I see how you intended your words not to be a prediction, but rather a statement that "most people would [not] recommend a 4-hour connection." That said, I also vehemently disagree with that statement. I think most of us on here would indicate that a 4-hour LGA-JFK connection is very comfortable. Of course, if one is on separate tickets, one has to consider the consequences of missing the connection, but still most of us, including the vast majority of people here who live in NYC, would say that if the inbound flight arrives at LGA on time, four hours to get to JFK is a no brainer. I'm sure that some can come up with war stories about traffic on the Van Wyck, but in my 30 years in NYC, I have never had the Van Wyck take anywhere close to the amount of time that it would take to put a 4-hour connection at risk. Of all the things that can go wrong, including delays getting in a taxi or uber, traffic, and long security lines, the only thing I have ever experienced that would put a 4-hour LGA-JFK connection at risk is a delayed arrival into LGA.]
Last edited by Blumie; Feb 21, 2017 at 8:59 am
Feb 21, 2017, 8:48 pm
#20
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You and others here are conflating two issues, the one the OP asked about (which is what I answered), and the separate issue of the consequences of missing the connection (which the OP did not ask about and which I did not address).
If the OP's arrival is on time, he'll comfortably make the connection, with an abundance of time to deal with waiting for an uber or taxi, dealing with traffic on the Van Wyck (during the evening rush, not the morning rush), and dealing with regular security if pre-check is not available. If the OP's flight is 40 minutes late, he'll still comfortably make the connection. Much later than that, and it can start to get more problematic, although I'd still predict that he'd make the connection more often than not with a two hour connection (although at that point the construction traffic at LGA plus traffic on the Van Wyck could prove to be significant variables).
As to the consequences of missing the connection, you and others have rightly raised the issue, but that's not what the OP asked and not what I was addressing.
[Edited to add: I have edited this post because I see how you intended your words not to be a prediction, but rather a statement that "most people would [not] recommend a 4-hour connection." That said, I also vehemently disagree with that statement. I think most of us on here would indicate that a 4-hour LGA-JFK connection is very comfortable. Of course, if one is on separate tickets, one has to consider the consequences of missing the connection, but still most of us, including the vast majority of people here who live in NYC, would say that if the inbound flight arrives at LGA on time, four hours to get to JFK is a no brainer. I'm sure that some can come up with war stories about traffic on the Van Wyck, but in my 30 years in NYC, I have never had the Van Wyck take anywhere close to the amount of time that it would take to put a 4-hour connection at risk. Of all the things that can go wrong, including delays getting in a taxi or uber, traffic, and long security lines, the only thing I have ever experienced that would put a 4-hour LGA-JFK connection at risk is a delayed arrival into LGA.]
If the OP's arrival is on time, he'll comfortably make the connection, with an abundance of time to deal with waiting for an uber or taxi, dealing with traffic on the Van Wyck (during the evening rush, not the morning rush), and dealing with regular security if pre-check is not available. If the OP's flight is 40 minutes late, he'll still comfortably make the connection. Much later than that, and it can start to get more problematic, although I'd still predict that he'd make the connection more often than not with a two hour connection (although at that point the construction traffic at LGA plus traffic on the Van Wyck could prove to be significant variables).
As to the consequences of missing the connection, you and others have rightly raised the issue, but that's not what the OP asked and not what I was addressing.
[Edited to add: I have edited this post because I see how you intended your words not to be a prediction, but rather a statement that "most people would [not] recommend a 4-hour connection." That said, I also vehemently disagree with that statement. I think most of us on here would indicate that a 4-hour LGA-JFK connection is very comfortable. Of course, if one is on separate tickets, one has to consider the consequences of missing the connection, but still most of us, including the vast majority of people here who live in NYC, would say that if the inbound flight arrives at LGA on time, four hours to get to JFK is a no brainer. I'm sure that some can come up with war stories about traffic on the Van Wyck, but in my 30 years in NYC, I have never had the Van Wyck take anywhere close to the amount of time that it would take to put a 4-hour connection at risk. Of all the things that can go wrong, including delays getting in a taxi or uber, traffic, and long security lines, the only thing I have ever experienced that would put a 4-hour LGA-JFK connection at risk is a delayed arrival into LGA.]
