Finnair baggage on separate tickets after June 1, 2016 OW decision!?
 

So at the check in today I asked about AYs policy now that OW weakened itself :D

CI agent at the platinum desk ask AY to AY on separate tickets was OK but nothing else!

Big thumbs down but still better then ba's stance...

AA seemingly still allows baggage on separate tickets for now atleast...

This really sucks for e.g. AY->CX/KA connections (I am cheap, so often slap on a cheap Y ticket for the HKG-xxx leg)

What is the current policy for OW and AY? In April booked two tickets with AA since AA's booking system seems to choose the most expensive leg and apply it for the whole itinerary, which makes a trip with many legs VERY expensive ($4000 USD difference). The CI agent just merged my itineraries and the bags went all the way to final destination.

I've been thinking of doing the same with NRT-HEL-STO since NRT-STO can be very expensive sometimes, but booking NRT-HEL and HEL-STO is cheaper.

Kauppias, what is this OW weakening you are talking about?

On Finnair webapages, Q&A section, it still says separate ticket on oneworld flight is OK:

I believe he is talking about this.

OMG. They are really out to make travel less conveinient, for no apparent reason.

Indeed. Its gotten much more attention in the ba and AA forums...

But bad news for those who either have to or choose to buy 2 separate tickets... Now there is NO reason to buy a same alliance conneting flight (well star alliance still through checks) I was hoping AY would JOIN AA in taking the high road but instead it seems like AY took the middle road :) they atleast through check on AY to AY itinearies while ba wont do even that :)

Indeed... It has ba's stench all over it :D they must have been loosing too much money on Ex Eu itinearies?

This makes my life within OW very difficult :( so I either have to book ALL AA or AY-AY mixes :) ba gets cut totally now... Or just fly SAS. 😱😱😱😱

They are either out to collect more overweight/extra baggage fees along the way or they believe this will drive more tickets to be purchased with the main airline alone.
As mentioned in the other thread many times that is just not possible many times.


In my case, I have had som issues even on one ticket so if anything this is likely to make me go with ME3. Why take a 2 connection trip to Australasia on 2 different OW carriers (where they have a lot of opportunities to crap things up) when I can take a 1 connection ME3 flight on one singular airline?

I personally beleive this will drive more money AWAY from oneworld then TO them...

Before I obviously booked a oneworld feeder even when significantly more expensive... Now I will choos the cheapest/best miles accumulatibg ticket since I have to hassle with the bag anyways...

What makes me angry is that they do not seem to be honoring rules in effect when booking making this a huge hassle to allready booked trips!

Someone found a useful page explaining the situation... link

Protection on flight disruptions on two separate PNR:s has not been great even up to date.

It looks like a change made in panic - some airlines must have pushed for this for some reason. Perhaps there have been a lot of trouble with interlined luggage out of control when the flight on ticket no2 is mis-connect.

Anyway, what it will do is drive even more bags into the cabin instead of checkin. That situation is already out of control on some airlines who have pushed the light fares too far (BA).

Exactly. People will now have to try and cram everything into a cabin bag, which will result in overcrowding in the overhead lockers.
I for one have a two hour connection in BKK on separate tickets coming up, and will have no choice now with this new policy. I will now use *A for future bookings.

I have a 2 PNR trip coming up where I have SFO-LHR-HEL (BA+AY) and HEL-OUL (AY) on separate PNRs. 1 hour connection at HEL so not even slightest chance to get bags out and re-check them. Things can get interesting...

This change really sucks for me too. Finnair's pricing To/from Taiwan is stupid so now will have to get bags both ways in Hong Kong (though in HKG i've been able to have transit desk re-tag bags without going thru immigration.

as for why, I do believe at least one point is this making it easier to build automated baggage check in systems.

Oh no, I have somewhat similar 2PNR setup with 1h connection time in HEL, both AY legs and I wonder what if incoming late and missing connecting PNR, will AY honor a change / reroute then...

Thanks OP for the headsup even if this thing sucks:td:

Yes, TPE is one of my destinations that is hand-luggage only from now on. BR is back in the picture - hello Kitty! :) So are my connections to China making use of the 72-hrs visa-free travel (I often do HEL-Asia-China-HEL 72-hrs trips)

Like I said in the OP the AY CI lady stated that AY to AY luggage would transfer even on separate PNRs unlike ba who wont even do that on ba to ba itinearies. But if you have a pure AY only... Partner airline check in wont work most likely...

I was not worried about luggage as I never check-in any, but rather worried about missing a connecting PNR flight what will happen (non-refund, non-flex cheapo Y), even if both are AY carrier...

