Total Value of Inking at Staples?
 

I was wondering if someone can check my numbers on the total annual value of inking at Staples.

• Each $200 GC carries a $7 fee, = -$35 fees per $1K in cards
• Potential for 1% cashback using Visa Savings Edge program = +$10 per $1K in cards
• 5% UR points from Chase for office store = +$50 per $1K in rewards
• The net gain is +$25 per $1K spent.
• Max allowable rewards = $50K spend per year.
• Max gain = $50*$25 = $1250 annually
• Assuming $2K per trip, that is one trip every two weeks, and a liquidation of 250 gift cards, annually.

Does this seem accurate?

If so, I can see the value if meeting minimum spends. But it seems to be an awful lot of work (and risk for Chase shutdown) to do sustainably.

You left off the cost of liquidiating GCs (money orders, etc.).

However, I don't think very many doing this are taking straight cash back from the 5%. Common transfers are going to be to United or Hyatt where people routinely get 1.8-3c per point in value.

For me, I look at going the Ink route as allowing me to get in Cat 6/7 Hyatt properties for $160-200 a night in cost rather than paying $400-1,000 a night.

Example: If you Inked the full 50k (which I wouldn't personally do), 250k UR points = 250k Hyatt points. That is eight nights @ PH in Paris which goes for $1,000 a night routinely. An extreme example, but it gives you an idea. 250k United miles is pretty much two round trips business class Americas - Japan (Saver award) (which I imagine runs at least $2.5k a seat RT most times).

Well, the value of 5x UR points (max 250K) could varies depending on how/which program you redeem it in. On UA MP that could be 2x saver biz class from NA to Europe that could be valued at a few Ks for example.

Yep, ink and staples is a cheap way to buy chase UR points.

"But it seems to be an awful lot of work (and risk for Chase shutdown) " I've done this very consistently and never heard a peep from chase.

Thank you all for the quick reply. Silly me. I was so focused on dollar value that I didn't factor in cost-per-point in transfer programs. I'd probably easily get plenty of value out of United transfers.

I am trying to do this for each card that I have - how much for both sides versus cost benefit.

Lately all I have been doing is meeting minimum spend but now I am at the point where I need to make a plan going forward

Yep yep, I've done this now that I've got a stack of cards I intend to keep long term. It helps me set a total per card for MS and I focus on cards I get the most benefit from. Include annual fees, any spending threshholds (30k for PRG, etc.), etc. For non-MS spending, I just put it on the card that gets the category bonus.

After each statement close I update a progress report for my cards on how my spending is going towards those totals I set.

I agree that UR are worth more than the 1.0 cent minimum, but 1.8 cents IMHO is way too high given the devaluations and the fact that many of us would never pay that much for hotels/flights. For me, the free stopover and the two open jaws are where the value is, not the cabin. Maybe a bit of extra credit since UA notifies flyers of devaluations beforehand. I'm at 1.5 cents for UR, and I think that might be still be a tad too high. I had UR at 1.8 cents prior to Feb 1st.

1.2 cents for US/AA miles during the US share promo was worth it to avoid the MS hassles. But I'd pass if it was offered at 1.5 cents. Especially since US-North Asia in business was silently increased to 110k last week. UR is not convertible to US/AA miles, but they're similar. I'm just giving you an idea of why I value miles so low.

Finally, it's important to get out of the thinking that the vacation is free. It's not. Far from it. Aside from expenses in buying GC and liquidating, you also have to deduct the use of a 2% cashback card plus fees/taxes for booking flights plus miles you would have earned to find out if it is really worth it

Yea, I am in that phase now - trying to figure out where to focus on for the most value. CVS must be tired of me - I know the drill better than the cashiers.

As another data point, I transferred UR points to United yesterday to purchase an Economy ticket for ICT>NRT. I spent 52,500 points on a ticket that I could have booked for $1,680. That's a value of just a hair over 3 cents per point. Now, I got all of these points for cheaper-than-free with the OfficeMax promo a few months ago, but if I had inked all these at Staples, the fees would have cost roughly $265 after VSE savings - 16% of the cost of the fare.

The only time I have used UR points directly instead of transferring was when I needed a ticket from SFO>LAX. With the 20% discount, cheap hoppers like that cost fewer UR than a MileagePlus redemption. Unless you never travel, using UR for straight cash back is wasteful.

You forgot to add the final step.
- Chase shutdown.

Why don't you buy their FAR crap?

Really, how often has that happened?

FAR is great if you have use for the crap, but the biggest problem is that FAR actually costs you sales taxes which pretty much takes away you margins. If you use 5%CB from being a staples reward member plus the 5% from CC minus the 6-9% sales taxes depending on the state still only gives an average margin.

I prefer using a portal to do my Staples inkings.

True dat.

