newbie help ... ?
 

Help!



I have some basic newbie (some would say downright stupid!) fundamental questions about redeeming miles/points – but no

forum header here seems to scream THIS IS THE PLACE. Can anyone / someone point me at the right forum? Then I’ll post some

(really uneducated) questions! Thanks!



(This is not aimed at one particular airline or points program, and I have googled these questions until my eyes crossed. I surrender!)

You are in the right place. Have a read here https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/info...forum-684.html but it seems that this is the right place for your questions (that you say are not related to one particular airline).

Go ahead and ask, that’s what this thread is for. And if there is a better place or the answers are elsewhere, a member will certainly point you in the right direction.

OK, fair enough - I read the link above (and its follow-up links) so I think we're good to go:

1. Many "experts" say something like, "Find the award on ABCAirline, then call XYZAirline and get the seat." I am not following this at all. (Assume I have a ton of XYZ miles.) What do you mean, "find the award?" Are you saying, if I go to ABCAirline, and there is an award seat AT ANY NUMBER OF MILES - this simply proves it exists, it's been allocated as a freebie, something like that? Then - I'm going to - literally - use my phone, call XYZ Airlines, and say, "Hola! I was just on ABC website, and they do show one award seat available, but at an extortionate rate - so I'd like to just book it with you, since your chart is much less, even though your own website does not show this seat at all."

And this works? I feel foolish. I feel like if an airline shows an award of 450,000 miles (not an exaggeration) - than it's just silly to call their partner and say, Give it to me for 85,000. Cuz the chart. And yet - this is what I believe the bloggers are saying, and is in fact, exactly how it's done. Am I missing something?

2. Scenario #2 - "experts" use one airline’s site to hunt for a partner's seats - specifically, I'm talking about finding Domestic USA roundtrip tickets but booking them through a non-domestic partner, because it’s less money or miles. Many bloggers say this is possible - but I have little to no luck with this - it almost always throws an error, “no such flight, pick another destination…”. Does this mean I am fundamentally trying to accomplish the wrong thing - or just that not all flights are shown, and keep trying, maybe i'll get lucky some day?

3. Last one for now - and the easiest - When searching for international awards on a partner airline website – that originate in the US – why can’t I ever get anything from my “local” airport? The alliances all have domestic US partners – so why don’t they just tack that initial leg on to the front of the trip? Instead – I almost always get a “no such flight.” I mean, why show it on your drop-down list if I can’t use it? Not just for awards – I mean, ever. What is the work around for this? (Yes, a few attempts have worked out…but, mostly – no.) Do all of you just live in NY and LA and Chicago?

I see folks say something like, “I got a great redemption from JFK, and JFK’s just $100R/T for me to pre-position, so I took it…” - What??! You gambled – perhaps 300K or 400K or 500K miles – that your $100 plane the day before wasn’t delayed? Cancelled? Snow Storm? Fog? You get the idea – this plan seems hugely irresponsible to me, and I feel like I’m missing something fundamental.

I know these questions must seem elementary to the experts.

Very brief background if you need it - I've been traveling for many years, gathering miles, and have used awards (perhaps poorly!) to travel domestically and internationally. I’m good with the basics. I just need the pragmatic truth right now to take it to the next level. Appreciate any help anyone can provide,– thanks for the excellent forum.)

OK, I am not an expert, but here's how your scenario #1 has worked for me. I am interested in an award on Cathay Pacific, LAX-HKG-LAX, using AA miles. The AA web site does not show Cathay Pacific award flights, even though they are a partner. Fortunately, the BA web site does show Cathay Pacific awards. So I do my research and find desirable flights on the BA web site, then call AA to book the awards. In this case, the BA site is showing awards that are also available on AA; presumably the awards that Cathay Pacific makes available to its partners are the same for all partners.

I think the problem that you are having with #3 is that U.S. domestic awards are scarce. So suppose that you want to fly to HKG and are in Des Moines. Even though there is a partner flight LAX-HKG available, there may be no Des Moines - LAX award flight. So you just have to make it to LAX on your own if you want to use the international award. If you feel there is too much of a risk to do this, then you're out of luck. I would not hesitate to do this when flying into the gateway city the day before for the outgoing flight.

jbecket, thanks - makes sense so far! to be clear then - you called AA - and used their agent - to book a Cathy Pacific airplane? (I realize they're partners - but I'm also assuming the AA agent has their paycheck signed by AA, not Cathay, so maybe it's not always smooth sailing...)

question - in your case - doesn't the Cathay Pacific website show their own awards? Why was the BA step necessary?

The awards an airline/FFP makes available to their own members are frequently different than the awards available to partners. In some cases different partners have access to different inventory, but often if an award is available to Partner A within an alliance, it will also be available to Partner B.

Yes, you call AA to book AND purchase the Cathay flight on Cathay metal (their airplane) and yes, the AA agent is paid by AA.


1. If you have AA miles to spend, you MUST go through AA to book your flights. You are using AA "money" to buy the flights based on AA's award program. It is AA that determines how much AA money it will cost to purchase the flights, even though the flights are on a different airline.

2. To continue with this example, you need to see if the Cathay award flights are available for purchase using AA currency. One way to do this would be to access aa.com to look for the flights on Cathay. The problem is that AA's website does not currently have the ability to show Cathay award flights.

One way to get around this would be to call AA and ask if they can find award seats. Another way around it is to go to BA's website because it does have the abilty to show Cathay award flights. BUT, you must then call AA because you are using AA's currency AND AA's award chart. It doesn't matter how many points/miles BA would charge for the flights. You don't have BA money. Same with going to Cathay's website. You can look to see if they have award flights available, but still have to call AA to make the purchase if you're using AA miles/money/currency.

This is a bit simplified and there are execptions to what I wrote. Keep it simple for now.

[ETA: AA.com does show CX availability now so the work around isn't necessary for Cathay. The workaround is still a step for airline awards not shown on aa.com.]

Excellent, thank you all very much. Although I get looking at BA because AA doesn't show Cathay flights...surely Cathay shows Cathay flights? (Award flights, I mean...) Or is that just not always true?

To expand on the previous answers: the Cathay site will show awards that can be purchased with Cathay miles; the BA site will show awards that are available for Avios and these will likely be different - both the availability and the "price". The chances are that these will also be available from AA at yet another "price".

What is not clear?

Thanks everybody, excellent info - I think you're all saying what I suspected, but without someone here holding my hand, I was somewhat suspicious of the overall scheme.

Question: Whose "price" am I paying? Say BA showed this as 50K miles, but AA uses 60K for that distance, and Cathay uses 70K (facetious, obviously)? I assume it goes to 60K / the airline with which you actually have the miles...?

This leads to a follow-up - what if there is no chart, a'la Delta? So if I find an Air France flight (award) on, say, KLM's website, then I call Delta to redeem my miles...how many "miles" will Delta charge me?

Yes, CX will show CX award flights. Award flights available using CX "currency". That is not necessarily the same availability that is offered to those paying with "other currencies" (Avios or AA miles or whatever) .SO..you must find availability with YOUR "currency" Since the AA site doesn't show CX, you can try to check this "Partner availability" on BA.... I hope I haven't made this worse...lol

:confused:

I just searched aa.com for award travel between JFK and HKG in late January, and two CX nonstops came up. I've seen CX award availability on aa.com since September.

I hope that is now across the board... (Excuse me while I go to AA.com lol)