To each his own of course. But be careful with your assumptions. I may not live in NYC currently but have similarly lived there for nearly 30 years. And I'm 33. And of course connecting LGA to JFK is something someone who lives in DC is far more likely to have to do than someone who lives in NY.
Most importantly, there's no need to make this personal. On the info desk, where this was originally posted, people ask about booking separate tickets all the time, and I stand by my initial statement about what dozens of posts asking about connections on separate tickets demonstrate as a consensus. If you feel "very comfortable" with a 4 hour connection on separate tickets to an international flight with different airports, good for you. The OP has booked it, I think it unwise and wish him luck. You think it's a piece of cake. The end.
Last edited by Adam1222; Feb 21, 2017 at 8:58 pm
Feb 22, 2017, 10:46 am
#21
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Regardless of OP's scheduled flight arrival - wheels on ground & aircraft at the gate & doors open, pax allowed to deplane ... the clock doesn't really start until s/he is off the airport's interior network of roadways, and on the Grand Central Parkway or on Astoria or on Northern Blvd (local streets) using bypass to aim for JFK. It can take as little as 15 to 30 minutes to get into car service, SBS bus (Q48 to Flushing is another option, much slower ... free transfer to Q44 SBS to Jamaica and then AirTrain, not on this run with 3 hours & 30 minutes ... a minimum of 15 minutes from taxiway to terminal curbside, more likely 30 to 45 minutes or more)
Assuming there's no major, serious or gridlock traffic pattern in the immediate LGA vicinity - it should take, during the PM rush hour, on average of 45 to 60 minutes to get to JFK ... unless there's a major traffic accident or hazmat spills and road closure, etc. (then, all bets are off w. lousy odds) Getting to JFK around 8 PM is a reasonable target time for arriving ... weather is the wild card in this race against time / the countdown clock ... it still FLOOD around the Kew Garden/Union Tpke & JR Parkway interchange thru Main Street/Hillside Avenue, despite the ongoing reconstruction and new roadways, don't ask why nor understand it.
TSA backup, Global Entry lanes not open or staffed, and wildcat protest at T8 or police "incident" inside/outside - all those are "monkey wrenches" easily thrown to disrupt the best plan laid out - nothing we can do about it nor can anyone guaranteed it won't happen, it is what it is. Imagine if they did a terminal dump at T5 when 11 pax ?? breached checkpoint security & delayed flights and rescreened everyone 2 hours later ... Murphy's Laws at work here.
It's not uncommon for LGA to be the first among 3 local airports to experience ground stops & delays of 30 to 60 minutes with arrivals and departures, throw in wet roads and a lane shutted for emergencies, and your heart rates & anxiety factors will easily jump skyhigh. Being local, I'm in this area on a regular basis ... the afternoon/evening rush hour often don't ease up or end until 8 or 8:30 PM and sometimes even later, especially around the LIE, Grand Central and I-678 interchanges ... driving against the clock is a daily commuting challenge.
Strategy - check Waze before driving/getting into the backseat as a rider, check those live DOT traffic webcam links and adjust while on the move - the safety martin or windows for making the connection is as little as 30 to 60 minutes ... don't they start early/priority boarding int'l flights as early as 1 hour before scheduled departure on those jumbo ones ?
Good luck to OP, you should make it but there are, many, variables in play.
Assuming there's no major, serious or gridlock traffic pattern in the immediate LGA vicinity - it should take, during the PM rush hour, on average of 45 to 60 minutes to get to JFK ... unless there's a major traffic accident or hazmat spills and road closure, etc. (then, all bets are off w. lousy odds) Getting to JFK around 8 PM is a reasonable target time for arriving ... weather is the wild card in this race against time / the countdown clock ... it still FLOOD around the Kew Garden/Union Tpke & JR Parkway interchange thru Main Street/Hillside Avenue, despite the ongoing reconstruction and new roadways, don't ask why nor understand it.
