Hotels: Quality or Points?
 

I'd like to know what some of you would do if faced with the following:

Say you have the opportunity to work for an employer who feels that the quality of where you stay, reflects upon the image of their company.

This employer has no problem with you booking into the finest property a city as to offer, on their dime.

Now I know that many, if not most, of the truly finest hotel properties in the world have absoulutly no affilation with any frequent stay scheme. But they offer truly unmatched service and facilities that put the top of the line chain hotels and some other affiliation properties to shame.

But it's your call. You can do the St. Regis (Starwood) for example, if you wish.

What would you do?

Would you skip the points and opportunites of future free nights for your personal use, and take advantage of the opportunity to enjoy some of the finest hotels and resorts in the world?

Or would you go for the points?

Thank You.

Tough Choice but I would say points actually its the stay credits that I'm interested in for elite status, UNLESS it is this time of the year and I have already reached my top level tiers and the stay credits don't really do much for me except put a few more points in the coffers.

I could find some nice properties using Marriott, Hilton or Starwood that would not hurt my firms image. But heck I'm with a gov't contractor so they expect anything that will give within Per Diem so almost anything looks good

Points!

Chains in big cities hold their own against the niche luxury properties, especially if you are just staying for short term travel.

I think I would split it down the middle. Having the opportunity to stay in some extraordinary properties on someone else's money is not to be passed up!

If you could "work this angle," I would stay in chain hotels during the early part of the year (to build up points and status) and then stay in some of the more unique properties later on.

Why not get some of the best of both worlds?

It will be interesting to see how our non-US friends weigh in on this. I travel 95% of the time internationally. Often, the best hotel in a city is non-affiliated with American chains and FT programs, and their quality will blow away an American chain hotel.

For example, consider the Leading Hotels of the World or Relais & Chateaux properties. Both have marvelous properties, with considerable local charm. Shangri-La hotels in Asia are terrific, and the Oberoi chain in India is excellent.

Personally, I'd go for the most special hotel experience, and savor the memory of that stay. I've enjoyed the Bayerischer Hof in Munich, the Vier Jahrzeitszen in Hamburg, the Shangri-La in Kuala Lumpur, the Grand in Stockholm. I've had extraordinary stays at the paradores of Spain and the pousadas of Portugal.

Yes, there are some US chains with superb international properties - but focusing on status internationally will mean accepting homogeneity and predictability at the loss of marvelous individuality and charm.

Hands down the best hotels, regardless of the lack of points. The quality of the facilities and services, particularly as you become known to the establishment, are far better than collecting points.

One downside: it is very easy to get spoiled by the circumstances, which can become a problem if you switch employers (or your current employer changes policies) or when you vacation on your own dime.

My choice would be to shortlist from the best hotels, and if there is one with a frequent guest program stay there, otherwise pick the best one.

And (if possible) pay the bill with a mileage card.

I wish I could find such an employer http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by PG (edited 12-06-2001).]

You only live once (well OK so there may be an afterlife but we don't know what kind of accommodations we might end up with there)--so go for the experience!

The really top notch hotels do track your history at a particular location. So you get tremendous treatment if you're a regular. That's half the benefit of status in a hotel program and usually enough to get me to go with the premium hotels. What you don't get obviously are free stays, which really becomes a problem when you want to stay at these same hotels on personal travel.

I've more or less given up on getting top tier status in a hotel program.

I always pick the best hotel. Points in know way make up for great service and a great property. If u can get the best of both then that is great but I never compromise when it comes to a great property!

Quality first! Points, if any, I regard as a bonus. I do the same with airlines. If I could fly YX for the same price as UA or CO, I would do it without a second thought.

I agree with SanDiego1K.

I think in the U.S. you can pretty much stay in one of any major city's finest hotels and earn points/miles (perhaps not the finest - in NYC and SFO, my two preferred hotels aren't affiliated, for example). Outside the U.S., particularly in Europe, this can be a bit more problematic.

If you've got this type of job/employer, you're probably making a decent salary and traveling quite a bit anyhow. So you're already racking up airline miles and hotel points (in those destinations where the finest hotels and resorts just happen to already be affiliated with a frequent stay program - these places do exist).

In this context, given the choice, I'd go for the finest regardless of points. You only live once. Live well (in the present)!

Omni OMNI to Premex: You are a very good speller. However, in two recent posts you've spelled the word "absolutely" in ways excluding the "e". In each of your posts the word "absolut" flashes at me like a (very) dry martini. What's up?

My approach exactly!

I am treating my family (12 total) to free first class flights and rooms in Hawaii this Spring. In no way could I have afforded to gift this way if I had not collected points/miles.

IF there are truly (heads and shoulders above) extraordinary properties I would stay there.
My most recent example was staying at the Horned Dorsett in Rincon, Puerto Rico. Just divine!!!!

Quality hands down.

