Which hotel points are the most valuable?
 

Which frequent stay program points appear to be the most valuable? I am Gold on SPG and Plat on Hyatt but just by default for stays associated with work (mostly). For leisure I always stayed at higher-end properties that do not offer points... and im starting to reconsider the way I look at my leisure stays, hence my question. For example, my strategy is to use FF miles to buy F/J long-haul international for my leisure trips, which saves me real money. So, to me SPG points seem to have the best "value" given their transferability and associated transfer bonus... or arent they?

Having searched before posting, Im aware of this thread (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=569911) but its specific to a few properties and not broadly based, and didnt want to hijack the thread by posting it there...
Mod, feel free to move it wherever you see fit.

marriott seems to have the most locations

hilton has a very nice program, especially if you stay enough to earn diamond status

SPG is said to be a good program if you care about upgrades

hyatt rocks if you are staying somewhere that has a grand hyatt

super 8 and motel 6, well they just plain suck don't they

The most valuable hotel program is the ones that give you the rewards you want. Since this is probably not the same one that gives me the rewards I want, there is really no way to answer your question.

sounds like your hotel strategy is to still stay in properties that don't have points programs. in that case, then I'd agree that *wood is the best option, as you can convert the miles at a 1.25/1 ratio to miles and most airlines (assuming you transfer 20K miles at a time).

personally, I'd consider using points for hotel stays. At the best available rate, I saved well over $1200 by using *wood points at the Westin in Rome over Christmas. Considering that I was upgraded to a suite, the value of the award stay was even higher.

If you were to do that, then I agree with the previous poster that *wood is best for upgrades, but that Mariott/ Hilton are probably better for locations (although *wood probably has properties in most of the high-hit tourist locations).

I agree. There is no one answer to this question. What works for me might not work for you--and my tastes are not necessarily the same as yours.

I defintely agree and understand both you and mahasamatman, but perhaps what works for you COULD work for me... that is why i started this thread...

3timesalady you've certainly proven your point w/ your experience @ the Westin in Rome... I recently booked a 4 night stay at the Western Cape in CPT and the CSR on the phone said to me while he was looking for differences in fares/prices (i.e. was thinking about using corporate acct etc) "Sir, you have a lot of points, how about using some?" He went on to say that the same room that I am reserving for circa USD $500/night could be mine for USD $60 and 4000 points/night... I declined but hanged up perplexed about my strategy. But then again, the two tix LAX-CDG-JNB r/t on AF in O (biz class) which price out @ USD $8000+ p/p for 120k miles (NW miles) each reminded me about my strategy....

I agree, from the point of view of my own personal experience. Nonetheless, if you look at the Starwood posts on FT, you will see that a lot of people are very bitter over lack of success with upgrades at Starwood, and even more people are even more bitter over the so-called targeted promotions because they systematically discriminate against Starwood's own elite members.

For me, I find Hilton as my preferred program of choice... I am very price sensitive... so Hilton gives me many options... and many different types of properties... from Hampton Inns to Embassy Suites.

I very rarely stay at high end properties... and I have become a Priceline devotee... so I do not get a lot of stays... but Hilton has always had an option when I need to pay... or use points.

William

Not sure I'm tracking . . .

Given a choice between $500 per night or $60 plus 4000 Starpoints, using the Starpoints option has each point saving you 11 cents! Pretty good deal.

The tickets (if I understand you correctly) cost 120K NW miles to save $8000, which would make each mile worth about 6.67 cents. I presume you think that's a good deal or you wouldn't have taken it (and I agree), yet you're turning down a deal where you'd save nearly twice that. Not sure why.

Oh, and if you're paying $500 per night at the Western Cape, that's got to be at or near Rack Rate. Starwood has a "50% off" offer (SPG50) that allows you to pay only 50% of rack rate for up to 5 nights for a total of only 1000 Starpoints. If the "SPG50" rate is offered, for four nights you'd save about $1000 for 1000 points, or a saving of $1 per Starpoint. Now *that* is a savings! (And the nights on SPG50 count for stay and nights credit with SPG as well.)

I use only the Hilton and Starwood programs. I spend a lot of time on business travel at mid-range hotels which sometimes limits my Starwood stays. Hilton has a good range of hotels throughout every price range and they're in a lot more locations than Starwood. They also have some good high-end hotels (mostly international though) to spend points on. The other good thing about Hilton is that your points (and free nights due to recent promos) build up very quickly and if you're a diamond member, you can usually get a reward reservation pretty easily.

