"honor bar" implementations
 

(posted in MR-specific forum b/c I'm interested in Marriott properties in particular)

I'm at a property where the "honor bar" is served by an attendant...there aren't any glasses out, presumably to enforce this policy. And the hard liquor is offered in multiple serving sizes (at different prices) and is measured out in a jigger, so no "generous pours". How typical is this for Marriott "honor bars"? Typically I see true honor bars, where patrons can serve themselves, and I also have been heartily encouraged by most CL attendants to serve myself generously.

As an amusing aside, one of their red wine offerings is Ferrari Carrano Cabernet Sauvignon...at $17 and change per glass. That seems a bit high, even by CL standards, but I can't imagine that they get enough turnover on those bottles to preserve the quality of the wine (which they merely recork and let sit out at room temp).

Can you ask the attendant to open a fresh bottle if you want that wine?

Many lounges will allow you to order a bottle of wine from room service, at room service prices billed to your room, and consume it in the lounge if you wish.

I've only seen this in states with backwards liquor laws (Utah, etc).
Most others in the US don't have an attendant pouring for you and rely on you filling out the card and serving yourself.
Where was this?

No idea and i don't want to imply interest by asking.

I can't imagine that they wouldn't...I also often see people bring in their own liquor to consume, and I've never seen that practice questioned.

Florida

I could see perhaps bringing wine that had been a hotel welcome gift into the lounge or something that had previously been purchased through room service, but otherwise bringing one's own alcohol (purchased outside of the hotel) into a lounge with an honor bar seems close to bringing your own beer into a bar that provides (free) live music. I just can't imagine someone having the nerve to do this.

Probably done the math and found out it's cheaper to pay the bartender than to rely on the "dishonor" bar where people scam.

Yeah, I'm not sure I'd bring in my own stuff, and if I did, I would certainly be discreet about it. With that said, I don't think your comparison to a bar is 100% accurate...the primary purpose of the CL is relaxation and light munchies, whereas the primary purpose of the bar is to sell alcohol and food. Plus, the fact that you can walk from your "temporary home" to the CL puts people in a different mindset. As I think about it, if I were drinking an alcoholic beverage in my room, and wanted to go grab a snack, I'm not sure I'd hesitate to take my drink to the lounge...but I'd still be discreet.

No doubt...but then it's not an honor bar (and shouldn't be referred to as such), and I think this takes away one of the perks of the CL. I know when I'm traveling with colleagues, we heartily enjoy the CL honor bar and in addition to paying for it tip the attendant heartily. With this model, we'd almost certainly head elsewhere...there is no draw of the CL vs other venues (incl the hotel bar).

Exactly.

Of course it would never be questioned. It's an exec lounge, not a bar, and you are a guest in the hotel. If you wanted to bring your own wine to the hotel's bar or restaurant you could absolutely do that as well. They might have a standard corkage fee, but that would almost always be waived for a hotel guest.

If US exec lounges charge for wine, bring your own. You have every right to do it.

At the FLL North there a CL attendant that doesn't even put the glasses out to make a drink and fill out the slip. Last time I was there I waited 8 minutes for him to finish setting up before he could serve me a drink. It was more than the cost at the lobby bar including tip.

JW Marriott Miami I had a similar experience. Are there really that many people that don't fill out the form?

So much misinformation....

The CL is not a private club. It is subject to the same laws as any other establishment serving alcohol. Most hotels likely have a single liquor license covering all operations within the hotel. There are no exceptions for the CL because its hotel guests congregating there.

There is no right to bring alcohol into any establishment. Establishments are free to control who brings in alcohol and under what circumstances. There is a Website that allows you to see which restaurants allow you to bring your own bottles. http://www.gobyo.com/ In Atlanta, only about 20% of restaurants allow this.

The best course of action is to ask if it's okay, or be prepared to leave if it's not. There is no universal right to bring your own. Bottom line: the restaurant/bar/CL is responsible for alcohol consumed on its premises and can be held financially liable should someone consuming on the premises cause harm to a third party. Given they also have agreements with insurance providers, liquor distributors and licensing authorities, and have been given legal advice on what they can and cannot do, you should respectfully follow their policies, not make up your own.