I frequently make a similar choice. Not so much quality over points - but uniqueness over points. With the amount of nights I spend in hotels I could easily be platnium, but I'd rather pass on the higher status and points and stay in unique places when I can - castle in Umbria, grass-roofed chalet in Norway, sailboat in Greece, treehouses in Port Douglas. In cities when there's no better option or hotels are pretty much all the same, I'll stay with Hilton or Starwood enough to make gold on each. I still earn lots of points by using their co-branded Amex cards.

Just to add: As someone else mentioned, the truly top hotels do quietly track your stays and offer wonderful gifts to those who stay frequently. A former neighbor who stayed in top-tier hotels got great offers for free weekends and lots of goodies. I was so jealous.

[This message has been edited by letiole (edited 12-07-2001).]

OK... I will be on the opposite side. I have a tendency to consider spending the company's dime as though it is my money. I personally could not justify the cost of the high end hotels personally... and cant professionally either.

I oftentimes will stay at a hotel that is not the "preferred" hotel just to save $20 or $30 a night (often more).

I have yet to find a hotel where the service quality is worth $400 or $500 a night. I would be too guilty to use it.

Of course, I get funny looks in the office when I tell them I go to Napa Valley and stay at the "Chablis Inn" - you saw that place Tom911 (remember?).

Just another view.

William

Last time I looked, Shangri-La gave 1500 Qantas FF points per stay, so no problem there!

For myself, I'd go for the points. I've had great service at some mid-range hotels and, honestly, how many TV sets and bathrooms can one person use?! Higher class hotels tend to charge more for extras that work (at least, places I've worked) won't pay for anyhow, so it's just more out of pocket expense for me if I want a drink or whatever.

I'd prefer to stay somewhere comfortable and get points that I can use later when on holiday.

In Premex's example, part of the boss' message is that exhorbitant luxury spending is a deliberate marketing tactic. So trying to save them money doesn't do them any favors.

Outside the US, I'd just take the best hotel and not worry about the points.

Inside the US, I'd make a list of the top three properties in each of the top 30 US cities, and prioritze them by chain:
1. Four Seasons or Ritz Carlton
2. Starwood
3. Best Independent
4. Other chains

For the non top 30 cities (where I usually go for work), I'd pick whatever chain suits my point needs from the best two properties.

My clients careless where we stay. My company cares that we don't stay at high-end properties. So when I book i try to find a good rate among the HHonors,Marriots or Starwood,starting next year I am trying to work on the Starwood program, but usually i look for quality first then points.

A little off topic. I am booked on Homestead Suites in downtown Austin, has anyone stayed here before? And there is no where in the it's website that tells me about how to earn miles or points with them...I guess there is nothing to gain from staying with them?

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Regards,

Al

This should be a Hilton Property offering full points and elite bonus points and elite stay credit.

You might be thinking about Homewood Suites Unfortunately, I'll be staying at Homestead Suites...



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Regards,

Al

I must say without a doubt Quality comes before points/miles. Who wants to master points if they sleep on cardboard? Or find one towel in the bathroom? Or have a very dark room. I HATE it when I come back at night and walk INTO A DARK ROOM! Dont care about the mints but light turned on!
With NW I get x amount of miles for every dollar at properties so it doesnt matter!

Quality....

Life is too short now. I'd rather enjoy the finer things in life.

Quality first, but if the points were accessible, I'd surely go for them too! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

I always choose quality, comfort and safety over hotel points.

Ah, so true, wigs, so true. I still miss the Mandarin in San Francisco. What a joint that was. The last time I stayed there (before changing employers) they had printed Mandarin stationery with "SFJoe" in gold under the Mandarin logo to be ready for me when I arrived. Not to mention the rest of the scene.

PremEx, I usually try to stay in a better hotel because the trains run on time. It is amazing how hard it is to get a fax, for instance, at anything but the top hotels. Or 24 hour edible room service. Or the many other things that I need to work. Then, there is the silly time I spend on the road, and the fact that I'll crack if I have to spend all that time in lousy hotels.



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William,
It's a funny thing--with new restrictions on spending, I *do* treat this decision as though it were my own money--I'll top up the difference between the corporate rate in some cities and the hotel I want to stay in with my own nickel (or dime).



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Premex, is your prospective company publicly held? If so, could you please email me the name of this company? I'd like to make sure it is not in my portfolio. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif I also hope that this company hasn't laid anyone off recently, while their manangers/directors are offering you the chance to stay in these 5 star hotels.

I'm not trying to insult you personally (or anyone on this thread), but for business travel, in this day and age, can anyone justify to their shareholders that they need (need) to stay in the Four Seasons or Ritz Carlton vs a Marriott, Westin, W, or Hyatt?

Now there could be exceptions. If they're looking to "wine and dine" prospective MBAs, or other "top talent". If they're looking to aquire another company, and want to project a certain image, there are other examples, and if it fits this bill, your question is already answered, and you may lose your points opportunity.