I like the Starwood properties a lot and it's easy to redeem points, but the points build up a lot more slowly than the Hilton points. Additionally, I almost never get targeted for Starwood promotions. That also limits my stays there.

[I]Not sure I'm tracking . . .

Given a choice between $500 per night or $60 plus 4000 Starpoints, using the Starpoints option has each point saving you 11 cents! Pretty good deal.

It is a very good deal, and that is why I am starting to re-think my strategy of using points/miles exclusively for award F/J flying. But rather, stay at the Prince the Galles vs. the George V to accumulate points and used them for a room should the ppp/ppm make sense.

The tickets (if I understand you correctly) cost 120K NW miles to save $8000, which would make each mile worth about 6.67 cents. I presume you think that's a good deal or you wouldn't have taken it (and I agree), yet you're turning down a deal where you'd save nearly twice that. Not sure
why.
Sorry if it was not clear enough. The tickets price out @ $8200+ each. I used 240,000 NW miles for two tickets. 6.8ppm.

Oh, and if you're paying $500 per night at the Western Cape, that's got to be at or near Rack Rate. Starwood has a "50% off" offer (SPG50) that allows you to pay only 50% of rack rate for up to 5 nights for a total of only 1000 Starpoints. If the "SPG50" rate is offered, for four nights you'd save about $1000 for 1000 points, or a saving of $1 per Starpoint. Now *that* is a savings! (And the nights on SPG50 count for stay and nights credit with SPG as well.)[/QUOTE]

Thanks for this ^ , i called and both the Western Cape and the Arabella in CPT (Staying at both properties) are not part of the group of hotels attached to this promo... :td:

I agree that SPG points are the best. I love the flexibility of using 20K for 25K miles on most airlines and now with Le Meridian hotels there are more hotels to stay at for free.
I have to say that I have tried for over 2 year (maybe 10 different times total) to use the SPG50 offer and the rate is always higher than the best rate at the time. It seems that the 'rack' rate is so inflated that it is never worthwhile to use the coupon. I just throw them out now.

Actually, I'm pretty sure both hotels still do offer rooms under the SPG50 promotion sometimes. I stayed at the Cape Town Arabella Grand Hotel a couple years back on this rate and saved quite a bit. However, it depends on the demand -- if you're staying during a peak period (e.g., November for Hermanus - when the whales come through), the hotel will usually have few or even no rooms available at that rate.

Sometimes this is true, particularly in the United States (although I've had luck with SPG50s in the United States as well). Outside the US, where the number of promotions seems fewer, the SPG50s seem to be more useful. If you go to the Starwood forum here on FlyerTalk and do a search, you'll find lots of threads commenting on the good deals they found.

So, if you're going to "throw them out," you can throw them in my direction. :D Or maybe better yet, offer them on Coupon Connection for those folks who find them to be useful.

i double checked and they dont participate...

Isnt that the very essence of a "targeted promotion"? To systematically discriminate? Whats the use of a marketing dept if they just mass mail the promos to everyone?

Ken in Phx

Unless one is committed to another brand, probably Starwood. With the feature that you could transfer it very nicely and with good ratios to airlines.

Marriott perks
 

I have membership in various hotel rewards programs, but have only ever redeemed with Marriott - they seem to give you the most points, per dollars spent, versus a flat 500 points with some other programs. I easily rack up the points each year. In addition, they always seem to offer another way to rack up bonus points, such as "pay with your visa card and earn an extra 5000 points" or "stay 3 times and get an additional 5, 10 or 20 thousand points". Those extras make a difference. I was able to stay at the Marriott in Kauai on my honeymoon for a week. With the other hotel programs, I don't seem to stay enough to earn any points for redemtion . I really don't care about being upgraded, so that perk isn't as valuable to me as free hotel nights.

Different chains give differing points for each stay and charge differing amounts for their rooms, so it probably works out even.

But for those of us who amass most of our points from charge cards, there is no questions that Starwood is the way to go. It requires many fewer Starpoints for a room than any other chain.

Last summer, we spent 5 nights at the Ritz in Maui for 150,000 Marriott points, but 5 nights at the Princeville in Kaui was only 48,000. I could have stayed 15 nights for the same amount!

