Moving to LA
 

Hi All,

First post here so if in the wrong section mods feel free to move. A friend suggest we post a few questions here despite it not being an expat forum as such.

There is a large possibilty that we (Wife and I) may need to move to LA for work. We would be coming from Aus (Melbourne specifically) and have only been to LA once before; extensivelly travelled otherwise but not much of the US.

First question is: Is it reasonable to assume we could rent a 2br apartment within 15 - 20 min commute of Beverly Hills for 2k pm?

Heaps of other questions obviously but just want to test the water here

Thanks :)

My brother used to rent a 2 BR in Culver City for $1850/month, which I would consider within 20 minutes of Beverly Hills (depends on exactly where you will be working - but even in peak times there are plenty of side streets to travel). Each area in your radius will have many (most) 2 BRs that go for more than your 2k price, but each one should have some options available. I think a lot will really depend on your expectations of a place (i.e. how modern does it need to be)? A good place to test out the waters is the apartments/housing section of losangeles.craigslist.org. Search 2 BR and then tab to westside/southbay. Ignore the southbay areas, but you can see what is available in West LA at that price and then map on google to start getting a feel for the area?

I recommend investing in a Westside Rentals account when you really start looking. I searched on craigslist for weeks when I needed to rent a house a few years ago. Then got a Westside Rentals account and found a place within days. It costs $60 for 60 days, but most people find places quickly - so you can buy their passwords on craigslist (for sale section) for $20.

I am sure you will get great information here. But would also check out the City Data Los Angeles forum as that is more geared towards moving and relocations.

20min to BH sounds like westwood, maybe brentwood, palms, and possibly around park brea. but i have no idea if they can be had for $2k/month.

ask people who work where you will be working, but be prepared for people telling you they live in calabasas, sherman oaks, pasadena, and other far-flung places.

westside rentals was awesome when i lived there, which was more than 15 years ago. but wait until you're actually in LA to sign up for it, as it gives you lots of listings but you really need to visit each one to pick out what works for you.

welcome to FT!

Yes but you may not like Palms or Culver City, and those are a solid 20 mins. West LA is under some rent control as is Santa Monica but dig around West LA first and the area is very busy.

$2000 a month will get you a nice 1 bedroom or a 2 bedroom in older buildings in slightly less desirable areas (e.g. next to freeways). For 2 bedrooms in nice areas, the rent is more in the range of $2500~$3500.

Beverly Hills has very little apartment rental so you are looking at places like West LA (~$2500), Palms (~$2000), Culver City (~$2000), Rancho Park (~$3000 sometimes referred to as Century City in listings), Westwood (~$2500+) Santa Monica (~$3000+), Brentwood (~$3000+) - all to the west of Beverly Hills.

You may also want to see Marina Del Rey (~$2500) and Playa Vista (~$3000+) which are a little further down the coast but have lots more apartments.

http://www.westsiderentals.com/guest...1&searchType=g

$2,000/month is not really realistic for a 2-bedroom. Several years ago, I was paying that for a 1-bedroom in a not-particularly-great building in Santa Monica. I'd put a decent 2-bedroom in a neighborhood you wouldn't mind living in at $3,000+, minimum.

I live in a far-flung place? I did not know this ... interesting.


I've always been amazed that Beverly Hills, California, is so cut off from the freeway system. This is good and bad. It's bad because you won't be able to use a freeway to commute to work. :( It's good because you won't be able to use a freeway to commute to work. :)

Also note that the light rail system does not extend to Beverly Hills. It supposedly will one day, but that's not scheduled to come to pass until 2023.

Thanks heaps for the replies people.

On of the deciding factors for the move will be lifestyle, as we have a great one here in Melbs. Currently pay 2k pm, 100m from the ocean in a fairly modern large 2br apartment, and it takes 30min door to door to work via public transport.

So by the sounds of it if i want to keep that lifestyle (less being so close to the ocean and commuting instead of public transport) work may have to cough up a bit more than i was expecting.