At the Hotel Chicago, everything but water is behind a staffed bar, including soft drinks, except for late afternoon, when beer and wine is self-serve.

This isn't a private club. It's just another licensed establishment selling booze. It's called a "club" to make people feel special. That's good marketing.

But, whether you can bring your own booze into a licensed establishment is a matter of local law and then the property's own policy.

You have no "right" to anything.

That is so absurdly not true. The exec lounge does not have it's own license, the hotel has a license.

EVERYONE HAS A RIGHT to bring wine into a hotel, which includes the exec lounge. If you get so drunk that they think you may be a danger to yourself or others, or are disturbing others, they would ask you to leave. Although the same is true if you are buying their wine.

To think otherwise is ridiculous. Start making some calls and emails and find one Marriott affiliated property that says you are forbidden from bringing wine into their hotel, or its lounge. You won't find one, but good luck trying.

Not a single word of it was misinformation. When you refer to "establishments" and some website, you're not talking about hotels. This thread is about exec lounges of hotels and hotels so see above, and previous post for all correct information.

I think it's more the exception than the norm given the # of Marriott properties. It's also not exclusive to Marriott. I know of two Hiltons that have lounge attendants who serve vs. the patrons serving themselves (but I also think it's more the exception at Hiltons too).

Cheers.

I'm not so sure one has a "right" to consume their own alcohol anywhere in a hotel such as a public area like the club room. Asking is always the best approach and if there is any push back, move the party to your room.

Since most of the honor bar system is in the US which has 50 states with differing alcohol laws, it's a bit silly to make absolute statements IMO.

Cheers.

Marriott Seattle Airport has the attendant (who is very nice and attentive) pour and serve alcoholic drinks. Their prices are also awesome as they probably have not been updated in a decade.

Lots of hotels officially charge corkage fees on alcohol you bring in yourself although most won’t notice/care if you bring a bottle or two in if you’re discreet. But I know at least the Atlanta Marriott Marquis has stopped friends of mine from bringing in alcohol (although admittedly during Dragoncon where a tad more drinking than normal occurs).

I am seeing more alcohol behind the locked doors 😉 In the last 3 months I have experienced these properties with an attendant serving.

Charlotte City Center
Both full service in Downtown Salt Lake City (gee surprise)
Marriott Seattle Airport
Renaissance Las Vegas Convention Center

Hell, I'll walk in past the front desk with plastic grocery-store bags full of groceries and alcohol and nobody's ever said a word, be it an SHS or a JW.

You must not have read what I wrote. You have conflagrated the posts in this thread which deal with the possibility that some properties' liquor licenses may prohibit outside booze (corkage) with possible prohibitions against bringing food and beverage into rooms (typically reserved for higher end resorts).

When you do read the posts, you may want to edit out the word "absurd" or accept that it is absurd but true.

There is also a difference between what you can do in a room for which you have a contract for occupancy and what you can do in common areas. For example, it might be completely acceptable to walk around naked in your contracted room, but it wouldn't be acceptable in the common areas. The fact you can consume legally purchase alcohol in your room doesn't automatically grant permission to do so in common areas, any more than you can walk around naked in common areas.

While I have no problem with a CL having a bartender, don't call it an honor bar if they do. I stayed at a CY last year that said they had an honor bar. No honor bar to be found.


Anyone know if the JW Essex House's honor bar is a real honor bar?

I think its staffed when I was there in August. So is the ATL REN Waverly. Annoying waiting for them to setup and in the the middle she closed it down to do errands and disappeared for like 20 minutes. Super ridiculous. They used to ration the cokes that way too...

I have no problem with an attendant serving me a drink. I have a problem waiting 10 minutes like an idiot waiting on the attendant with 100 responsibilities to pour me a drink that is 1.5x the price as downstairs all while spilling the 1oz jigger into my glass and calling that a lounge.

Same person who when asked where to eat says I have no idea...

Marriott Seattle Airport has very reasonable priced booze and attendant knows what you drink when you are semi-regular even if it was a year since one was there. Price is way less than bar downstairs.

