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After today's suicidal-homicidal bomber attacked in the Sultanahmet tourist section of Istanbul killed and wounded tourists and others, questions about the security situation when visiting Turkey do arise. Unfortunately, the risk assessment would be that the risks have been greater in the last several months than they were even at this time last year.
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Originally Posted by GUWonder
(Post 26004802)
After today's suicidal-homicidal bomber attacked in the Sultanahmet tourist section of Istanbul killed and wounded tourists and others, questions about the security situation when visiting Turkey do arise. Unfortunately, the risk assessment would be that the risks have been greater in the last several months than they were even at this time last year.
That said, even though I visited Istanbul as recently as a year ago and enjoyed it (as always), I wouldn't be looking to go back anytime soon. Several reasons. First, my family got on the TSA SSSS security watch list because of our last visit (see Flyertalk thread). No fun. Second, I don't like the direction the Turkish gov't is taking and I'm happy to vote with my feet (I'm not rushing to return to Russia, either). Third, the security situation would definitely be on my mind during a visit, and who wants that tension while on vacation. Of course with the latest tourist bombing, there are many tourists who will probably see things similarly, so Istanbul will be uncrowded and hotel/airline prices will be low. Contrarians might enjoy a visit this Spring. |
Originally Posted by iahphx
(Post 26004861)
Contrarians might enjoy a visit this Spring.
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I live in Istanbul as an Ex Pat, it is a minor concern but after attacks in Paris and other major cities I don't feel the risk here is greater than any other major city. The Turkish police are efficient for the most part.
More afraid of Turkish domus and taxi drivers... |
I have award tickets booked to Istanbul for late May with onward travel to Greece. I've been to Istanbul before so it's not like I absolutely have to go there.
I'm traveling with my girlfriend who is a not nearly as seasoned a traveler as me and if I change my itinerary, it would be more for her benefit/peace of mind. I'm going to think about it for a week or two before I do anything. |
Stressing a bit as I have a 2 night stop in Turkey on the way to SA coming up in just over 2 weeks. Hotel booked is about 400 meters from the bombing site. It makes me nervous, but then again, there have been just as many attacks in other western european cities.
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Originally Posted by Worcester
(Post 26005316)
I live in Istanbul as an Ex Pat, it is a minor concern but after attacks in Paris and other major cities I don't feel the risk here is greater than any other major city. The Turkish police are efficient for the most part.
More afraid of Turkish domus and taxi drivers... No matter how relatively efficient the Turkish police may be, Turkey is in a hotspot situation/location given the domestic and regional/crossroad dynamics. Would I still visit Istanbul as a tourist this month or next month? Yes, if the weather weren't so lousy; but I would also expect a lot of people get turned off going this year in case a Paris or Bombay style attack hits Istanbul. |
Originally Posted by GUWonder
(Post 26006637)
I would also expect a lot of people get turned off going this year in case a Paris or Bombay style attack hits Istanbul.
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Originally Posted by Worcester
(Post 26005316)
I live in Istanbul as an Ex Pat, it is a minor concern but after attacks in Paris and other major cities I don't feel the risk here is greater than any other major city. The Turkish police are efficient for the most part.
More afraid of Turkish domus and taxi drivers... Airside bomb attack at SAW, and what we saw was official denial of security issues. |
Originally Posted by arlflyer
(Post 26006691)
I understand that you're speaking for "people" rather than yourself, and it's a true statement because "people" aren't necessarily rational, but I'm just curious - aside from outright conflict zones, is there a contemporary example of "lightning striking twice" of this sort? I'm struggling to think of one. Personally I'm the sort of "contrarian" that a previous poster mentioned - once the magnifying glass and spotlight have been placed, I feel safer actually.
But there are situations where one attack may mark the beginning of a series of related attacks that happen in a tighter time FRA, and more directly related way than that. Some would say that Turkey has managed to rather extensively stir more than one nest of hornets within the past twelve months, and thus "lightning striking twice" may be way more likely now than during some prior periods. |
Very true - agreed that they haven't made many friends lately. I also suppose that my caveat of Turkey not being in a "conflict zone" may also be subject to debate. It will certainly be interesting to see how things play out for the country in the coming years.
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The whole Middle East is a huge mess again unfortunately, you can never predict what crisis may suddenly erupt in any country there, which is tricky in making travel plans several months out.
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Originally Posted by Worcester
(Post 26005316)
I live in Istanbul as an Ex Pat, it is a minor concern but after attacks in Paris and other major cities I don't feel the risk here is greater than any other major city. The Turkish police are efficient for the most part.
