Or so you thought... I used to work as a bus boy in a few restaurants. Doing that will pretty much result in special ingredients added to your food. If not this time, next time if you ever go back. ;)

Two things I learn as a bus boy:
1) How to balance a bunch of glasses of water on a tray
2) Don't piss off the person who brings you your food

It wouldn't have happened in this instance as my food was already on the table. This event was several years ago and as it turns out the restaurant folded shortly after and I didn't have the chance to return.

Years ago, I was hosting a business lunch at Le Louis XV (Alain Ducasse restaurant that earned him three Michelin stars). Our lunch was scheduled for around noon, and the guest of honor was speaking at a convention at 2 PM. The first embarrassment occurred when the guest of honor was given the only menu with prices on it (at the time, about 350 euro pp for the price fixe menu).

The next embarrassment occurred when the server learned that the guest of honor wouldn't be there for the entire 3+ hour meal event, loudly proclaimed to him, "If you cannot stay for the entire meal, you cannot eat!"

The guest of honor was a very traditional, gentlemanly type and he just said, "of course, I understand, no problem. Please just go ahead with the rest of the table." We tried to get the server to allow him to participate in as many courses as he could before leaving, to no avail.

The server then proceeded to serve at least three courses to the rest of the table, pointedly bypassing our guest of honor every time. It was hugely embarrassing.

Despite that, it was still the best meal I've ever had. ;)

brilliant, great posts

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galatoire's

Was that Imre the guy with the eyebrows? My favorite.

Is part of dining at such establishments being abused and embarrassed by servers? Is it some sort of culinary S&M thing? The meal can only be great if we pay massively but are treated poorly? :confused:

In this instance I would have told the server that the guest who initially had to leave changed his plans so as to enjoy the meal. Then he could leave at his convenience having enjoyed the early courses.

Yes, I believe so.

Watching/listening to the "locals" have Sunday lunch at Galatoire's (or better yet, seated with locals - NEVER MORE THAN 4 TO A TABLE!** -remains a quintessential NOLA experience. An old friend, long in New Orleans, now retired to the desolate prairies of far North Dallas, and I commiserate about the memories of long afternoons tucked into a table at what was likely never a "multi-star" on the Michelin map, but in my life and travels certainly among a handful of restaurants worthy of the classification "Most Enjoyable".

**No waiter or waitstaff, even the best, can really "serve" with style and appropriate personal attention a large table of guests. Even the best attempts while acceptable fall short.

+1

The guest of honour must have been a very classy (and patient) individual to tolerate that kind of disgraceful treatment.

Was eating at a very nice seafood place overlooking the intercoastal in Lauderdale with 4 couples. I finished before my GF (normal) and after about 15 minutes of looking at my dirty, empty plates; asked a bus boy to remove them. He said that "we do not clean the table until everyone is finished". I said "take them or they will be in the river". They got taken away.

It was in Paris - I've never seen such a thing, not even from the gauchest of foreigners.

Well, if it's ok with Elaine...(all these years later and the mention of her name still makes my heart skip a beat)

Etiquette is (as most fine dining restaurants) that plates are not to be removed until all diners at the table have finished. However, if you asked, then it should be removed without a word. It is rather improper to have them removed as it makes everyone at the table feel rushed.

It may or may not be improper, depending upon the circumstances. More than five or ten minutes elapsed with empty, dirty dishes? Time to clear them away.

Speaking of being lectured by waitstaff, this happened to me a few days ago in Kansas City.


The other day I had the absolute worst customer service experience in a restaurant I have ever had in Kansas City. Check it out, so before the game I go to this Chinese food place. I walk into the door and stand around for a few minutes in front of the counter, because I was not sure if this was one of those restaurants where you seat yourself or wait to be seated so I was just going to wait on someone to tell me. Then someone comes to the counter and asks me what I will have. Haven't seen a menu yet, havent even been seated yet so I say this is the first time I have been here, can I see a menu? He says sure and hands me one, I decide on the orange chicken and order it. I see behind me in another room there are tables and chairs. So I get my food, pay for my order, leave a tip, and then walk to the tables in the next room to sit down and eat.