Another way to think about it is that you're going to have to up your commuting time. Twenty minutes reliably from BH in and out in rush hour isn't very much.

Forty minutes however would allow you to live in lots of nice places for $2,500. And a lot of people in LA wouldn't consider a forty minute commute rough.

Getting used to being utterly car reliant will be a mind shift, though.

Thanks Knife&Fork,

I wouldnt be willing to spend 1.5 hrs a day in traffic, it just seems like such a waste to me. I have had a look on Craiglist and there are a few apartments for around the 2 - 2.5 mark within a couple miles of our office, so i could always walk that.

As i have said, we are in a very comfortable spot here in Melbs so unless i can come close to matching that there isn't much point us moving

You can't come close to matching that.

For working in Beverly Hills, you need to think of places to the west, which unfortunately are more expensive, than the east. The predominant traffic flow is westward in the morning and eastward in the evening, all the way towards the beach as most of the jobs are not downtown. Palms and Culver City, and even Mid City may be within 20 minutes during off peak, but closer to 30 or 40 during peak.

You can match almost anything with the right salary ;)

I have had a look at a few of the sites members have suggested and there are OK looking 2br apartments within a few miles of our office, some even within walking distance, for around the 2.5k pm mark.

Where exactly is your office?

We can give you much better advice on where to rent if you tell us that info. "Beverly Hills" is not a very good description because when you say that to locals, it means the actual city of Beverly Hills, which is mostly residential and retail. There is only a relative small part of Beverly Hills that contains commercial building clustered around Maple Drive. What I'm saying is your place of employment is probably not in Beverly Hills. I'm guessing somewhere in Mid City, Miracle Mile, or perhaps Century City. A few miles in LA will make a huge difference in your commute time and methods.

It is possible to commute by public transit in LA. Many people do it, myself included. Our rail system logs close to 1 million rides a day... But to do it efficiently, it requires that you live and work relatively close to a rail line and/or a high frequency rapid bus line.

It is basically where Burton Way joins S Santa Monica Blvd.

As far as i am aware there is no subway nearby. I'm happy to take public transport if it is easily available and the time is similar, i take public transport to work every day at the moment

Any other advice is appreciated

There is no subway, though there are buses. I would not, however, recommend relying on the LA bus system, both from the standpoint of reliability, comfort and safety.

So that would put you either at City Hall on the west end or San Vicente on the east end. I'd recommend that you take a look at the timetables/maps on www.metro.net

There are several Metro Rapid services that are designed to move people with much fewer stops and you're in a good location as you can avail yourself of the Wilshire Blvd and Santa Monica Blvd lines. They run fairly frequently during regular commute hours

Westside buses are very safe and fairly comfortable. The issue is reliability but that is a problem with car travel as well. All Metro buses are on Nextbus which is a plus, since you can tell with your smartphone if there are additional runs following that full bus (Metro tends to schedule standing loads during the rush hour). From that area neighborhoods near Park La Brea (although NOT Park La Brea itself as the complex has issues) and adjacent to West Hollywood are viable, as is West Los Angeles since they are all one bus rides to the area (the Santa Monica, Beverly Boulevard, and Third Street bus all pass by). On the counterpoint, this makes Culver City and Palms less viable unless you don't mind driving, and some times bicycling during nice weather may also be fine. Palms is only 5-6 km away but that could be 30 minutes if you miss a few traffic light cycles or get stuck in congestion from others trying to get on the freeway.

Thanks for the help guys. I am talking shop with work tomorrow and seeing what salary they are offering so i will have more of an idea then if it is happening as it is unlikely my wife would gain employment over there so they need to make an offer i cant refuse

I'll let you know what happens

The good news is the office location is right off a major street that has frequent bus service (every 5 minutes during rush hour). The 704 bus runs on Santa Monica Blvd from Downtown LA to West LA (Sepulveda Blvd) all day and everyday so if you live within a few miles of the office and within walking distance to Santa Monica Blvd, commute by bus is entirely possible and probably just as fast as driving. If you are interested in using the bus (or bike, which is also feasible), focus your apartment search in Westwood, West LA, and Rancho Park, with an eye towards being in walking distance to Santa Monica Blvd: The area roughly bounded by Sepulveda Blvd (West), Avenue of The Stars (East), Ohio Ave (North), and Olympic Blvd (South). I used to live and still work in this area so I know it very well... there are plenty of apartments and condos along Santa Monica Blvd.