More afraid of Turkish domus and taxi drivers... That said, based on what we know today, I don't think anyone needs to cancel a trip to IST. The odds are still very, very low that you'd be a victim. The major risk is to your peace of mind.
Originally Posted by MileageAddict
(Post 26005754)
I have award tickets booked to Istanbul for late May with onward travel to Greece. I've been to Istanbul before so it's not like I absolutely have to go there.
I'm traveling with my girlfriend who is a not nearly as seasoned a traveler as me and if I change my itinerary, it would be more for her benefit/peace of mind. I'm going to think about it for a week or two before I do anything.
Originally Posted by GUWonder
(Post 26006929)
I know people who were in a WTC tower when a van/truck bomb was used and when 9/11 happened.
But there are situations where one attack may mark the beginning of a series of related attacks that happen in a tighter time FRA, and more directly related way than that. Some would say that Turkey has managed to rather extensively stir more than one nest of hornets within the past twelve months, and thus "lightning striking twice" may be way more likely now than during some prior periods. |
Originally Posted by teahan
(Post 26006803)
I just don't see evidence that Turkey is managing the security situation.
Airside bomb attack at SAW, and what we saw was official denial of security issues. I agree with the other posts, Turkey has a much more of a security problem than most other countries. They are for example doing much more for Syrian refugees than the whole of Europe and the US combined, they have started issuing work permits to refugees. That alone is probably doing more for our colective security than anything else. |
You're still more likely to get killed on the road there than from terrorism.
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Originally Posted by Palal
(Post 26017471)
You're still more likely to get killed on the road there than from terrorism.
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Originally Posted by arlflyer
(Post 26006691)
I understand that you're speaking for "people" rather than yourself, and it's a true statement because "people" aren't necessarily rational, but I'm just curious - aside from outright conflict zones, is there a contemporary example of "lightning striking twice" of this sort? I'm struggling to think of one. Personally I'm the sort of "contrarian" that a previous poster mentioned - once the magnifying glass and spotlight have been placed, I feel safer actually.
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Originally Posted by Andy33
(Post 26022410)
One obvious example of "lightning striking twice" (or a lot more than twice) was the Europa Hotel, Belfast, during the IRA activities of the 1970s to 1990s. 28 separate bomb attacks.
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Yep. Can relate as well. Award travel coming up during the first week of May. Hoping things chill out....would be a pain to change my entire trip since Istanbul is in the middle of my tour.....
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Los Angeles Times:
Turkey, travel and terrorists: Five things to know Turkey, a growing travel destination in recent years, has been a repeat terrorist target in recent months. Before you book that Turkish trip – or cancel it -- consider these five points. The U.S. State Department is increasingly nervous. On Feb. 4, the agency warned Americans against travel to southeastern Turkey because of “an increased threat of terrorist attacks,” perhaps from an international terror organization, perhaps from an indigenous one. But not all the trouble is confined to the southeastern area near the Syrian border. On Jan. 12 in Istanbul, a killer in his 20s with Islamic State ties detonated a bomb-rigged vest, killing 10 German tourists and himself at one of the city’s busiest tourist spots, the Sultanahmet District. <snip> Turkish officials have said that the bomber had entered the country as a Syrian refugee. His attack followed multiple terrorist killings last year, including an Oct. 10 bombing in Ankara that killed more than 100. On Jan. 14, just two days after the Istanbul bombing, came a car-bomb-and-gunfire attack on a police headquarters in Turkey’s southeastern Diyarbakir Province, killing another five people or more. Government officials blamed that attack on Kurdish separatist terrorists, whose history of clashes with Turkish government troops is long and bloody. <snip> Despite a slowdown at the end of the year, American travel to Turkey was up in 2015. <snip> The Russians are backing away. <snip> Turkey now has enough Syrian refugees to fully populate the cities of San Francisco and San Diego. <snip> It’s more than 500 miles from Istanbul to the Syrian border. <snip> |
Originally Posted by GUWonder
(Post 26004802)
After today's suicidal-homicidal bomber attacked in the Sultanahmet tourist section of Istanbul killed and wounded tourists and others, questions about the security situation when visiting Turkey do arise. Unfortunately, the risk assessment would be that the risks have been greater in the last several months than they were even at this time last year.
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I would not visit IST today
Originally Posted by Koja78
(Post 24399054)
It is Istanbul.. it's not the Syrian border. Your biggest risk is over paying in restaurants.
