Very true. ^ I've reached that point too, very little interest in the bells and whistles of a 'fine dining' experience but I crave great food well cooked.

My wife is an excellent cook and we eat well at home also, but as another poster mentioned, often times you have to give your due to the professionals. One of our recent favorite dishes was Qabali Seviyan from Moti Mahal. The recipe is on the internet but I don't think we could possibly duplicate it, let alone find all the ingredients in our small town.

I sure hope you mean "well-prepared." Because if you are referring to the internal temperature of the beef, then you have lost all foodie cred! :cool:

I completely empathise with that quote. When I go to e.g. New York or Paris, I have a long "hit list" of places I want to eat at and always have some outstanding experiences. This also adds to the sense of occasion when on my travels.

However, I don't see the point of trying to go out for "cheap eats" in London as it's always atrocious/way too expensive for what you get. There are some good restaurants here, but you end up paying through the nose and I've still to find the reasonably priced neighbourhood restaurant where I can get a decent meal for little money. Most of the restaurants in London I've been to end up straddling the terrible middleground of being semi-expensive and serving bad food... That's why I tend to eat out at great places around the world, but I would find it difficult to suggest good restaurants in London and instead tend to scour the markets and cook myself.

This is one of those threads which keeps me coming back to FT.

I am surprised, however, that no one has brought up the fact that one has little control over salt content and other additives when dining out. I´m very careful about my use of salt and fat, for example - but many restaurants make up for a lack of technique and/or flavor by overusing such items. This is one of several reasons I truly enjoy dining and cooking at home.

Let me first state that I like to cook - and I cook a variety of Austrian and American-style dishes (nothing overly complicated or time-consuming however except on rare occasions).

Because I travel a lot (like all of us here) I do tend to try to find more unusual local restaurants at my various destinations. You would have to drag me kicking and screaming into a steak house chain (Mortons, Ruth Chris, etc.) . Instead, I try to find out what the local specialties are and where the locals go.

Just a few weeks ago, one of the better meals I had in Prague (Allegro was the best dining experience there) was in a low-end restaurant called Lokal. Not pretentious at all, not expensive either (dinner for 2 with appetizers, main courses, dessert, and Bier was ca. $30 plus gratuity) - but the food was made with passion.

Someone mentioned "passion" earlier in this thread and I think that is what seals the deal for me. Passion can be evidenced in very simple dishes as well as in more complex ones and the price tag doesn´t necessarily even begin to mean that there is true passion behind the dish being served.

At this point, the buzzer in the kitchen is ringing so I must attend to the stove and broiler I suppose. But I will continue to follow this thread with great interest.

I've noticed I am getting ruined for eating out at a lot of places but less so because of travel and more because of where I live. While I appreciate cheaper restaurants as much as the fine dining places, in order to survive in Napa a restaurant had better be good because its the locals that keep them alive during the off season.

Unfortunately, since moving here I have noticed that I have to search for really outstanding places when I travel, because too often I will hear something is good and it won't be up to the quality I am used to. (Part of that may come from living in California and our always available fresh produce, but sadly I've had it start to happen when comparing restaurants from my old hometown, San Francisco.)

A slight detour ......

What really frustrated home "fine dining" for years was a lack of good sources of local fresh produce. This even goes for our second home from which we can see across the bay one of the UK's premier fish ports. Fish - even in the local fish shops was variable. Fish simply wasn't always fresh - particlarly less popular fish ie premium fish.

Boringly my favourite food is fresh bread ..... to the extent I become quite obsessive with it ... even to making fresh pizza at home using Caputo flour imported from Naples..... and keeping a sour dough bigga starter going in the fridge to feed the fresh pizza supply ...... but that's a different story!