Has AY ever offered such protections?

I know AA did and does but I was not aware AY did!?

When coming from the USA I allways have 2-4 32kg bags :)

Used to have similar "setup" in the good old times when 1€ was worth ~1.5$, but not anymore...

I can still buy alot of kids clothes and fun stuff for the 400€ limit 😂😂😂 makes the trips more worthwhile 😃 Hoping the dollar will return some day 😃😇

Well I don't know if they do (not obliged to do), actually more interested in how they handle the situation if they offer "soft perk change/reroute" as courtesy in that regard once it is AY all the way...

While on the bag thing and USA, last time when we came from NYC the lady at check-in desk asked us "where are your bags?" since we did not have any bags to check in. "only carry-on, we don't have any bags to check in" where she responded "really, are you kidding?". "No, no bags". "Ah, ok, just thinking, usually on this flight people check in tons of bags" :D

What does "no through check-in" mean?

According to CX document through check-in "includes BPs, baggage to final destination and regulatory checks" and to me this have a big impact.
So they will now refuse to check you in and produce onwards BP? (not that it works all the time as is)

Also, they will not allow airside transits since the "regulatory check" is limited to the first ticket, ie they will not evaluate your visa status in your final destination but only your visa status at transfer points?

Now I see where the "this flight is going to India, so therefore you need Indian visa" is coming from.

:td:

Thinking this from AY business point of view, this probably affects only a handful of AY customers and destinations, but very probably those customers that travel alot, and not with the cheapest tickets. Not only it makes transfers very much more time consuming and far less convenient, but also erases the support on missed connections, increasing transfer time needed significantly. And thus making AY, and oneworld less interesting.

• HEL: prob very few customers connecting to another oneworld carrier but AY, except passengers connecting from domestic flights to BA/AB/JL/QR
• LHR: might affect some passengers that have found better fares from LHR onwards, but prob majority are travelling with one ticket all the way through LHR. If travelling with separate tickets at least connecting with BA it would be only one way benefit having baggage checked through, as BA is not anymore supporting even BA/BA connections
• TXL/DUS: AB is having some attractive prices onwards, but if price is the factor why fly (usually more expensive) AY on separate ticket for the connection?
• US: one has to clear customs in any case on arrival
• China: very few oneworld onward connections, so no major effect
• HKG: major issue, as CX offers very good connections, and AY booking engine is quite bad in offering those on same ticket. Luckily HKG is not the worst airport to go re-check-in your bags, but in any case it takes some time and increases hazzle. From AY point of view this can lead in selecting CX all the way through from HEL to the final destination instead of flying AY direct to HKG and transfering there to CX, to avoid all the hazzle in re-checking the baggage
• BKK: some good oneworld connections and as AY booking engine is very poor in supporting onward journey with those, it is very tempting to choose separate tickets (or actually in many cases the only alternative if not using some good TA). Bearing in mind the zoo BKK usually is, it makes connecting far more difficult and time consuming
• SIN: some good oneworld connections, but prob less passengers travelling on separate tickets than at BKK, and much smoother immigration
• Japan: Prob no major effect

As a whole this is very unfortunate development and from customer point of view makes connecting on oneworld far less interesting. I just don't understand how oneworld sees this kind of "enhancements" improve customer experience that is one major issue of alliances to the customers. At least I would rather wait my connecting flight in the lounge instead of immigration queue twice at some busy airport. From AY point of view this cannot be a major issue affecting only a handful of customers, but from the point of view of that handful of customer it can be a major issue in selecting the routing, as far as AY is not serving all major destinations, so I just wonder why they have selected to change the current policy, as continuing former oneworld policy (checking-in and baggage checked all the way to the final destination) would be a competitive advantage for them.

"Airline designed for you" and "Peace of mind"... Have they forgotten these at AY when making this decision?

Just my 3cents...

I think that for JP there are many a domestic connection that is affected, though (IIRC) you clear customs at your port of entry anyway. BTW Japan is a good stop over point for down under, exactly midway to SYD (9 hrs both legs) nice overnight flight on QF - only issue is to find a good price :)

SIN is a PITA if continuing on MH or QF - I'd even say even more than BKK

It is very unlikely that AY will protect you. You would have to buy a new ticket in case of a misconnect.
The connecting flight desk at HEL will most likely send you to the ticket desk (landside). Those ladies won't override system rules for you.

Update: AY confirms it will adopt Oneworld's new "one PNR good, two PNRs bad" system for through-checked luggage and in-advance boarding passes for connecting flights.