I had a wonderful one week stay in IST two years ago. It is a great city - but - I have no desire to return. Tourists are being targeted by ISIS/PKK, in response to the crackdown by Erdogan. My next visit (in June) is going to be for 2 hours transiting Ataturk (best lounge in the Star Alliance). |
Originally Posted by Antonio8069
(Post 26354608)
Today's terrorist attack in Istanbul was the 2nd this year. The 1st targeted tourists at the Haga Sophia.
I had a wonderful one week stay in IST two years ago. It is a great city - but - I have no desire to return. Tourists are being targeted by ISIS/PKK, in response to the crackdown by Erdogan. My next visit (in June) is going to be for 2 hours transiting Ataturk (best lounge in the Star Alliance). What is security like these days? I was in Rome a few weeks ago and there are a couple of soldiers with machine guns and armored personnel carriers at all the main tourist/political sites. I'm headed to Paris and I'm expecting the same -- but with more troops. In Istanbul, I would think there would be an overwhelming military presence these days. |
Originally Posted by iahphx
(Post 26357204)
What is security like these days? ... In Istanbul, I would think there would be an overwhelming military presence these days. I try not to let security concerns impact my day to day life, but there's wild rumors spreading via expat social media (when it works without a VPN) and some foreigners are definitely avoiding certain pieces of infrastructure and touristic areas at peak hours. As we commonly assure ourselves on threads like these, random violence and tragic accidents can occur anywhere in the world - yet I'll be a little more relieved than usual to get out of here in a couple weeks... |
March/April Istanbul Security
I had an overnight layover in Istanbul on Friday 3/25/2016 and Saturday 4/2/2016. We stayed at Ottoman Hotel Imperial on 3/25 and Boutique Saint Sophia Hotel on 4/2. The hotels are right next to each other and are immediately adjacent to Hagia Sophia. Both hotels are excellent...but lack security.
Vehicle access to both hotels is restricted by general vehicle limitations in the tourist area. We used Zip Transfers for the ride from the airport. On 3/25 we arrived near the hotel about 6:30pm. The driver called the hotel and they sent a porter to meet us about 3 blocks from the hotel. It looked like we would need to walk the remaining three blocks to the hotel, but once the porter saw we were four people with only hand luggage he jumped in the van and directed the driver to a spot closer to the hotel requiring only a walk of about 100 feet to the hotel entrance. The Ottoman Hotel Imperial has NO entry security, i.e.., no metal detector/luggage screening. However, due to the layout of the hotel someone entering the main entrance cannot easily get to guest rooms or dinning areas. We received multiple email alerts from the US State Dept. S.T.E.P. program with cautions about traveling in Turkey. They specifically mentioned to avoid staying in hotels without entry security. We walked to dinner across Sultan Ahmet Square, avoiding groups of people as much as possible. The next morning we visited the Basilica Cistern and Blue Mosque before the return to the airport. When we left the hotel we did have to walk about 3 blocks, with the help of a hotel porter, to reach our van and driver. This was due to the general vehicle restrictions in this area. On 4/2/16 we arrived closer to 11:30pm and our driver was able to access the restricted area and take us directly to the Boutique St. Sophia Hotel. It is located along the tram line next to Hagia Sophia and up a small hill by foot from the street. This hotel does NOT have entry security, metal detector or luggage screening. The breakfast room is in the lobby. Upon checking in the front desk informed us that taking breakfast in our room was available at no additional charge. That would be the more prudent move but, we ended up eating in the lobby. Unfortunately, anyone can walk into the lobby from the street and directly into the breakfast area unrestricted. We wanted to visit the Hagia Sophia which opens at 9 am. On our visit the week prior we noted people standing inline outside the gate to the Hagia Sophia prior to its opening. We waited till about 9:05am to make the 3 min walk over and there was no line outside the gate. However there was a bit of a backup at the ticket windows. We were able to buy tickets, with a credit card TL40 per person, at the kiosk just to the left after entering the gates and thus bypass the ticket window line. We quickly moved past the turnstile/security X-ray/metal detector and into the building. Upon exiting we needed to get back to the hotel to get bags to return to the airport. I did note, with much dismay, a large contingent of red jacketed security police in Sultan Ahmet square sitting around engrossed in their iPhones and not providing any security whatsoever. This is the spot where 12 people were killed in a bombing in January and the cops are looking at their phones not the people walking through the area! We did the same 3 block walk from the hotel to our driver/van as the week prior. Not the most low key way to get a ride when you are carrying bags. Fortunately we had checked our luggage through to JFK and only had hand luggage. Bottom line, in light of the recent events in Istanbul, caution is highly recommended. Make sure hotels have entry security. Follow the recommendations of security experts. This all does make you very paranoid. I have been traveling for more than 30 years including a flight to Rome the day after Lockerbie...so Im not one to let terrorists alter my plans but I don't think I will be returning to Istanbul anytime soon....no matter how cheap Turkish Airlines fares get. We had booked these hotels because of their proximity to Hagia Sophia and Blue Mosque knowing we would only have about an hour on each visit for sight seeing. We incorrectly assumed that all hotels in Istanbul had entry security. You can see the security in photos on some hotel websites....my recommendation ASK before you book. I wish we had. |
Originally Posted by NJTravlr
(Post 26435892)
I had an overnight layover in Istanbul on Friday 3/25/2016 and Saturday 4/2/2016. We stayed at Ottoman Hotel Imperial on 3/25 and Boutique Saint Sophia Hotel on 4/2. The hotels are right next to each other and are immediately adjacent to Hagia Sophia. Both hotels are excellent...but lack security.