Just then that same server that rang up my order starts lecturing me about eating take out food in the dining area, saying that if I wanted to eat inside I needed to order in this other room with the tables and chairs, right then I was so fuming I was about to just blow a gasket. I decided not to because I had no place to eat this food and didn't want to get kicked out. Hey server guy, when I literally tell you this is the first time I have been here, you think a good question to ask would have been is this for here or to go?
Afterward he said its ok, just know for next time if you want to eat inside order in this other room. So i finished my food and left.

My only regret is after I was done eating I didn't go up to the cash register and find the manager and demand my tip to be taken off the credit card recept. Anyone work in the restaurant business? Is it possible to re-run a credit card transaction with a 0 tip after the bill has already been closed out?

My whole life I have never had a restaurant experience that pissed me off, until a few days ago. I always tip between 17-20% ish or so depending on how the rounding works out. I always tip that much regardless of service so if the bill is for example, 16 dollars, I will take 10% of that and double it, so 3.20, and then round down to leave a 3 dollar tip. I will leave 7 dollars on a 34 dollar bill, etc.

You have REALLY got to suck as a server if I want to leave 0.

:td: :td:

I would be more sympathetic had I not spent much time abroad.

In France, Italy and Spain, small "coffee bar" type establishments will often have three sets of prices...

Cheapest - standing at the counter to eat and or drink.
Mid-price - seated at a table inside (waiter service - bad ju-ju to seat your self to consume items ordered at the service bar).
Most expensive - seated outside

In Asia, especially SEA - The "mistreatment" you received is in many locations more than commonplace. It's to be expected. For Asians in the US, the cultural tattoos of centuries are hard to eradicate in a few years. I've encountered the same "arrangements" (2 menus, different prices) in "Asian", mostly Chinese, in several larger US cities. I'll never forget my experience many years ago in NYC, learning that a small restaurant I liked and frequented several times a week had 3 menus, "Take Out", "Table Service for [non-Chinese]), and "Chinese Menu" (cheapest, widest variety). After about a month, the owner explained the intricacies of the Chinese menu and thereafter served and price my meal from it, providing me with the same - I guess - premium treatment accorded those who read/spoke his language.

I understand from my nephew [redacted] who lives and works in Beijing and has traveled throughout China, an amazingly diverse place, that there are areas where the locals expect the waiters to be disputacious. I recall that those in Cholon could be. My nephew also claims that many local restaurants require patrons to bring their own containers for "take out", but do maintain (as in India) substantial stocks of special metal/bamboo takeout containers for meal delivery to nearby offices - leaving one set, then picking it up on the next delivery.

Interesting how different people in different places interpret things. I (and I suspect most people this side of the pond) would find a waiter clearing plates away whilst someone at the table is still eating to be incredibly rude. Indeed, as a relatively slow eater, I still can't get used to this practice when I visit the USA - it puts so much pressure on you to eat up and get out (that and bringing the bill unbidden, often without even asking about dessert or coffee).

What was the absolute height of rudeness however, was threatening to throw the plate in the river if it wasn't cleared - obnoxious and classless IMO.

I find that whole comment astonishing, and him refusing to acknowledge who got it wrong is even more entertaining. And I'm thinking many more support your version than his version.

The fact is that as a customer you shouldn't threaten staff simply because you lack maturity, class and style.

If I'm continuing to eat dinner, I'm at a loss to understand how the waiter removing my wife's empty, dirty dishes qualifies as "rude." I want dirty dishes somewhere else than on my table.

Do you insist that the waiter leave the empty salad plate on the table when he brings the main course? (Assuming, of course, that the salad precedes that main course.)

Removing others' dishes before everyone has finished is, in my book, one of the rudest things a server can do and immediately means a halving of the tip. However, I do recognise that in the USA they seem to be trained to do it - so I only halve the tip if they continue to do it after I've told them not to.

Of course, real etiquette is for the faster eater to slow down so as not to pile pressure on the slower eater....

Quite.
I can't ever recall wait-staff attempting to remove plates from my fellow diners whilst others were still eating and if they did I'd politely ask them to stay away until we're ready.
Good wait-staff will know instinctively when it's the right moment and in any case most always ask if everyone has finished before doing so.

Presumably they wouldn't serve the main course while someone was still eating their salad so it's a moot point.

That's "service" in America. It's all about turning tables. More customers = more tips.

Hate the game, not the player.