Your allegation of "conflagration" belongs in the fire alarm thread. The correct term here is "conflated"

I'm not sure the point of this post. Beyond the misuse of the word "conflagrated", you falsely suggested that I was referring to rooms. Yet in every post I referred to lounges, bars and restaurants.

The hysterical irony is the you started with "you must not have read what I wrote" yet quoted my exact posts which always spoke about lounges etc. That's kind of absurd, isn't it.

So it seems the worldwide search is over :). Had that been me, I would not have just quietly agreed, the MOD would have been involved for sure.

BTW, what the heck id Dragoncon? A trade show for dragons? :D

Something my niece and 51,999 other people look forward to every year. Here is the info: http://dragoncon.org/

Agree.

Agree.

Agree.

And I'm sure the MOD would have been glad to help you with getting a reservation at a different property ;).

State laws & property policies trump your "right" to bring your own booze into the exec lounge. And properties that are charging for booze in the exec lounge (US/Canada) consider it a revenue source. I doubt they're going to look favorably on those who want to bring their own booze into the lounge to avoid having to pay honor bar prices, just like they would not look favorably on someone wanting to bring their own booze into the hotel bar to avoid having to pay bar prices.

Cheers.

Sadly, I've grown to expect you to find reasons to argue and disagree with every point I make. So disappointing.

In my 30 year+ experience (plus with my parents before that) the MOD, and if not the GM or their assistant, would have instructed the attendant to not only allow me to bring in my wine, but would have instructed them to open it and serve it to me. I've experienced similar events with low level employees scores of times, not this exactly, but similar issues. The MOD or GM always resolves them to my benefit, as is their job.

Never, in hundreds and hundreds of hotels, has a situation like this resulted in the MOD suggesting a different property. Just such a ridiculous idea that they would. What they do in the real world is fly through as many hoops as necessary to ensure guest satisfaction and not move a paying guest to a different property.

Didn't realize that agreeing with you 100% was a requirement when posting on FT :p :D There are times when I agree with you & times I don't. I post in both instances.

If your 30+ years experience was with honor bars in the US exec lounges & all of the properties allowed you to bring your own wine into the exec lounge vs. signing the drink chit (or ordering from an attendant) I might agree with you.

But those of us who reside on this side of the pond who have stayed at Marriotts for many years & who are also aware that liquor laws differ by state & that properties are not prone to allow one's own wine/booze in the exec lounge where they're selling wine/booze won't agree as much.

I would wager $$ that the ATL Marquis GM/MOD would not tell the exec lounge staff to let you bring your own wine into the lounge & open it for you, having stayed at the property previously.

Getting back to the original topic. Given the # of Marriott FS brand hotels in the US I still think it's more the exception than the norm for there to be an attendant vs. signing the honor bar chit, but there might be a move to go that way moving forward. Probably to avoid folk who have 2 drinks but mark only 1 or to cut down on usage. The issue, as noted, is that it's a bit annoying if one has to wait for the attendant to clear tables in order to get a drink.

BTW - even though the wine is free in the London Renaissance, the last time I stayed there they had switched to the wine in the lounge kitchen/the attendant bringing it to you vs. you getting it yourself.

The NY Hilton (which has a good size exec lounge) actually set up a bar in the lounge, so you can wait for the attendant or just go to the bar to order your drink/sign the drink to your room.

Cheers.

You have not agreed with anything I've written in a very long time :(, but have openly disagreed often :(.

But........

In an attempt to solve this issue with the Atlanta Marriott Marquis I just called them and spoke to Skyler, the front office manager. She just transferred from Miami and thought the idea that you could not bring your own wine into the lounge to be absurd, so she put me on hold and checked with her boss.

Unfortunately.....

Her boss gave no concrete answer. She said that "he did not know if there are any laws regarding this, did not think there was any hotel policy, but if someone was intoxicated the attendant would have the right to intervene"

So.............