Recently an outfit in the UK called Ocado started to deliver to our area and we now get a delivery every third day. We pay a monthly fee of £9.99 and deliveries are then free. This includes very fresh fish from a counter (bream, sea bass etc) very good beef (dry aged Aberdeen rib steaks!) and fresh bread including excellent sourdough including varieties. As I'm able to get deliveries at around 07:00 in ther morning it means very fresh bread at least twice a week for breakfast (coffee from the automatic Gaggia) and wonderful fresh fish at least twice a week which we grill. Who can beat very fresh bream grilled with some salad some home made vinegarette and fresh bread ...... Even when we were snowed in a while ago for a couple of weeks and 4x4's couldn't move in or out somehow or other the Ocado Mercedes vans chugged up the hill with our goodies ..... And now ... as the cook also does the shopping (me) wastage is reduced and meals planned properly and arguments and tiffs about substitutions avoided!

It is suprising how decent supply sources changes ones lives.

I still cannot believe that shopping is completed by 07:30 The only thing that has ever tempted me to live in France is the baker shops and local small markets and now at least I have Ocado which has stopped the longing ..... and my wife would say the whining.

Thank God, I can cook pretty good.

"fine dining" is synonymous with "haute dining". i find neither to be correlated with food quality and satisfaction. some of my favorite places to eat in the world are texas barbecue joints that are really just large b.y.o.b brick sheds

I'm not sure that I'd call a charred lump of meat with french fries fine dining. I do get your point though. For me, it's why go to a few half-assed places when I could eat out less often and go somewhere that is nice. There's plenty of good, inexpensive peasant food that can be eaten in between if you want to go out.

I've become a decent home cook, cooking almost every weeknight for my fiancee and myself. I source good produce from the local farmers markets every weekend. I have accumulated a solid background in French and Chinese cooking techniques, and rarely have to agonize what to make for dinner sans recipe.

These days, I rarely think about eating at the mid to mid-high end places anymore (main dish at $15-28 in SF). With a few exceptions, these places just don't offer an interesting or good value dining experience anymore. The level of technique is often average, with typical proteins served in a boring manner. For this, I also get to deal with hit-or-miss service, SF parking and terrible wine lists.

I much rather eat at hole-in-the-wall places where the food is simple but shows good technique from that ethnic cuisine. Peasant food. Easily enjoyable and easier on the wallet also.

I still like to occasionally splurge on the really high end places ($100+ tasting menus) but it's no longer my raison d'etre.

When traveling, it can be even more depressing, because coworkers or friends will recommend places that are supposedly really good/interesting, but the restaurants would most likely not make it in SF.

its not fine dining, its great dining. absolutely charred, but none of these places will ever have anything like french fries.

http://www.jonathanhayes.com/slidesh...-Images/33.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3033/...8a4e9e96f8.jpg

we have in-state locals who make the 200, 300 mile pilgrimage for this stuff :)
ive flown a few times just for this purpose

I could write a book about all the crappy, overpriced meals I've had in London over the years. FT has so far been the absolute best source of good recommendations for me. In fact, all of my great meals in London recently have come from FT recommendations. I only wish it had been around when I lived there..

Where are these places? I'm going to be all over the place in July; maybe I'll be nearby at one point.

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Looks like Lockhart, TX to me. Yummmmmmm. ;)

You got that just by looking at the pictures?? I am duly impressed.

Dont be, unless I am right ;)

I am late to this thread, but had to jump in. I have found lately that "fine dining" is not enjoyable for me when I travel due to really bad, lazy service. Not necessarily bad food, but bad service for the price paid and level of service received. Now I have to admit I live in Sonoma County and I agree with TEHJ, maybe I am spoiled due to service having to be good at local restaurants in order to survive in wine country. But I was raised in Chicago, so I am not a wine snob.

Case in point, last week Las Vegas, "fine dining" restaurant at "high end" hotel on strip, (I was entertaining clients, it was their pick) they served a cheese course to the table, plopped down the plate and left. No utensils, no markers, no description of any thing on the plate, no matter how tasty it was it was not fully enjoyed due to the lack of service (we all tried to serve ourselves with our own silverware, not very sanitary).