TSA backup, Global Entry lanes not open or staffed, and wildcat protest at T8 or police "incident" inside/outside - all those are "monkey wrenches" easily thrown to disrupt the best plan laid out - nothing we can do about it nor can anyone guaranteed it won't happen, it is what it is. Imagine if they did a terminal dump at T5 when 11 pax ?? breached checkpoint security & delayed flights and rescreened everyone 2 hours later ... Murphy's Laws at work here.
It's not uncommon for LGA to be the first among 3 local airports to experience ground stops & delays of 30 to 60 minutes with arrivals and departures, throw in wet roads and a lane shutted for emergencies, and your heart rates & anxiety factors will easily jump skyhigh. Being local, I'm in this area on a regular basis ... the afternoon/evening rush hour often don't ease up or end until 8 or 8:30 PM and sometimes even later, especially around the LIE, Grand Central and I-678 interchanges ... driving against the clock is a daily commuting challenge.
Strategy - check Waze before driving/getting into the backseat as a rider, check those live DOT traffic webcam links and adjust while on the move - the safety martin or windows for making the connection is as little as 30 to 60 minutes ... don't they start early/priority boarding int'l flights as early as 1 hour before scheduled departure on those jumbo ones ?
Good luck to OP, you should make it but there are, many, variables in play.
Last edited by Letitride3c; Feb 22, 2017 at 7:29 pm
Feb 22, 2017, 1:45 pm
#22
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"SBS bus (Q48 to Flushing is another option, just slower ... free transfer to Q44 SBS to Jamaica and then AirTrain"
If one wanted to go for the public transit option, I should think that the Q70 SBS to the Roosevelt Avenue/Jackson Heights subway station, followed by the E train to the Jamaica AirTrain station, would be the faster way to go.
If one wanted to go for the public transit option, I should think that the Q70 SBS to the Roosevelt Avenue/Jackson Heights subway station, followed by the E train to the Jamaica AirTrain station, would be the faster way to go.
Feb 22, 2017, 3:45 pm
#23
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Assuming there's no major, serious or gridlock traffic pattern in the immediate LGA vicinity - it should take, during the PM rush hour, on average of 45 to 60 minutes to get to JFK …
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/new-y...16-2020-a.html
If the OP wants to arrive at JFK 2 hours before his/her flight and doesn't have to waste time checking in a bag, I would HOPE that he/she gets there but with the construction, potential flight arrival delays at LGA at that time, and Friday night rush hour, it is not a given.
Feb 22, 2017, 5:39 pm
#24
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Part of the problem in this thread is the careless use of the word "connection". OP Is not "connecting" because he is on separate tickets.
The consequence of that fact is that he, not any carrier, bears the risk of a no show at JFK. It also means that if OP has travel insurance, he will find that very few policies cover such a no show, once again shifting the financial risk to the passenger.
What none of us know is what carrier OP is booking xJFK, whether his tickets are flexible, whether there are change fees, what those fees are and what the consequences are of a no show. Is this a quick vacation to London where there are multiple options or is this an important meeting somewhere with only one open flight for the next three days and a change fee + fare difference of $700?
So, all about risk tolerance.
The consequence of that fact is that he, not any carrier, bears the risk of a no show at JFK. It also means that if OP has travel insurance, he will find that very few policies cover such a no show, once again shifting the financial risk to the passenger.
What none of us know is what carrier OP is booking xJFK, whether his tickets are flexible, whether there are change fees, what those fees are and what the consequences are of a no show. Is this a quick vacation to London where there are multiple options or is this an important meeting somewhere with only one open flight for the next three days and a change fee + fare difference of $700?
So, all about risk tolerance.