A better question is: Who they trying to impress? Is it really necessary? Could it backfire? Are you sure you want to join a company that spends their shareholder's money in this fashion? Plenty of dot coms spent money like this in the past, Will these guys be around in 5 years?


[This message has been edited by skofarrell (edited 12-08-2001).]

Sko, Don't forget that many large corporations, law firms, etc. often have negotiated highly favorable (discounted) rates for their top personnel in these type of properties.

Fair point BVH. Still...

I'd agree with TrojanHorse on this one. If its early in the year and I'm still concerned about keeping my top tier status for the following year I'd definately go for the points (i.e.: I go to Charlotte quite often & work 'uptown'--yet to keep my Starwood Plt status, I'll stay at the 'less than desirable Four Points', rather than one of the closer higher quality hotels). But later in the year--as in last week, I went for the Marriott City Center Club floor (where I'm not even silver--but have points to add on to). Which basically means I'll go for points/stays before really deluxe accomocations.

Well, I don't want to take this too far off topic. But I do think there are occasions when appearances for clients are probably very important. I worked for a very successful law firm for a few years. The partners were sometimes required to stay in top-end hotels depending on the client (and the client was footing the bill for everything).

I think it's largely a question of "face". You will see this issue quite a bit when doing business with Asian companies, and to a lesser extent with European companies.

Your point on responsibilty to shareholders is well-taken. But it's a concept that is not always as prevalent in other countries.

My "Americaness" is showing. If my attorneys were staying at the Four Seasons, my first quesion would be "Why the hell are you staying at the Four Seasons, and am I paying for this?" http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

There are many instances where you have to spend money to make money. At times it is absolutely necessary. Right or wrong, appearances do count. Image can be everything and can make the difference between acquiring and retaining vital accounts or losing them to the competition. It is also extremely important to be aware of the differences, attitudes and nuances among various cultures. True ignorance of that knowledge can make you or break you. There are good books available on the subject.

Speaking of spending money to make money, I'll never forget years ago walking downtown Reno, Nevada in front of the many open casinos that lined Virginia Avenue. One carney-type (as in carnival) character or better yet, huckster was out on the sidewalk encouraging business for the company he represented. He kept saying, "Come on in folks, come on in" repeatedly. The part I'll always remember is when he said, "You've got to pop 'em to drop 'em and drop 'em to win."

Even that huckster knew that you had to spend money to make money!

We didn't go in. Appearances do count! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

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When all Frequent Flyer programs become equal, they will cease to exist! Be careful what you wish for!

I charge my hotels to my client, but they are manufacturers usually away from large cities, so the preferred (image) hotels list my company has is useless. I stay in chain hotels. I thus prefer points and then during vacations, I stay at the best properties the chains have to offer worldwide. I live by the golden rule, I spend money like it was my own. I even use hotel coupons for additional savings, even though it's the client's nickel. Being thrifty has allowed me to stretch my vacations, allowing my wife and I vacation trips to LGA, BCN, ATH, NRT, GIG and GCM this year alone. Like the barrister (lawyer) we met in Rome last year who was staying at the Lord Byron, supposed the highest quality hotel in Rome, he was happy with his great skyline view of Rome for $450/night. My wife and I were happy with the balcony view of Rome life at a $65/night 7-room hotel one block from the coliseum. Our memories of Rome will include the sight, sounds and smells of the city, not the number of people paid to wait on us. Quality is a measure of meeting one's requirements and people will have differing requirements, and requirements may depend on who pays the hotel bill. Quality and Points can both be of value, however image alone shouldn't be associated with quality. I value quality hotels, but hotel image is near zero value to me.

Edited for some syntax and spelling errors.

[This message has been edited by outoftown (edited 12-08-2001).]

Quite so. It is also often true that this sort of thing is hidden comp. It may also be de minimis. If you are paying someone a couple of $M per year, what's a few hundred bucks for a hotel?



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Wish I had your dilemma, PremEx....

I also don't want to invest in them, but I'd be happy to apply to work for them. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

your case does not hold.
unless the company is generous enough to put u also into the presidential suite, then definitely the quality. this is what james bond has chosen.

otherwise, a st. regis is jsut as good in quality and also offers points. for the same corporate policy, i can get a club suite in st. regis vs. a club room in ritz carlton; and the persidential suite in st. regis vs a diplomat suite in a boutique hotel.
and i get points and exceptional service as well!
also, sometimes it is not the service itself, it is also the status and the fact that they treat me better than other guest. e.g. priority/guaranteed reservation is nothing your boutique hotel can beat.
again, james bond does not care because he can always jump the reservation queue.

PremEx = James Bond

This should be good ...

Interesting question - I had this same choice to make earlier this year while on business in NYC for several months. I ended up choosing quality - the Regent - over points... and do not regret the choice, even though I passed up on many tens of thousands of hotel points. In some cases the experience of the service offered in true "quality" hotels far outweighs the benefit of points in improving your immediate quality of life.

Go for quality!

-Zombie-