But what really blew me away was when we heard a high "ping" and the woman sitting at the table next to me is holding her wine glass stem in her hand with no bottom (on the wine glass, I am sure she had her bottom!). The wine glass had "ping" broken in half, as these things happen, and the waitstaff came over, looked at her and said "here is a new wineglass so you can pour the rest of your wine into it". HUH! She sat there looking at her hand to see if was cut or any shards were in it, and NO ONE from the restaurant came over to see if she was OK, or ask how the could compensate her. I was stunned! The lack of common courtesy really ruined the restaurant for me. Again, maybe it's me, but it seems like this should be really basic service at a "fine dining" restaurant.

Just my little vent :D

In response to the OP: I can enjoy a wide range of food, I adjust my expectations to the level of the restaurant. I can enjoy simple comfort food as delicious when it's good and I enjoy an incredible meal at real fine dining restaurant. A real fine dining restaurant can provide more surprises and swooning over great combinations and unique textures and flavors though I still enjoy other food.

In response to LongingForORD, I think that a lot of restaurants position themselves and are sometimes regarded as fine dining restaurants when they are not really that, a wolf in sheeps clothing if you will. That's one of the difficulties in traveling, finding real fine dining that meets one's own tastes. It's often hard to gauge recommendations in other cities since you may not know much about the recommender.

They are all 1-3 hours away from Austin, Houston, San Antonio, and Dallas.

The cities are: Lockhart, Luling, Llano, Taylor, Lexington

It's quite contentious what the best places are but few people would disagree City Market of Luling is at the very top. I also like Louie Mueller's of Taylor. Snow's in Lexington is a recent fad. Franklin Barbecue (in Austin!!!) is the newest fad.

others:
Cooper's (llano)
Smitty's (lockhart)
Blacks (lockhart)
Kreutz (lockhart)
Taylor Cafe (taylor)
Salt Lick (austin hill country)

check the open times because some of these places have very limited opening hours, and/or they run out of food EARLY.

as a backup, the Rudys BBQ chain is very very reliable and easily accessible

stay away from anything in the actual city of houston and dallas

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Feel free to be sort of maybe impressed ;)

"Super Size Me" was about eating at McDonalds, but the same applies to any commercially prepared food, including the finest haute cuisine. It is simple unhealthy to eat daily! For lots of reasons. Flavour is punched up using salt and butter at the best restaurants, and with MSG, saturated fats and worse additives at most restaurants. Lots of preservatives are added (thankfully so, otherwise it would be life threatening to eat at many places!).

At home you can control these, and in some parts of the world you can source high quality ingredients. Great progress has been made in that respect in the past decade; so it is possible to prepare food that is tastier and healthier at home than any restaurant can. For example I use free-range eggs now, because the taste is so much better than cage eggs. Meat that is "heart smart" is also available in some countries (though the US lags in that!), and it is both leaner and tastier ... as well as hormone and antibiotic free. Cost is far less than restaurant food, yet better in every way. Of course restaurants could use such ingredients and cook that way; a few do, but most find it is not commercially viable except at the high end.

i give you credits for guessing so close for a yank but the pictures are from luling :D

Thanks. But at least I was close. The plate of food could have easily been from Blacks. And boy did it make me hungry to look at it ;)

Pretty much this. I don't spend too much on food when I'm dining (bachelor life), but my job sees me eat at some of the finer restaurants both domestically and internationally. I'm rarely impressed by fine dining, especially all the pomp and circumstance. I would rather eat some defining ethnic food that can usually be found at a reasonable price, though moving to San Diego and then Orange County makes it hard to find legitimate hole-in-the-wall ethnic food since it's so expensive to live here.