Vehicle access to both hotels is restricted by general vehicle limitations in the tourist area. We used Zip Transfers for the ride from the airport. On 3/25 we arrived near the hotel about 6:30pm. The driver called the hotel and they sent a porter to meet us about 3 blocks from the hotel. It looked like we would need to walk the remaining three blocks to the hotel, but once the porter saw we were four people with only hand luggage he jumped in the van and directed the driver to a spot closer to the hotel requiring only a walk of about 100 feet to the hotel entrance. The Ottoman Hotel Imperial has NO entry security, i.e.., no metal detector/luggage screening. However, due to the layout of the hotel someone entering the main entrance cannot easily get to guest rooms or dinning areas. We received multiple email alerts from the US State Dept. S.T.E.P. program with cautions about traveling in Turkey. They specifically mentioned to avoid staying in hotels without entry security. We walked to dinner across Sultan Ahmet Square, avoiding groups of people as much as possible. The next morning we visited the Basilica Cistern and Blue Mosque before the return to the airport. When we left the hotel we did have to walk about 3 blocks, with the help of a hotel porter, to reach our van and driver. This was due to the general vehicle restrictions in this area. On 4/2/16 we arrived closer to 11:30pm and our driver was able to access the restricted area and take us directly to the Boutique St. Sophia Hotel. It is located along the tram line next to Hagia Sophia and up a small hill by foot from the street. This hotel does NOT have entry security, metal detector or luggage screening. The breakfast room is in the lobby. Upon checking in the front desk informed us that taking breakfast in our room was available at no additional charge. That would be the more prudent move but, we ended up eating in the lobby. Unfortunately, anyone can walk into the lobby from the street and directly into the breakfast area unrestricted. We wanted to visit the Hagia Sophia which opens at 9 am. On our visit the week prior we noted people standing inline outside the gate to the Hagia Sophia prior to its opening. We waited till about 9:05am to make the 3 min walk over and there was no line outside the gate. However there was a bit of a backup at the ticket windows. We were able to buy tickets, with a credit card TL40 per person, at the kiosk just to the left after entering the gates and thus bypass the ticket window line. We quickly moved past the turnstile/security X-ray/metal detector and into the building. Upon exiting we needed to get back to the hotel to get bags to return to the airport. I did note, with much dismay, a large contingent of red jacketed security police in Sultan Ahmet square sitting around engrossed in their iPhones and not providing any security whatsoever. This is the spot where 12 people were killed in a bombing in January and the cops are looking at their phones not the people walking through the area! We did the same 3 block walk from the hotel to our driver/van as the week prior. Not the most low key way to get a ride when you are carrying bags. Fortunately we had checked our luggage through to JFK and only had hand luggage. Bottom line, in light of the recent events in Istanbul, caution is highly recommended. Make sure hotels have entry security. Follow the recommendations of security experts. This all does make you very paranoid. I have been traveling for more than 30 years including a flight to Rome the day after Lockerbie...so Im not one to let terrorists alter my plans but I don't think I will be returning to Istanbul anytime soon....no matter how cheap Turkish Airlines fares get. We had booked these hotels because of their proximity to Hagia Sophia and Blue Mosque knowing we would only have about an hour on each visit for sight seeing. We incorrectly assumed that all hotels in Istanbul had entry security. You can see the security in photos on some hotel websites....my recommendation ASK before you book. I wish we had. I've been to Istanbul many times as my partner is half Turkish and was thinking about going again in August but I just don't know if I'll be as relaxed as normal. There are plenty of other places to visit but we love Istanbul so much! |
As a US citizen,Is there a strong benifit to enrolling in the Smart Traveler Enrollment Program (STEP) program? We are traveling 6-May through 16-May to Istanbul and Cappadocia, the news is reporting two small explosions today.