Even the one concrete example given, is actually a toss-up :D, unless one of us checks back with Skyler tomorrow :D! I honestly had hoped to get a solid answer from them one way or the other. To openly admit that I was completely wrong, or to (ever so slightly) gloat that I was, most likely, correct.

Either way Sharon, laws/regs/policies aside, I can tell you with complete honesty that any time a hotel staff member has told me "no" (or my parents) on something we felt was unreasonable, management has always, always, resolved in our favor. Naturally I've never asked for drugs, or escorts or anything illegal or inappropriate, so the "no" thing would never be ok.

IMO - and my vast experience - hotel management will always find a way to ensure that I look forward to returning to their property, not suggesting I find another or creating a situation where I would not want to return.

Peace, ok? Let's shake hands and call it a draw....otherwise, tag, you're it ;).

At the PHL (airport) Marriott last month, liquors were self serve while the wine was poured by the attendant. I thought this was strange because liquors were far more expensive than the wine, which was very low end and so bad, I find it hard to believe anyone would intentionally try to "steal" it.

Dude, you're way too invested in this. If you want to feel you're right & the rest of us are wrong wrt bring in our own booze into US exec lounges re: of state laws or individual property policies, that's fine. Doesn't necessarily mean it's accurate, but if you want to spend your time calling all the FS properties in the US & Canada, go for it. ^ FWIW - I don't track how often I agree/disagree with FTers in threads nor the timelines involved in them.

Again, getting back to the original topic of the thread. I still think it's more the exception than the norm to have the attendant do the drink thing vs. having the honor bar, but would be interesting to see if Marriott moves more towards that. Maybe this thread could have a wiki added with listings of those that do have the attendants vs. the help yourself.

Anyway, I'm done w/ this thread. Need to call some of the US properties myself wrt whether the exec lounge is open/closed on weekends & what they do for brekkie when it's closed, so I can update the exec lounge sticky.

Cheers.

The last 2 Marriott FS properties I stayed at had attendents in the lounge serving drinks, including pouring wine:

NYC Marriott Marquis
SFO Marriott (which is an M Club)

Too bad, I had wanted to shake on it, but since you tagged, I'm it.

Who are the "rest of us" :D :D. One person made a comment about laws, you latched onto it and repeated it three times.

Problem is I was done with the thread. I made a case that you could always bring in your wine and challenged someone to do what you suggested I do, find one hotel that doesn't. In less than a day I was proven wrong and accepted that. I WROTE LONG AGO IN THIS THREAD THAT I WAS WRONG (so your "If you want to feel you're right & the rest of us are wrong" shows you actually didn't read the posts I would think). In that post where I admitted I was wrong, I actually was laughing about with "the worldwide search is over" :D. I have no problem accepting when I'm wrong or saying that, as I did here.

It should have ended there.

But then you posted the absolutely ridiculous:

Third time. The job of a MOD or GM is to ensure guests are satisfied and become REPEAT guests. They would never be "glad to help you with getting a reservation at a different property", that is always the absolute last resort if they have a guest who is committing a criminal offense, causing damage, etc. When you bring to their attention actions of a low level employee you feel are inappropriate, they will do whatever they can to ensure you are satisfied, and obviously if the low level staff member was in error, they would resolve that in your favor and apologize profusely. I would have expected someone with your travel experience would understand something so basic. Shrug.

Skyler got back to me and confirmed the ATL MC Marquis has a HOTEL policy which does prohibit alcohol from being brought into the lounge. I find that strange, but long before your comment about a MOD being glad to remove one of their most loyal guests, I completely had accepted my mistake, as I wrote with a joke and a smile. So not sure why you didn't shake on it and tag me. One again - I WAS WRONG (although that was written days and days ago, by me). Shrug.

Regarding "local laws", by in large, if not exclusively they restrict days of the week/hours of operation that licensed establishments can sell or serve, they zone location and authorize or refuse licenses, they prohibit the consumption of alcohol outdoors and in other non licensed locations.

I could obviously be wrong, but common sense would typically indicate that the inside of a hotel, which would include it's lounge, would never be a specific location a local law would site for restricting alcohol consumption, that is if the hotel itself has a valid license.

Good luck with the sticky.