I've never tried to sell it myself. But at the same time when people ask me about how I can afford to travel so much, it does get frustrating trying to explain it only to be met with scepticism. It's gotten to the point I don't even feel like telling anyone when I'm going out of town.

Why do you even want to explain this to people who think it's a foreign concept? The benefits we enjoy from milking the system will continue only as long as most people do not know how to milk the system.

Most of my discussions about how often I jaunt around go like this:

"Wow, you sure travel a lot. You must be rich."

"Not really. I know how to work the system."

"Cool."

END OF DISCUSSION

An alternative baby step I would suggest: If someone mostly travels by road, and has joined a hotel program, and that hotel program has a card with no (or better yet, "net negative") annual fee, get that card first, and learn that it helps you earn free nights a little faster.

Getting Freedom by itself and using it for auto pay makes no sense to me. Freedom is a card with rotating bonuses, so why pick that one? Plus if you don't pair it with an AF card (which is not necessarily a good first or even second baby step), it's just a cashback card.

If you're not going to chase the rotating bonuses with a Freedom card, it seems to me a Citi DoubleCash card, with twice the cashback of Freedom (and still 33% more cashback than Freedom Unlimited) would be a more logical first baby step.

But that's why Ilke hotel cards as a baby step for someone who stays in chain hotels anyway. Because while they earn real hotel points, most of them have no annual fee. Plus the also solve the problem of points expiration (if you don't stay with that chain often enough). With hotels you can baby steps into earning real points with no annual fee; with credit card programs (other than Amex with Everyday) you can't get beyond cashback without paying an annual fee. Similarly with airlines, you can't get into real miles (for more than the first year) without (at least quite possibly) paying an annual fee.

And finally, with a hotel card you learn the concept of "the points I earn from the card add to the points I earn from staying at the hotel". This is a powerful concept, because the points you earn from non-transferrable credit card programs don't combine with anything.

Though obviously for someone not into chain hotels that hotel card wouldn't necessarily work...

Yeah, this is how many conversations go. When I went to Asia with Cathay Pacific F for ~62k miles, my friend was like, "that few?!" I said, yeah but I had a rebate and then AA changed its award chart...friends interest trails off....once I get into details.

Whatever :D I only involve people if it benefits both of us, like referring my mom for a great offer on a card she'll actually use, or chatting with my one friend that did MS before me.

Yep, most of my friends say it's too complicated. A lot of them have a balance so not really worth it for people who are paying 15-35% interest on their cards. One friend is paranoid of people stealing their identity so they only have a debit card.

I think cash back is the easiest sell as its "free" money for everyday spending. Unfortunately I think my friends credit are too low for them. I started on cash back cards - signed up while in college for a t-shirt and free pizza -- it was the old 5% Citi Dividend card so it was a good deal. [I thought this card was closed ages ago, as I stopped using it around 2002, but received a letter in 2014 they had closed it.]

I do agree hotel cards would be a lot easier than airline ones as if you're going to a major city where there are multiple options you can often book a hotel as much as 2 month in advance and there's an option to cancel with no fee. While a flight you usually have to book it 6-12 months in advance and now most of them has a change fee.

We routinely get the questions about how we can afford to take the vacations like we do but when the answer goes past three sentences the eyes begin to glaze over. It takes time and effort but when you break it down the pay per hour invested is very good. Damn shame that the rules have changed so much as it seems that without MS the game is largely coming to an end.

Actually I meant to say Freedom Unlimited. But at first, if you start at slow as I suggested, the rewards would be so miniscule it almost doesn't matter. The whole point is getting a no fee card, using for recurring bills, then learning to pay off in full every month. The reason I suggested the FU is because it's my Rewards currency of choice. But you're right. A cash back card the gives 2% might be a better choice at first. Hell, even without the rewards it would be worth it just to minimize the amount of bills you have to pay every month.

This is how I got my retired parents into the game. They're financially literate and reasonably well-traveled, but when I took a free trip to Asia solely on signup bonuses, they were intrigued but don't fly much so didn't take the plunge. When I mentioned the Marriott Rewards card, my dad's eyes lit up. I think it's the first card either of them has ever had with an annual fee. I don't see CSRs in their future, but they fully understand why my brothers and I play the game.

I think this is a contestant for a new entry in Webster's for "counterproductive".

Talking to people out of the blue about the hobby gets me nothing more than blank stares and the occasional argument over credit scores and too many card, etc.

However, sometimes people have very specific needs and they are more receptive when you know a "trick" that will save them a lot of money. My friend doesn't travel that much and has too many kids and is going to have to fly them all across the country 3 times next year. I clued him into a few cards that will save him a few thousands bucks over the next year or so. He was much more receptive than anyone else that I've ever tried to sell on the hobby.

You'll get that even if they ask you about it first. And you're right. The subject of credit scores often comes up. People like to think they know what they're talking when they tell you how you're destroying you credit. The usually shut up when you ask to compare credit scores.

I have friends who are super healthy, eat right, go to the gym 4 times a week and are considerably thinner than I. I am sure they feel this is so simple just take the time to do things right and you will be healthy and fit and live longer, but when they tell me about this great kale shake my eyes gloss over and have no interest in listening any more as it sounds unpleasant and like too much work.

I'm almost to where I don't even want to tell anyone b/c the more in the game, the worse it gets. My peer group is in awe of my travel (with family of 5!) and says how much they'd love to do that. Sometimes I confess the points but these days I just say "yeah, I'm grateful that I can show my kids the world". Most of my points (~2m) are in MR or UR. That'd be $20k off my bill. If I put it to them that way, I bet they'd pay more attention. Of course, then I'd have to tell them that cashing out is the worst way.

What really goads me is the "I could never spare the time to do this." Okay, fine. But the tone insinuates that I have all of the time in the world. I do my MS and trip planning instead of playing golf on a Saturday. I do it standing in line at Target. I do it waiting at the dentist's office. Hell, I do it in the dentist chair!

I think OP has to be realistic that each person has a different value system.

IME - I don't mind explaining myself. However, I will not waste my time to explain something that people ain't interested.

Indeed, everyone must know someone like that, or Credit Karma's ad agency wouldn't have done because she wanted to save the other girl's credit (based on a misconception that checking your credit score on CK lowered your credit score).

If they don't want to take the time to hear me out, don't ask me about it.

Just saying.