Starwood No Capacity controls
 

I'll chime in here on Starwood too. Since our favorite type of vacation is a Biz class seat to Europe, and staying in nice hotels there, we like Starwood the best.

If we need to top up an airline account, there is the transferability discussed above, plus the bonus miles on transfer.

But it is the lack of capacity controls that we enjoy the most. If a Starwood hotel has a standard room available to purchase, you can use points for it. That has enabled us to get rooms when other chains did not have any award rooms available (or only had them at premium rates, such as Marriott "Stay Anytime" -- by using 50% more points).

I know that some have complained that this Starwood policy is not always followed (although some complaints seem to be special events, such as Superbowl or Final 4, which appear to be excluded), but in our experience, we have had good success using SPG in Europe.

I've gotten tired of trying to use Hilton and Marriott points during low season in places, and have them still tell me that they have no awards available.

Like others have mentioned, there is no single answer. It depends on how you earn, how/where you'd like to burn, what kind of hotel you'd otherwise book in a world without hotel points, what kind of vacations you take (e.g., lots of short weekends to big cities, longer resort stays, etc.), and what elite status levels you can attain within each program.

The only somewhat objective places to look for baseline values are Diner's Club and Amex. They offer conversions from their own currencies into all three of the big hotel programs. Unless changes have been recently made, their ratios are 1:3:4 for SPG:MR:HH.

That passes the smell test for me: I usually peg 'em at 3 cents, 1 cent, and 3/4ths of a cent. Looking at my recent redemptions in all of the programs, and comparing to what I would have been willing to spend on a decent hotel room for those stays, it roughly jives. Sometimes I'm tempted to peg SPG a little higher, but then I ask myself "Honestly, would I have really paid $349/nt. for that room? No."

I tend to do my paid business stays at Marriott, with Hilton as a backup.

I use my SPG Amex is my primary-spend credit card, with just enough HH Amex usage (a couple months a year) to lock in Gold status for the next year.

If I need more HH points, I know I can get 'em quickly from my AA account. The AA -> HH conversion is a roughly equal one to me, provided I'm doing a big enough transaction to minimize the impact of the $25 vigorish.

Learn 'em all, play 'em all. The more diversity you have, the more likely you'll be able to find an award room when you want it where you want it.

It all depends on your priority and what you define as convenient. For instance, I used to be with Marriott Rewards mostly because of the multitude of Marriott hotels in the US. But now that I only have select cities to fly to, I prefer SPG because I value upgradeability. Not to mention the flexibility to transfer my points to select airlines.

I switched to Marriott from Hilton and found that I can accumulate many more points; I find the rate of exchange better too--it's easier to get a free room. Marriott has the advantage, IMHO, that there are more opportunities to purchase merchandise.

Exactly, the SPG50 seem worthless to me too. I just trash them as soon as I get them.

You should save them - if for no other reason than to swap them with FT'ers in other countries. Although they are near-worthless in the U.S., there are many parts of the world where they come in quite handy. Some markets don't use "Rack Rate" they way we do here (e.g., the rate they'd charge if the Olympics were held in the hotel parking lot). So 50% off Rack can actually equate to the lowest available rate.

Check out the SPG board for a wide range of SPG50 threads. I seem to recall that they work well in Australia, among other places. And in the U.S., they seem to have value on high-demand weeks in Manhattan, assuming you are willing to pay $300 or more a night for a hotel after applying the SPG50.

Hold on a second.

I love Starpoints as much as anyone, but as a fellow credit card guy, you need to look at your bang for the $CC. I get 4,5, or 6 Hilton points per $CC - 5 from 5X spending on my Hilton Amex, 4 or 6 from my MR Amex, which has been in a perpetual promotion state since November of last year. For enough points for a top-end 6-night award at Hilton, I need to put no more than $43,750 on my cards. Your 5-night award at the Princeville requires $48,000 in CC spending. The wildcard will be how easy it is to get Hilton awards with this new gold benefit. And do top-end Hiltons measure up to a cat 5 Starwood?

Having said that, we were at the Princeville earlier this year - it's a tough act to beat.

Is the perpetual promotion state something that Amex will put in writing and guarantee me on an ongoing basis? If so that's something I might bite on. 6 HH per $ spent would be well worth it for me - as long as I know for sure that I'm getting that on every dollar spent, every day of the year.