Details: Oneworld airlines revise baggage policy for connecting flights

The old policy can still be found in Finnair Easy?! Anyone with proper access who can check?


Finnair Easy = Information and news portal for Travel agents

Attaching old policy, probably not valid anymore.

Is it possible this is driven by EC 261? I read last week EC clarifies that for a connecting flight, a compensation must be given if you miss the second flight due to late arrival of the first flight.

Say you fly LAX-LHR-HEL on two separate PNRs (AA/AY) and your flight is late by 3 hr.
1) If they check you through and say you miss your LHR-HEL connection (say it's the last flight of the day) then you're entitled to compensation, correct?
2) If they don't check you through, i believe you're not entitled for compensation on the first flight since it is less than 4 hr while for the second flight, it's your own fault since you didn't arrive at the gate on time.

On a single PNR presumably airlines have an agreement as to how to split the compensation cost. On two separate PNRs with two different OW airlines, who's at fault - AA for being late (but not 'late' within EC261 definition) or AY for offloading the passenger who didn't show up? The passenger presumably doesn't care who's at fault. From the airlines' perspective it does matter since two separate PNRs means each airline keeps the revenue themselves ...

As of now AA will still check you through on separate PNRs only because DL does. As long as DL does, so will AA ... :D

I dont think EU 261 would apply if on 2 separate bookings if you were late to final destination of Ticket number 1 by less then the EU261 limit even if you missed onward connection of ticket two.... But someone wiser could correct me if Im wrong...

But in AYs case its not like they pay out EU261 claims anyway :D

@kauppias - You are correct. There is no EU compensation as it would be two PNRs - has nothing to do with what happens to the baggage.

However there may have been some kind of issue regarding which airline pays for late/lost luggage when it was separate PNRs.


Overall a horrible policy change that will move a lot of my business to Star Alliance or CX (just because HK is my main intercontinental destination).

My main issue is often with customs at transit points. Setting aside the obvious issue of not open check-in desks at certain connection points where OW is not a big carrier - and I really do not enjoy sitting around for 5 hrs landside with luggage that cannot be dropped off.

Indeed...

Of the changes of late none have been good :(

I will have to see how things develop...

SK has some intresting options now but it is hard to just leave OW but hopefully OW options will become better soon :) so far this is the earliest I have requalified for OWE and OWS this year and star gold in the bag for 2 years so I am in a fairly stressless situation for once 😂😂😂

With some recent Twitter conversations the message mostly seems still to be that AY -> AY on separate PNRs would be ok, but others not.

This is what the AY check in staff are saying as well.

Well, I don't have much hope since even AY->AY on one ticket is problematic on some cases. Checking in bags in Australasia, where first segment is AY codeshare on QF or similar means bags are only checked to HEL. They simply can't make bags go to final destination and most of the tie can't make boarding passes either.

The latest Finnair Plus changes were pretty much overall decent.

But yeah this OW thing is completely ridiculous and for baggage it makes them the worst alliance (having gone from the best).

I have at least one top status in each alliance, so status is no issue for me in any case. I can choose whichever carrier that suits my needs - but I prefer OW on longhaul for prices, products and IRROPS handling.

Indeed they did...

Luggage is a huge perk for me :)

Right now fast track security at HEL is better for me with Star alliance then OW as only AY coded flights get Fast track as OWE. I too hold status in All alliances as well as some non alliance cards, some alliances I am double or triple carded 😂😀

This is a ever changing game one has to keep a close eye on it :)

There has been quite a bit discussion on how a creative TA can merge more than one TICKET onto a (sometimes pre-existing) PNR.

As well I wonder how multiple legs on the One World Explorer tickets will be handled since that is on a single PNR.

Interesting times.

Happy wandering

Fred

My point in the OP was that not even a Finnair sold ticket, on one PNR and one single e-ticket where there is a finnair codeshare ex-Australasia can be through-checked. If this is a fail of Finnair or a fail of OW staff or systems in MEL/SYD/AKL I don't know. But I know they sometimes refer me to HKG transfer desk to sort it out, since they simple cannot make it work.



Well, they can but Finnair did state in their (now probably defunct) through check-in policy:


If they are on one ticket number they should work. But how about the single continent fares and the Yokoso Japan fare and the... I.e. all of the oneWorld fares that requires a oneWorld flight to be ticketed before they can be booked. None of these ticket will ever be on one ticket number.
As far as the published texts goes, these products will no longer be through-checked. Utter fail.