If you don't mind driving, you can expand the search area to beyond this area to the north (to Wilshire Blvd), south (Marina), and west (to the ocean).

See this map: http://goo.gl/maps/h1xkY

The map is based on your requirements:

1. Within 20 minutes commute (either by car or by transit)
2. Close to the ocean
3. Rent around $2500 (a bit low but possible)

There are pockets in that map that are out of your price range (e.g. right next to the ocean, Santa Monica north of Montana Ave etc) but you can probably find something reasonable under $3000 if you look around.

Thanks very much bzcat, very informative

OK so it looks as though work is happy to come to the table offering an umbrella package while i build up my clients in the US.

My next question is; would the following be a comfortable lifestyle in the area i am looking at? And what have i missed?

Budget (monthly):
Rent 2.5k
Bills 500 (utilities, cable, fuel etc)
Food 800 (we eat in and cook a lot, probably 6 nights a week)
Spending 2k (1k each)
Savings 1k
Holidays 700

Total 7.5k pm after tax

If i used the online calculators correctly then i would need to be 135k pa. Am i missing anything from these rough estimations?

Thanks all

In your monthly bills of $500, are you including all transportation costs? I see you have "fuel" in there but there's the cost of your vehicle itself, insurance, maintenance and fuel. Even if you took the bus to work (as had been discussed above), it sounds like you're still planning on having a vehicle available?

We would buy a car outright (no loan) so would just need running costs. What is insurance/rego costs normally on a cheap car in LA?

Here in Aus that amount of bills can cover everything to do with our car and utilities. Based on driving the car about 5-10k kms per year and a fuel price of 1.5AUD per litre (not sure on metric conversions sorry)

For budgeting purposes count on about $100 a month for insurance and registration. It will probably be less but you have no United States driving record which will drive up the cost. Car registration is pretty cheap, about $50-100 a year for a relatively recent vehicle.

Thanks Calwatch,

Does the rest of that budget look OK to you? I know discretionary spend will vary but how about the rest?

That's way too low an estimate for insurance premiums for someone living on the west side of Los Angeles with no prior US driving history. My premiums dropped by ~40% when I moved from West Los Angeles (Wilshire and Bundy) to the San Fernando Valley and I pay that much to insure our primary car (Toyota Camry Hybrid) being experienced drivers with clean driving records.

You also underestimate car registration fees by a factor of at least 50%. We pay $100 a year for our 15 years old extra vehicle. It is substantially higher for our newer cars (2009 & 2011).

I agree with TWA. Westside of Los Angeles is generally considered a more expensive area to insure cars. Reasoning is rates are geographically rated and in areas with heavy street traffic density and freeways running through them, more accidents are reported. Also average losses are higher in those upscale zones, as more people are driving BMW's then Toyotas.

The lack of American driving experience is definitely a factor in your pricing. You may get some minor credit for having twenty years driving history in OZ, but the equivalency may put you on par with an American 21 year-old.

Playing it safe, estimate $2,000 annually for insurance for a $30,000 car in year one. Auto registration rates are statutorially set at .67% of valuation, plus about $48 in fixed fees. So a $30,000 car would run about $248. Each year the DMV depreciates the value 10%. So your second year with that car it would be about $20 less.

One other budget issue to consider is if you buy a car, sales tax will raise the price 9% (unless you lease it, and then you are only paying 9% tax on the monthly interest and depreciation factors). The tax is due whether you buy a new or used car.

Also agree insurance is way too low. I live in OC and my insurance is $221/month with a 5+ year safe driver discount. I drive an "entry level" BMW 3-series which is about 3 years old, but I can't imagine that making that much of a difference in premium over $100, especially considering the fact I live in the 'burbs. My car registration is approximately $400 as well.