If I may digress, an episode of Top Chef completely represents who I am not. There was an episode where the competitors grouped up and made food for some soldiers. Since it was a picnic, a group decided to make a potato salad. I'm sure it was fantastic! Padma scolded that team, saying that the dish was "cliché." IN THE ENTIRE HISTORY OF THE SHOW, THAT WAS THE ONLY POTATO SALAD. PICNIC FOOD AT A PICNIC, OH MY. So, if someone offers her the FOTM, she'll eat it. She's the type to praise 7 different scallop dishes in a row because that obviously wouldn't be cliché. If it's peasant food, she'll reject it-- unless peasant food is en vogue, of course.

She's a miserable human being and I hope she cries herself to sleep at night.

Anyway, do I love some lobster bisque, foie gras, and a filet? Sure. Do I also love burritos? Cheeseburgers? You bet. Do I find it necessary to spend $100 on a meal to be satisfied? Of course not. I'd rather go find a sloppy burrito, explore some Afghani food, or experience something where the spice is more important than price. Of course, I'm the type that normally drinks $2 Pabst Blue Ribbon, but also enjoys a $20 bottle of Hitachino Nest White Ale. I would rather live alone than date someone who judges food by its price or the restaurant at which its served.

We look at fine dining as a reward for when we dine at less than stellar places.

Meh--I like to think I've eaten pretty well both abroad and at home, but I still prefer Cracker Barrel or a $5 panini (if done right) to just about any "haute" cuisine I've ever tried.

That being said, I do become a bit of a snob about ethic food. For instance, having spent a lot of time in China, I find myself turning my nose up at "Chinese" food in America (well, I've finally gotten mostly over that one), even though the truth is that, while not authentic, it tastes darn good, and at the end of the day, isn't that the point?

If you prefer Cracker Barrel to haute cuisine, you might need to reevaluate your cuisine (or at least your haute). ;) Im sorry, that is just wrong.

lol--Hey, we all have our guilty pleasures :cool:.

Obviously, I prefer Joel Robuchon to Cracker Barrel (at least when I'm not jonesing for a trucker breakfast), but I think my general point stands.

à chacun son goût

In general yes, but have you actually been in a Cracker Barrel. :(

If you would have said White Castle, or Purina okay, but Cracker Barrel........

Oh, seriously? You have a particular thing against Cracker Barrel?

Have you ever TRIED their chicken fried chicken, catfish, or just about anything on the breakfast menu??

A stop at CB is a REQUIREMENT on any road trip I take.

Yes. I have been to them. My mom used to like to go there. I would have to go sometimes when I visited. It made me sad to just go in there.

Fried eggs, grits, and biscuits & gravy served with a heaping helping of southern-style friendliness makes you sad? :confused:

sorry but the food is low-grade made with cheap ingredients. Nothing wrong with down-home cooking, but the stuff sucks.

No, the Cracker Barrel version of those foods makes me sad. Ive had grits so good, or biscuits and gravy so good it practically brought tears to my eyes. Not at Cracker Barrel.

I was pleasantly surprised the first time I went to CB and used to frequent them
after, back in the late '80s and '90s - I used to provide the music for a Christmas
Sunday service, and for treat I'd take the musicians to a CB for lunch, and they
were grateful. During this millennium I have been never anything other than
dis thinged (gusted, appointed, that sort of thinged). And the noise level!.

Well, alright, then. Everybody has made their position on Cracker Barrel abundantly clear.

I fear that the point of my post (which attempted used CB as a somewhat tongue-in-cheek example, though I do maintain it as a guilty pleasure) might have been lost. Incidentally, GadgetFreak's most recent post illustrates that point well: haute cuisine can be forgettable or, at the very least, non-habit forming under many circumstances, but once you've had the very best indigenous ::insert ethnic/national/regional title here:: food, it can be difficult to appreciate or even stomach the inauthentic "Americanized"--or westernized, or commercialized, or whatever-ized--version of the same.

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I agree with the general view. Now if could stop thinking of those shrimp and grits and how damn good they were ;)