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-   Delta Air Lines | SkyMiles (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta-air-lines-skymiles-665/)
-   -   What to do with miles when someone dies... ? (Definitive Thread) (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta-air-lines-skymiles/2065070-what-do-miles-when-someone-dies-definitive-thread.html)

rylan Apr 3, 2017 7:19 am

Nothing has changed that I'm aware of... if a skymiles member dies and DL find out then the miles are gone. You can't leave them to someone through a will etc.

While I'm sure some here would call this 'unethical', your best bet in this unfortunate situation is to use the miles for award tickets and not alert Delta to their death.

3Cforme Apr 3, 2017 7:28 am


Originally Posted by heckler (Post 28122510)
Apologize for bringing this back up, couldn't find a really up to date answer (i'm sure it's hiding down in the T&Cs somewhere..)

Unwillingness to find and read T&Cs really is a pox on FlyerTalk.

Under the SkyMiles Mileage Expiration policy, miles do not expire.
 Delta reserves the right to deactivate or close an account under the following circumstances:

Fraudulent activity occurs
A member requests an account closure
A member is deceased
A member does not respond to repeated communication attempts regarding the status of his/her account
A member resides in or relocates to a country where membership is prohibited under applicable law
A member violates the terms of this Membership Guide and Program Rules

http://www.delta.com/content/www/en_...onditions.html

heckler Apr 3, 2017 7:30 am

Sounds like if the doctors tell you "you have x months to live", then go ahead, expeditiously and start using up the miles to buy J tickets for children/relatives to go LHR, CDG, MAD, BCN etc. Better to use them up while still kicking (to a good cause) then have them float into the ionosphere unused..

ATOBTTR Apr 3, 2017 8:10 am


Originally Posted by 3Cforme (Post 28122568)
Unwillingness to find and read T&Cs really is a pox on FlyerTalk.

Under the SkyMiles Mileage Expiration policy, miles do not expire.
 Delta reserves the right to deactivate or close an account under the following circumstances:

Fraudulent activity occurs
A member requests an account closure
A member is deceased
A member does not respond to repeated communication attempts regarding the status of his/her account
A member resides in or relocates to a country where membership is prohibited under applicable law
A member violates the terms of this Membership Guide and Program Rules

http://www.delta.com/content/www/en_...onditions.html

So to play devil's advocate, it does not say "will close the account" - it says "reserves the right". Doesn't "reserve the right" mean Delta may or may not take action? And as long as the deceased member gave authorization to do use the miles and the account in such a manner it avoids the issue of "unauthorized use".

ntr91 Apr 3, 2017 9:11 am


Originally Posted by ATOBTTR (Post 28122720)
So to play devil's advocate, it does not say "will close the account" - it says "reserves the right". Doesn't "reserve the right" mean Delta may or may not take action? And as long as the deceased member gave authorization to do use the miles and the account in such a manner it avoids the issue of "unauthorized use".

Technically, since the T&Cs only give the member the right to reserve award travel (even if they're redeeming for someone else), the fact that the member is pushing up daisies would preclude them from reserving travel for anyone.

jdrtravel Apr 3, 2017 9:18 am


Originally Posted by ntr91 (Post 28122986)
Technically, since the T&Cs only give the member the right to reserve award travel (even if they're redeeming for someone else), the fact that the member is pushing up daisies would preclude them from reserving travel for anyone.

Although if someone had power of attorney or were an executor of an estate this would create a grey area.

lov2fly Apr 3, 2017 9:46 am


Originally Posted by ATOBTTR (Post 28122720)
So to play devil's advocate, it does not say "will close the account" - it says "reserves the right". Doesn't "reserve the right" mean Delta may or may not take action? And as long as the deceased member gave authorization to do use the miles and the account in such a manner it avoids the issue of "unauthorized use".

Just a guess - but it wouldn't surprise me if there were cases in the past where Delta got dragged into some family arguments about who was entitled to use the miles of a family member who passed away.

With rare exceptions, I would bet FF miles do not get mentioned in most peoples Will.

Uncle Fred passes away and next thing you know Delta is stuck in the middle between kids and ex wives all looking for access to poor Fred's account and laying claim to Fred's stash of unused miles.

There's also the benefit of being able to remove a liability off the books with one press of a keystroke (without the risk of losing a loyal customer in the process!).

jdrtravel Apr 3, 2017 10:02 am

Does anyone know if DL actively searches any types of databases to find out if a pax has deceased?

Grog Apr 3, 2017 10:08 am


Originally Posted by rylan (Post 28122531)
Nothing has changed that I'm aware of... if a skymiles member dies and DL find out then the miles are gone. You can't leave them to someone through a will etc.

While I'm sure some here would call this 'unethical', your best bet in this unfortunate situation is to use the miles for award tickets and not alert Delta to their death.