As for the rest of the budget:

Food looks do-able. Bills might be a little low if you have gas for commuting - it currently costs me about $60/tank for gas.

Remember to factor in $$ for health insurance premiums if you will be living in the states. I believe that Australia has some sort of medicare/universal coverage. Depending on your company, this fluctuates quite a bit - I pay $100/month for myself but have seen family coverages costing as much as $400/month at previous employers.

$135k annual cost of living is pretty accurate for this area. This will let you live comfortably in the area on the map I showed you. If your income is below $135k, you may have to live elsewhere with lower rent and force to commute longer distances. You can probably get by with $90~100k but you have to skim on something.

Bills - If you live in an apartment, some utility may be included... something you should ask before renting. In West LA and a modest size 2 bedroom apartment, you should expect to pay about $100 for electricity and water, $100 for internet and cable TV, $30 for trash pickup, and $10 for natural gas. When you look for an apartment, make sure it has natural gas hook up that way you can run your stove/oven, heater, and dryer on gas, which is very cheap, compare to electric stove/oven, heater, and dryer, which will bleed you dry. Some of these utility costs are included in your rent so make sure you ask for exactly what is included.

Fuel - I separated this from bills because it is highly variable. Are you going to have 1 car or 2 cars? What kind of car? Will you try to take public transit? etc. If you live in the target area on the map I showed you, the fuel cost will be fairly low. You will drive about 15 miles per day and with gasoline at $4 per gallon, at the most so you are looking at about $70 a month for each car, assuming you get something fairly normal and fuel efficient.

Food - Eating out on the West side is on the expensive side but if you are coming from Australia, you will find the prices to be very cheap due to exchange rate :D $800 should be enough as long as you are not eating at fancy places every meal.

Spending - I'm not sure what you are including in this category but I assume you gave yourselves $1000 a month to splurge on clothes, entertainment, and $5 coffee. That's pretty reasonable for lifestyles in West LA area.

What you are missing - A list of things to consider:

- Health insurance: We don't have national healthcare program. Does your employer plan on providing you with insurance, and more importantly, your spouse/family? You are now required to obtain health insurance if your employer don't provide it so you need to budget about $1500 a month per person for this.

- Car insurance: My wife and I both have perfect driving records and I pay $160 a month for 2 cars (I have 2 semi-expensive German cars). If you have a smaller car (e.g. Ford Focus or Honda Civic), it will be less but not by very much. The insurance rate is largely related to driver risks and not the type of car. Since you have no driving record in the US, be prepared to pay at least double my rate.

- Renter insurance: I would highly recommend you get insurance for your place that covers everything inside the apartment. You are looking at about $500 a year.

- Car registration: California is kind of expensive to keep a car. The rough estimate is $100 per year for $10,000 value of your car. So if you buy a $35,000 car, expect to pay about $350 in the first year (the value decline as your car depreciates every year). You can buy a new compact car (e.g. Ford Focus) for about $20k. Midsize car (e.g. Honda Accord) will run about $25k. Or you can buy used... our cars don't rust since it doesn't rain here :D

- Taxes: You have to pay Federal income tax and California State income tax. Also, your paycheck will have automatic withholding for social security (kind of like your Superannuation - I'm from New Zealand so I know all about it...), medicare (retirement medical care program), and SDI (state disability insurance). I don't know how much your taxes will be but you should ask your employer to estimate it for you. Ask for net paycheck after taxes, FICA (social security and medicare), and SDI.

Childcare: No kids? Otherwise nanny is $15 an hour and license childcare center is about $2,000 a month in this area.

"Start-up" cost: None of your household electronics (kitchen appliances etc) will work here because we use 110v instead of 240v so don't bother. The TV system is different so you have to buy new ones. If you want to bring furniture, keep in mind that everything here goes by inches not cm... you will not be able to find sheets that fit your Australian bed for example.

OT - mattresses aren't even standardized in this world we inhabit? What a mess...I never knew that...