Right now, I carry both HH Amex and SPG Amex. I think they are the top two cards for general usage, given both their raw value returned as well as the side bennie of HH Gold status.

I'm sure some folks will disagree with me, but I think the approximate equal levels are as follows. I stress approximate as we all know that the specific hotel market has as much (if not more) impact on the levels as hotel quality. (e.g., the same category might be a dumpy midscale property in Manhattan and a kicka** 4-star property in Asia.)

- HH Cat 6 = SPG Cat 5 = MR Cat 7
- SPG Cat 6 = Marriott Ritz awards

I hesitate to throw Astoria awards in here yet because Hilton is only beginning to build out that brand as its own entity. But they seem to be trying to build something that stacks up against St. Regis and Ritz, at least in select markets.

You have about as good a chance of that happening as the Cubs winning the World Series in my lifetime.

But do the math: based on your valuation, you'd need to spend a little less than $15K while signed up for one of their bi-monthly promotions to cover the $110 annual fee. (There's a promotion going on right now for July & August). If I can sign up for one-2-month promotion a year, it's worth it to me. Is it worth the gamble?

Starwood.. without a doubt. I get to transfer points to miles.. and got the Sheraton in Agra for 2500 points a night!

I find Hilton points to be the most valuable for me. I like the wide variety of hotels in the program; I can rack up points at less expensive hotels and use them for free nights at high end hotels. Also Hilton counts award stays toward elite status.

...And don't underestimate the value of the fact that anybody can maintain perpetual HH Goldness just by spending with the Amex. Gold status has real value: lounge access, pretty good upgrades at most hotels (not suites, but stuff like ocean view at resorts, C-level rooms, corner rooms, etc.), and generally better-than-the-average-joe treatment at hotels. The status is completely on par with MR Gold and almost as good as SPG Plat.

So that in and of itself makes the first 60,000 points you earn from your HH Amex after the start of each year pretty valuable. They are essentially EQM's! :)

I'm both Marriott Platinum and Hilton Diamond, though I'm almost always at the lower end of things since I pay my own way.

With Hilton, I seem to have points coming over the transom from everywhere, and that doesn't include the free night certs I seem to get once or twice a year. The Hilton AMEX alone has generated over 100K points in the last year or so.

With Marriott, I have a nice stash, but amazingly I have never stayed on an award. Love them travel packages, though. :) I think I'll drop down to Gold next year, because the benefits are pretty much the same as Plat ans it's much more convenient in my current location to do the Hilton thing.

Other than that, I just joined the Choice program. OK properties, but they allow you to redeem at Preferred Hotels, and those places are really top end. I'm staying in one in London this Fall, so I'll let folks know how it works out.

Starwood fan back again. I can't comment on the Hilton AMEX because I don't have one - I'm so happy (right now) with the Starwood that I see no reason the explore it. So in addition to the Princeville last summer, here's this summer's trip:

145,000 Starwood points transferred to Cathay Pacific's Asia Miles program. That resulted (thanks to the bonus) in 180,000 Asia Miles. For that we got two First Class tickets on British Airways from Newark,NJ to CDG in Paris. The tickets sell for over $10,000 each! Now many of you would rightly say that it's ridiculous because I would NEVER pay that much for them. That's certainly true but isn't there SOME value there? More to the point, my regular AMEX card would get me Continental points. The only thing available through CO was coach tickets at 100,000 each or 200,000 for both of us. So I got First Class for 55,000 fewer miles than coach would have cost with the AMEX card. I can't place a dollar value on that but it's worth a lot to me and my wife!

Finally, we booked 6 nights at the Prince de Galles, a Luxury Collection hotel, for 60,000 Starpoints. Even though I'm a Platinum Elite for now, I didn't want to take my chances on a suite upgrade. I was given a choice of an additional 1,500 points per night (again, 5th night free) for a Junior Suite that still has a separate living room or an additional 12,000 points per night for a full size suite. We took the cheaper one and will hope for an upgrade. But I basically booked (with no problem with blackouts or extra points) my suite for 67,500 points for 6 nights. The suite goes for about $1,000 per night.