I recall one of my favorite restaurants was on the East side of Lafayette, LA, just off IH10. Modest menu, but "specialties of the house" included boiled shrimp and steamed crab sold by the pound both of which arrived in galvanized buckets. Tables, covered in newspaper, had large holes in the middle, below which sat a garbage can for shells. It was the first place I remember providing a roll of paper towels for napkins, and entrees, etc., other than shrimp and crab were served on paper plates, also consigned to the "central disposal facility". Wise patrons brought their own cracking devices, since the joint provided only hammers.

I am with you on this, although living in Canada I have become more used to it. My father, on the other hand, reserves a special shade of puce for this activity, so much so I have to warn the waiting staff ahead of time and out of earshot of my father!

I think quite the rudest waiter I have ever had was in the US when I ordered an asparagus starter. I ate the asparagus with my fingers. He came over, mid bite, and demanded to know if I had "unusable cutlery" very loudly in front of a busy restaurant.

+1

Removing someone's plate while others are still eating is extremely rude, imo.

As long as it's preceded by "Can I get some of these dishes out of your way?", I am normally very pleased. No doubt partly because I'm American, but I lean toward the practical over the traditional. I don't want to look at dirty dishes/excess clutter on the table.

it makes me feel rushed, it might be ok in a culture where people like to eat early and race home to watch television, but when I eat out I like to take my time and make my meal the focus of the evening. Having waiters fussing around while people are still eating is rude and intrusive.

Obviously, I'm with you.

One may prefer that waitstaff wait until everyone at the table is finished with all their food before they remove empty (dirty) tableware, and that preference is fine. But someone behaving counter to one's preference does not constitute rudeness.

In the US both methods are considered acceptable and it is preference.

In Europe it is downright rude, not a preference, to remove the plates before everyone is finished.

One thing I absolutely cannot abide either side of the Atlantic is people putting their cloth napkins on top of an empty plate.

What I find truly rude is when a waiter attempts to clear a plate or plates without asking if one is finished eating, even if food is still on the plate. It's become way too frequent. I'm by no means a slow eater, but I like to occasionally put down my cutlery and enjoy my wine for a few sips. Or maybe I'm in conversation with my dining companions.

In any case, I don't know why staff isn't trained to know the standard "cutlery crossed" means don't take, while parallel cutlery means, please take this plate.

Why? Presumably both napkin and plate will be washed before their next use.

My Dad is a slow eater and gets very annoyed by waitstaff who attempt to clear other people's plates before everyone is finished. When I eat out with him this means that I have to carefully pace myself to match him or else I wind up pushing the last few morsels around my plate for 10 minutes while taking increasingly tiny bites and drinking a lot of additional water. :D

Pretty much this. Unless I'm doing something that completely ruins how I might appreciate the meal, leave me alone. Nothing good can come from putting me on the spot.

Now, if I ask for advice or a recommendation or how best to eat something (i.e., if I have never eaten blue crabs before and am doing it wrong), I'm open to constructive, tactful criticism.

A number of reasons, not least because if you put your napkin on a soiled plate, it is going to get far dirtier than simply placing it to the side. Why would you want to make more work for the person laundering the napkin than necessary - it just shows plain inconsiderateness of others.

Not to mention the person having to fish out your napkin from the plates, the fact it makes it harder for them to take plates to the kitchen as they cannot place another plate on top, the fact many do it after the main course, leaving them napkinless for any remaining courses, and having to see other people's napkins dumped on their plates is unsightly.

It really is very déclassé!

To each his own, but the service standard I was taught was to leave all the plates until the last person is finished to prevent that person from feeling rushed.

Unnecessarily personalized or snarky posts, or responses thereto, have been removed.

Please keep the discussion civil and respectful. Thank you.

cblaisd
Co-Moderator, Dining Buzz

I don't think this is a standard rule. I thought I posted it earlier, but just in case I didn't, I got lectured once by a waiter at a Denny's (lowest quality level diner-type restaurant in the U.S.) because when I was finished, I laid my cutlery parallel on my plate. He informed me self-importantly that the correct way to signal I was done was to CROSS the cutlery.

My husband also crosses his utensils to indicate he's done. I still don't, except on rare occasion.

Wow! How did you respond? I'd have been sorely tempted to explain in graphic terms how my "usable cutlery" would be used if he bothered me further. ;)

I was so taken aback that I just muttered something like 'yes it is all fine thank you'.