I am seriously starting to think we should rescheduled this trip. My primary concern is that vacation may not be relaxing if the city is on high alert or lock down. |
Originally Posted by returnoftheyeti
(Post 26463358)
As a US citizen,Is there a strong benifit to enrolling in the Smart Traveler Enrollment Program (STEP) program? We are traveling 6-May through 16-May to Istanbul and Cappadocia, the news is reporting two small explosions today.
I am seriously starting to think we should rescheduled this trip. My primary concern is that vacation may not be relaxing if the city is on high alert or lock down. The reality, however, is that you are more likely to die in a car accident on the way to the airport than in a terror attack. |
Originally Posted by 747FC
(Post 26463388)
I hear you. While STEP is easy and may provide some information to you, it will not allay your fears.
The reality, however, is that you are more likely to die in a car accident on the way to the airport than in a terror attack. |
Originally Posted by returnoftheyeti
(Post 26463358)
the news is reporting two small explosions today.
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An emergency travel warning has been published (4/09/2016) on the website of the US embassy in Turkey:
Credible Threats to Public Squares and Docks in Istanbul and Antalya. http://turkey.usembassy.gov/sm_040916.html |
I just spent a week in Turkey: three days in Cappadocia and four days in Istanbul. While in Istanbul, I stayed two blocks from Taksim Square at a hotel with no "extra security" to speak of, and I walked all around Sultanahmet, Taksim, Istiklal Street...
Despite all the media hype, I honestly felt far safer in Istanbul than at home in Chicago. Everything felt completely normal. The best part was that the major attractions were less crowded because so many people have an overblown fear of terrorism. I wouldn't hesitate to tell my friends/family to visit Istanbul right now or have them take any abnormal precautions. People do a terrible job of assessing risk and relative probabilities—the risk of terrorism in Turkey is not nonexistent, but remains substantially lower than the risk of being killed in a much more mundane way (see: traffic accidents, getting too drunk and falling down the stairs, choking to death on dinner, etc.). |
Originally Posted by Scifience
(Post 26477085)
People do a terrible job of assessing risk and relative probabilities—the risk of terrorism in Turkey is not nonexistent, but remains substantially lower than the risk of being killed in a much more mundane way (see: traffic accidents, getting too drunk and falling down the stairs, choking to death on dinner, etc.).
While I can perfectly understand people having fears and second guessing travel plans, we do need to look at it in a factual way. Being all part here in a community that has a love for flying, chances of us getting killed in a plane crash are probably much higher than being a victim of a terrorist attack. Yet, no-one here after a major crash would suddenly not step into a plane again. Just unfortunately, the human brain works more complicated than just reading statistics. I always quote the numbers of the height of the Iraq war: in a full yeat, a California US soldier had a bigger chance of getting killed in a road accident at home, than on duty in Iraq. Yet, not many would volunteer to go to Baghdad, while no-one would hesitate navigating the LA traffic. Therefore, I can still perfectly understand those changing their travel plans. I have visited Turkey as well recently (Istanbul, Ankara) for work, and soon will visit again, also including a few touristic stops. Even if I might have had slight worries it being just after the latest Turkish attacks, I felt perfectly safe and at ease. And if terror attacks would be a guideline, why no-one is asking questions if London, Madrid or NY or the greater LA area are still safe places to visit? The sad fact nowadays is that terror can strike almost everywhere. Do we want to stay home, and let the terrorists win? I didn't think so. But in the end, we all make the choice we are all comfortable with in our own minds. |
Bear in mind that some of the travelers who have posted concerns here are not worried about being directly impacted by a terrorist event, which is extraordinarily minute. Their concerns have more to do with the reactions of the Turkish government to such attacks. That concern is much more well-founded than fear of the attack itself.
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Originally Posted by NJTravlr
(Post 26435892)
Bottom line, in light of the recent events in Istanbul, caution is highly recommended. Make sure hotels have entry security. Follow the recommendations of security experts. |
Originally Posted by GUWonder
(Post 26354549)
Istanbul hit again today, along a main shopping street.
Police is definitely more on the alert, the main thoroughfares - think Eminonu, or Besiktas - have multiple patrols with armed police. The ferry terminal for Kadikoy, for instance, was always guarded by officers with armored cars, not the usual vans/sedans. Another thing I've noticed is that metal detectors have appeared at the entrance of the metro stations and some ferry terminals (Besiktas is one of them). They do a pretty quick check of bags, but it's something I'd never seen in my 10 visits before. |
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