I'll get abuse for the math and even I agree (as I said above, I certainly would not have spent the money for the FC ticket) but I got 13.8 cents per point for the flight and 8 cents for the hotel.

No one's wrong and no one's right,but I'm certainly happy! :D

FWIW, we're also spending 3 nights in Normandy at a Relais & Chateaux hotel. We got the third night for free thanks to the Merrill + card, so a free credit card saved me over $400 on that one.

Sorry for such a long post. I get very excited about this stuff!

Then I'd say you got full value for your points. :)
That's what this board is all about! I still get excited when I score a junior suite at a Garden Inn, or an upgrade on a one-hour flight.

The free nights in Europe (after a First Class trip across the pond) is so far beyond anything I thought possible just a couple of years ago, I still have trouble believing it.

Thanks to the OP for the question. I agree that there's no "right" answer, but the replies have still been useful and illuminating.

BUT, CC rube that I am, what's this about getting perpetual HH gold status through Amex? Does this mean if you have an HH Amex card and spend a certain amount on it per year, you get Gold status? If so, how much do you have to spend annually?

I was under the vague impression that if you have a HH Amex card you get some initial status for the first year, but you lose it unless your Hilton stays justify if for subsequent years. Is that correct?

Thanks for any info.

I think if u spend 20grand you automatically get gold. Perhaps HH junkies could chime in as I'm not entirely sure... Question would be, is gold worth it?

In my experience Hilton Gold is not worth much if only staying in US Hilton properties. I have had some GREAT experiences as Hilton Gold outside of the US but that has been ahile since I did those international Hilton stays.

--

That's right.

Gold is worth free breakfasts and upgrades.

BigLar-

Thanks for your response. I too still find it hard to believe that we can pull off vacations like this for, basically, free - and hope it lasts awhile longer.

It astounds me. I'm a dentist and about three years ago, we stopped sending checks to our supply companies and labs and started paying them with credit cards. We never run a balance or pay interest, we simply pay everything in full but one month later and to the credit card companies. Since it's fewer checks, it's actually less work.

And for that, last summer I got 4 nights in a suite in New Orleans, 4 nights in a suite at Mont Tremblant in Quebec and ten nights in Hawaii (including first class airfare). It boggles my mind.

Many, including my wife, think I'm obsessed, but it's amazing how many more people are asking my advice!

Yes - spend $20,000 on the HH Amex, and you are given HH Gold status.

Furthermore, because of the way HH's calendar works, you really only need to do this once every 2 years if you prefer using SPG Amex for your normal spending.

My scenario: I began using my HH Amex in January. Used it until I reached $20k, and then stopped using it. A few weeks later, I got my Gold card. Because I earned Gold in 2006, the card is valid until April 2008.

So, if I no longer care to accrue HH points, the next time I need to pull the HH Amex out of my wallet is January 2008. Then, I will use it for normal spending again, and get a Gold card valid through April 2010.

Even in the U.S., it isn't bad considering how easily they give it away. At HWV, we were given top floor, Ocean Tower, with a welcome bottle of sparkling wine, and of course access to a very nice lounge for breakfast and snacks every day. On an award stay. At all of the big properties in Chicago (which is the one U.S. city where I tend to pick Hiltons over Marriotts), I've always gotten great upgrades, corner rooms, jr. suites, and of course lounge access - on any and all rates I've booked (other than third-party agents, of course). On an award stay, we got top floor ocean view at HHV plus free breakfast certs, although no lounge access. (I'm not sure if there is one.)

So for our leisure stays, we get great value out of Gold. Breakfast, lounge access, and nice rooms. For my business stays, where I care most about bed/smoke type and general assurance that stuff won't go wrong at the hotel, having Gold is a more subtle - but still valuable - perk.

Still, I know it doesn't compare to Diamond. Those guys (on this board, anyway) are generally a pretty happy bunch as compared to MR and SPG Plats. Rumor has it that one can earn Diamond purely on CC spending by hitting unpublished thresholds, but talk of that has actually been quieter here since they published the $20k-Gold rule.

I considered continuing to spend on HH Amex all year in hopes of a surprise Diamond bump, but then I realized that it would likely be futile. My spend level on my primary CC is day-to-day personal spending plus about 2 business trips per month. Smalltime compared to many of the road warriors here. Therefore, if they were comping people to Diamond based on CC spending, we'd be reading about it often on the HH board.