It is much more prevalent that we think. If you look on the Dans Deals forum , there's a huge thread about Chase account closures. I'm not sure if iall the closures are related to MS on the Ink card, but the people there are in the same demographics as us (credit card churning and MS). The shutdowns seem to have started late last year.

I also originally thought that Chase does not care about MS on the Ink card since there is a cap, but apparently, they started caring a lot more. I'm not planning to stop because I need the points, but I will probably refrain from applying to additional Chase cards (I have most of the good ones anyway) and will only earn points that I intend to spend soon, rather than hoarding them.

I normally don't buy VGCs from office supply stores unless there's a special. There are enough per year that I don't want to waste my $50,000 Chase Ink spend limit on the normal deals even though they are also profitable. I find it better to wait for the specials like this week (although limited to how many addresses you have the rebate card mailed to) and the Office Max VGC sale they had in early March. It takes more patience, but I'll maximize my profit/spend ratio.

If you don't know why they were shut down, you can't really blame them on MS. How many here have been shut down for MS? I believe it's less prevalent than you think.

If you read Dansdeals, a lot of the people on the forum are involved with brokering/selling points, which is the easiest way to get a shutdown (transferring to an account that doesn't belong to you or your spouse).

Often you will read posts bragging about how hard they hit the credit card like 3x to 10x, and then after few months no posts from them.... I wonder where they go? Its not easy for them to admit how foolish they were...U have seen tail between the legs. This forum is full of new posters, a revolving door! only few posters I recognize by names.

That's only speculation. Not usable as proof of anything.

I may be missing the best deals. But lately I only see a max of 0.5% cash back from portals for office stores and at Staples thereally is only $100 cards for $6 fee.

Is there a better option online?

Shopathome?

Shopathome is currently 2% only. TCB is 3%. Also if you have luck with Upromise or Discover(using ink card) then they are at 5%.

Last option currently is Swagbucks 6sb/$ but unsure if gc purchases would count through them or not. They are pretty strict with the CB restrictions but may do a test transaction tonight for a $100 Visa.

My bad. I was looking at portal rewards for gift card mall and not staples. Whoops!

So online they are 7% fee ($7 charge per $100 card) at staples.
For absolute cash value (not UR equivalent value), that is 7% in fees against (5% UR + 1% visa savings edge + 3% TCB). Looking at 2% margin, or $20 vs the $25 (2.5%) by going in store.

Pro
free shopping and don't have to drive to staples

Con
Twice as many cards to unload ($100 vs $200) at a Walmart money center machine for BB.

I can not emphasize how much of a con this is :mad:

Twice as many cards is a major con. However 6% at Swagbucks would make it worth it IMO. Will test tonight and report back if visa purchase is tracked.

Using upromise for 5% at statples works great for me. You can buy $100 visa gift card and get 5% cash back. But it takes 2-3 months to get your rebate check.

Just a few weeks ago one of the portals had a limited time offer of 7% cb on purchases on staples.com so I used my ink and loaded up the pesky $100 VGCs. These are the kind of deals you watch for and are worth the effort, but they don't last long.

+1, I think people forget to think about the sales tax...its 7.5% here, which kills any profit margin. I do them occassionally, if I actualy need something they have as a FAR, like paper or batterires.

See, this route poses new problems. Because when a promotion comes along you have to hit it hard in order to maximize earnings on this card. I feel like this is more likely to raise eyebrows over at Chase. You have to factor in availability and restrictions too. Like during the OfficeMax sale, they ran out of the $200/$100 GCs in a matter of hours here in Chicago. And the ones that did have stock were stingy about letting me do multiple transactions. You're right about the patience bit, but I'd really like to know how you're hitting the $50,000 cap without taking advantage of the normal deals.

$4.17k a month at OSS is tough to do without using much GCs or reselling. Unless your office really does need ALOT of supplies.

Or software downloads which don't have tax.

Does Chase get level 3 data? Statement activity is not as detailed as AmEx. AmEx statements print out your entire purchase details (line item for each gift card):

So if it can't be proven, one should act as if it is not true.

Tough life for many using that logic.

Your right, since my strategy works for my area, but may not work for areas like Chicago. I'm blessed with many office supply stores and not as many ms'ers therefore wife and I have good supply of higher valued gift cards. So, when there aren't in store specials my profit would shrink to $16.25 per $1000 in VGCs due to the activation fee and small money order fee when liquidating (this is last resort toward end of year if I hadn't reached the 50,000 spend limit). That's only a 1.62% return, therefore I look for online portal deals then order through portal to Staples. Sometimes a portal will offer 6 or 7%cb and then it makes for nice profit when coupled with Ink.

Except I didn't use that logic. You just took an extreme opposite position and ascribed it to me. Very dishonest of you.

What I am saying is if it cannot be proved, one should not try to use it as proof of anything.

There's no proof of that.

Time for an ignore.

Totally agree!