Feb 22, 2017, 7:24 pm
#25
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"SBS bus (Q48 to Flushing is another option, MUCH slower ... free transfer to Q44 SBS to Jamaica and then AirTrain" If one wanted to go for the public transit option, I should think that the Q70 SBS to the Roosevelt Avenue/Jackson Heights subway station, followed by the E train to the Jamaica AirTrain station, would be the faster way to go.
Friday evening's rush hours, like most weekdays, traffic on Roosevelt Avenue is a horror show, once the buses managed to squeeze their way there coming off the highway & side streets, that 74th Street and 61st & Woodside Station are gridlocked all evening ... Main Street, Flushing is even worst, except that buses have their dedicated lane 7 AM to 7 PM so they tend to plow their way thru, Vision Zero don't mean anything to bus drivers, worst on weekends with the crowds.
The biggest headache is all the cars, taxis, car services, Uber/Lyft, city buses, airporter coaches & shuttles, and lot shuttles, etc. ALL must shared those congested and twisted interior service roadways while constructions are ongoing, even when they aren't working (and, I am not sure if there's any overnight work being done by the contractors, as even from 11 PM to 5 AM, they can get a lot of work done ... overtime pay & shift differential pay, obviously one factor to speed up the progress)
Getting out of the LGA "penalty" box whether it's on GCP or via local streets (baseball season with home games, different story) is winning 33% of this battle against the clock, the rest being the optimal options to get down to JFK. Last week, I drove and once I got past Hillside Avenue (Waze calculated that I-678 was still the fastest route, despite an actual 15 minute bottleneck to squeeze thru from Jewel Ave onward) - 10 more minutes to Belt Parkway exit and another 5 minutes to JFK (to one of the cargo building around the loop) in the mid afternoon. By the time I was done and heading north on the Van Wyck again (I-678) & moving along slowly - southbound was almost at a standstill with one partially blocked right lane due to a police incident & towing, bus & commercial traffic, etc. all backed up past Jewel Ave/69th Street ramp ... easily 20 to 30 minutes for that stretch alone.
Nothing is simple, all it'll take is a little electrical or transformer fire on the subway lines, Jamaica terminal or AirTrain system itself, to ruin the mass transit connection - when they "announce" free shuttle buses & cross-honoring transfer/tickets, run & keep going with other options instead.
These are some of the DOT live traffic cam links that I've bookmark on my mobile browser - a quick glance before rolling with Waze running ... but, if traffic just ahead of me come to a full stop because of an accident or debris on the roadway, there's not much anyone can do but to sit there ... and you can't get out and run along I-678 with luggage. Good luck to OP - let us know afterward how everything went.
GCP - Eastbound @ 75th St - http://dotsignals.org/google_popup.php?cid=608
GCP - LGA at 94th Street - http://dotsignals.org/google_popup.php?cid=713
GCP - Eastbound @ Ditmas Blvd (near the Marina) - http://dotsignals.org/google_popup.php?cid=680
VWE near 69th/Jewel Ave - http://dotsignals.org/google_popup.php?cid=596
VWE near GCP interchange/split for JRP - http://dotsignals.org/google_popup.php?cid=958
Local time @ 9:15 PM + and still plenty of traffic, rush hour is over ... supposingly.
Feb 23, 2017, 8:24 am
#27
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Are you the OP? Or have you spoken or PMed, emailed back and forth with the OP? I ask simply since you said Is not "connecting" and having just reread all of the OPs posts on this thread , I didnt read once where they said they had more then 1 tkt or even just 1 tkt. I would tend to think there are 2 different tkts but w/o the OP saying as such, it may be all 1 tkt, so those discussing connecting are correct just as those discussing 2 different tkts
Feb 24, 2017, 8:34 am
#29
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Have you ever flown an itinerary with a connection in which transferring to a separate airport is part of that one airline's (or code share's) itinerary? I haven't.
Feb 24, 2017, 8:37 am
#30
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I have. It's not super common, yet common enough that I can comfortably say that it happens all the time. Not just JFK/LGA, but also LHR/LGW, CDG/ORY, etc.