Thanks heaps mate, amazing info yet again.

Health Insurance is something we had considered but had no idea about the cost. Work will pay for part of it i'm guessing but 3k per couple pm is insane! :eek: That's like an average wage per annum. I thought i saw something on a different forum where an expat had insurance for a couple for about 1k pa, but maybe that was pm. If we are going to have to pay 30k worth of health insurance that will probably be a deal breaker for us.

Car Insurance/Rego; we were planning on spending less than 10k on one used car, similar to what we have here in Aus price wise, but i asusme that will get us somehting slightly better over there. We aren't big car people so as long as it is reliable that all that matters. I'll budget $200 pm for all car costs

Rental insurance - good idea.

Tax - yes i am going to tell work what i need to make after tax and then they can work it out from there.

No kids

Start-up costs - Was hoping to get everything for a basic 2br set-up for 5k. Is that unrealisitc?

Ok, on health insurance, $1500 per person is assuming you have to go get insurance on your own and pay 100% of it (e.g. for self-employed person) and you are getting a comprehensive and low deductible policy. You can get a high deductible insurance (say you pay the first $5000 out of pocket), and your premium may be down to $500 a month.

Usually, your employer will pay for most of your insurance (like 80%), and you are in a large insured group (e.g. all the employees in your company) so the cost will be substantially less than the individual policy. If your employer pays for most of the cost (fairly standard practice), then $100~200 a month for both of you would be about average depending on coverage (e.g. does it include dental? deductible amounts, is it HMO or PPO etc). They will take your portion of the insurance from you paycheck so you won't even have to worry about it. So don't panic... find out if your employer will cover both you and your spouse.


$10k used car is plentiful so don't worry. And yes, car prices are cheaper here so you can probably buy the same car you have in Australia for less money in California.

$5k will get you started with furniture and household items if you shop at IKEA. If you want nicer stuff, it will probably cost a little more.

Thanks mate,

I know work does have an insurance plan, what and how much i'm not sure so will have to find that out. Again i guess that they will have to factor that in when i tell them what i want to receive in my hand each month.

I had a quick look at a couple online calculators and there are a few policies around the 6k pa mark for a couple our age.

Can i ask what you are doing over there and how long you have been there?
Really appreciate your help, if we do go through with the move i owe you a few beers when we get there :)

I moved to LA when I was a teenager with my family so a looooong time ago... lol

Good luck with your move. With the exchange rate being the way it is, you will find most things are cheaper here (except for health insurance!). It wasn't like this 10 years ago when the US$ was bigger than the AUS$. Now I feel poor whenever I visit Australia.

Yeh Aus is now the most expensive country in the World by most standards and experiences. I'm hoping a few years of USD savings followed by an AUD crash will help bump up our assets :)

So work is now saying there may be a strong chance that i would be based out of our Woodland Hills office (Ventura Blvd) :(

Would anyone be able to offer some advice for decent areas around there still within a 20-30 min commute (or public transport preferrably)? Encino maybe?

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Warner Center in Woodland Hills has many upscale apartment complexes. I suggest expanding your search to include Sherman Oaks and Calabasas.

Rents in thewest Valley are considerably lower than in the west side and traffic is much better.

I'll post more when I'm not on my phone.

Here is a map that features many of the apartment complexes in Warner Center. Warner Ranch Park is home of the Valley Cultural Center, which features free concerts on Sunday evenings in the summers.

Here's a visitors' guide to the San Fernando Valley.

Woodland Hills is half an hour to Malibu Beach via Topanga Canyon.

Downtown is easily accessible via the Orange Line connecting to the Red Line in Universal City and the west side is less than 20 miles away via the 101 and 405 freeways.

You'll be very close to the Santa Monica Mountains National Recreation Area - National Park.

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Warner Center in Woodland Hills has many upscale apartment complexes. I suggest expanding your search to include Sherman Oaks and Calabasas.

Rents in thewest Valley are considerably lower than in the west side and traffic is much better.

I'll post more when I'm not on my phone.