'Unethical' defines the way Delta promised in writing that our original SkyMiles would never expire, and then reneged on that written promise later by saying "we can always change our T&Cs", even if they contained an absolute, indisputable promise inside them.

Delta outright lied to us (or were willing to break a clear promise). They did nothing--absolutely nothing--to restore the bad faith.

Screw 'ethics' when it comes to dealing with them.

Code:

"Delta Air Lines Member Update"
"Breaking News for Delta Frequent Flyers"

Announcing SKYMILES
our new program for you
Effective May 1, 1995

SKYMILES. More flexibility. More Options.
Delta Air Lines is committed to providing a valuable frequent flyer program for you--one that also makes good business sense for Delta. To achieve this goal, we asked a number of our best customers to participate in redesining our program. And together we developed a program that works for all of us. Effective May 1, 1995, we are proud to introduce your new frequent flyer program, SKYMILES.

---
Then, in a text box containing five key points, the second of which is...

Miles earned prior to May 1, 1995 never expire!

As long as Delta has a frequent flyer program, miles earned prior to May 1, 1995 will never expire. Miles earned on or after May 1, 1995 don't expire either, as long as you take a qualifying flight at least once every 36 months. We want you to keep the miles you've earned. It's that simple.

On the last page...
Questions and Answers about SKYMILES

third question...
Q: What is going to happen to the miles I earn prior to May 1, 1995?
A: Nothing. Miles you have earned prior to May 1, 1995 are yours to keep and redeem according to the rules and conditions of the current program. These miles will NEVER expire for as long as Delta has a frequent flyer program. Remember, you have the option of using those miles to redeem an award under the new SKYMILES program, simply by taking a qualifying flight.

On the back of the flyer...
copyright 1994 Delta Air Lines, Inc. Printed in the U.S.A. 4/94


CarmenOM Apr 3, 2017 10:13 am

So what would a family member of the deceased do about the small charges attached to a SkyMiles award ticket? Aren't credit card accounts frozen at the time of death? That would apply to whatever credit card is listed on the account. If I wanted to, could I add the credit card of one of my kids to my SM account to enable them to use the miles after I die?

If anyone from Delta is reading this, these questions are purely theoretical! I am in excellent health.

jdrtravel Apr 3, 2017 10:17 am


Originally Posted by CarmenOM (Post 28123270)
So what would a family member of the deceased do about the small charges attached to a SkyMiles award ticket? Aren't credit card accounts frozen at the time of death? That would apply to whatever credit card is listed on the account. If I wanted to, could I add the credit card of one of my kids to my SM account to enable them to use the miles after I die?

If anyone from Delta is reading this, these questions are purely theoretical! I am in excellent health.

You can use whatever credit card you want at the time of the transaction, you don't need to use a saved one, and the CC does not need to have the name that is on the SM account. Payment is separate.

dinanm3atl Apr 3, 2017 10:24 am


Originally Posted by CarmenOM (Post 28123270)
So what would a family member of the deceased do about the small charges attached to a SkyMiles award ticket? Aren't credit card accounts frozen at the time of death? That would apply to whatever credit card is listed on the account. If I wanted to, could I add the credit card of one of my kids to my SM account to enable them to use the miles after I die?

If anyone from Delta is reading this, these questions are purely theoretical! I am in excellent health.

Instantly locked? I doubt it.

Bill will still go to the house and can be paid for the taxes.

Grog Apr 3, 2017 10:27 am


Originally Posted by CarmenOM (Post 28123270)
So what would a family member of the deceased do about the small charges attached to a SkyMiles award ticket? Aren't credit card accounts frozen at the time of death? That would apply to whatever credit card is listed on the account. If I wanted to, could I add the credit card of one of my kids to my SM account to enable them to use the miles after I die?

If anyone from Delta is reading this, these questions are purely theoretical! I am in excellent health.

Someone's death isn't universally known to all. Companies are usually alerted to such by phone call from a friend, family member, or creditor. If no one calls anyone (or if they call and claim to be you and answer all of the questions correctly), credit cards and bank accounts could stay open for years.

To answer your question, yes: you could do that. But when/if your kids call in and they're asked "Who am I speaking to?", they'd have to be ready and willing to not answer truthfully. Some of us can handle that, while some of us can't.

flyerCO Apr 3, 2017 10:29 am


Originally Posted by jdrtravel (Post 28123011)
Although if someone had power of attorney or were an executor of an estate this would create a grey area.

POA terminates upon death. An executor only has control over the estate. Since the SM account is not owned by the person, it doesn't become part of the estate. Thus there's nothing the executor could do.

dinanm3atl Apr 3, 2017 10:30 am

These come up a few times a year it seems.

Sudden death it seems that hopefully have access. Buy tickets or use miles to buy other stuff ASAP.

If it is a prolonged or known death. Do the same as above.

Likely Delta has no one searching for deaths to clear out SkyMiles accounts.


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