Connecting in Cuba
 

In searching for reward tickets from SDQ to CDG, I found the following interesting option. This flight wasn't forced with a multi-city search, it was a standard return from the booking engine.

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Sat., Jun. 6, 2009

Depart:
9:10 a.m. - Santo Domingo, Dominican Republic (SDQ)
Arrive:
10:34 a.m. - Panama City, Panama (PTY)

Flight: CM 271
Aircraft: Boeing 737-700
Meal: Breakfast
No Special Meal Offered.


Change Planes. Connect time in Panama City, Panama (PTY) is 1 hour 44 minutes .


Depart:
12:18 p.m. - Panama City, Panama (PTY)
Arrive:
2:53 p.m. - Havana, Cuba (HAV)

Flight: CM 246
Aircraft: Boeing 737-800
Meal: Lunch
No Special Meal Offered.


Change Planes. Connect time in Havana, Cuba (HAV) is 5 hours 32 minutes .


Depart:
8:25 p.m. - Havana, Cuba (HAV)
Arrive:
11:20 a.m. +1 Day - Paris, France (CDG)

Flight: AF 479
Aircraft: Boeing 777-300ER
Meal: Breakfast
No Special Meal Offered.

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Is this legal for US citizens to accept? I believe the embargo technically allows travel to Cuba, but forbids US citizens from spending money there. Is this right?

Interestingly, if you search for flights to/from HAV on their own, you get this message:

! Neither Continental nor its codeshare partners serve Havana, Cuba (HAV) using a Continental flight number. You may modify your search criteria, or call 1-800-300-1547 for assistance.

I highly doubt that it is acceptable for anyone, as I do not think CO is allowed to sell tickets on any carrier that even traverse Cuba. Does Cuba have an international transfer facility that you could use to never enter Cuba while in transit? Not that it makes a difference, but it could be interesting.

I don't know if they have a transit area (I doubt it), but I do know that Cuban passport control knows not to stamp US passports. Either way, I doubt CO would let you ticket a flight through Cuba - especially if you're a US citizen.

I'm pretty sure that CO isn't allowed to sell that ticket at all, even using OnePass miles and all partner metal. I vaguely recall it being discussed once before and CO Insider confirming that.

I'd imagine you're right, but I was able to click all the way through the booking process (though I didn't ticket it...not worth the $150 redeposit fee :mad:)!

Cuba is a no go. In fact you can get into trouble if you just travel there, a friend of mine went there via canada and had some explaining to do when he wanted to come home.

I found the thread I was thinking of (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...ht=reward+cuba) and it actually really only discuses Iran, Syria and Sudan with definitive answers; Cuba remains an open question.

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_p.../cis_1097.html


No way.

I thought it was only illegal to spend money in Cuba, not actually go there...in that case you could theoretically be on solid legal footing, though it will still raise eyebrows. Cuban officials are also known not to stamp US passports upon request. I imagine it *might* be hard to tell you ever entered Cuba if you have a stamp from Panama then an entry stamp from France on consecutive days.

Well, the quote above would seem to make it off-limits. Though it is clear "transactions" (i.e. spending money) are a major component of the provision, I would imagine Cuba would collect some taxes from your airfare, thus meaning you "spent" money there.

That's a pretty simplistic (and naive) explanation - 95% of the world's population can travel there without so much as an eyebrow being raised, and even if you're in the 5% (US citizen) there are huge numbers of perfectly acceptable methods of traveling to Cuba. It's not as simple as "you can get into trouble".

Have a look at this - hard to believe they are talking about the same country :)
http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/travelling-...l-america/cuba

it is easy enough to change money

I highly doubt that CO would have charged you any amount to Redeposit the Miles if they allowed you to book an "Illegal" tkt. Heck they would have paid you the $150 just to avoid in getting into any trouble with the Feds for having done so

Can't remember where, but I recall a recent story on Bush administration increasing vigilance on prosecution of illegal travel to Cuba via third countries.

Might have been an NPR spot last yea. *shrugs* Personally I wouldn't do it.....but maybe some maverick, travelling alone might give it a shot and see what happens.

Count me in as someone who is absolutely intrigued with flying to Cuba. Beyond the cool factor, I hear the collection of old cars is amazing!

Go figure, I, that has no legal issues regarding going, don't feel the least bit atracted to it. A friend of mine went and he got increasingly pissed off with the constant "come on , give me some $= you are tourist , give us $" attitude (he didnt just stay in an all inclusive resort), bait and switch "the ride was x.....I never said it would cost 'y' ", fees to trade your Euros into Pesos and related bs (I guess I should be used to all that since we do it to the tourists too :D )

All you have to do is go there to "film" a "documentary", you'll be fine. :D

I was invited to go to Cuba years ago. Invite came 18 months before the trip to deal with State Department stuff. I passed on it because I didn't have over a week to take off from work and I knew a good friend of mine from Cuba would have read me the riot act if she found out I was going there. It would have been cool though.

Not directly relevant to the OP, but CO and CO Connection fly scheduled service to Havana from MIA (at least I think they still do). Tickets cannot be purchased from CO and must be bought through travel agents licensed by the Dept of Treasury.

My girlfriend flew HAV-MIA on American. I went to pick her up at the airport and getting flight and gate info was like pulling teeth. Finally I was able to track it online.

I have been to Cuba many times in my role as a member of the media (one of the exceptions granted for travel to Cuba is for the media under the doctrine of freedom of the press contained in the First Amendment)

The travel restriction to Cuba applies to spending money in Cuba so I would agree with other posters that if CO were to sell a ticket that involved travel in (or through) Cuba, Continental could likely get in trouble, because, even though no Cuban carrier is involved, part of the ticket cost covers Cuban airport fees and taxes.

As far as whether the traveler on this itinerary could get in trouble, I am not a lawyer, but I would imagine the same principle would apply, namely that the traveler would have spent a portion of the ticket purchase on Cuban airport fees and taxes and thus violated U.S. law prohibiting spending in Cuba.

I would imagine that the actual trip to Cuba would not be an issue, simply the revenue transferred to the Cuban authorities through the ticket purchase.

Cuba is not only interesting because it is a stunning timewarp, but it also happens to be a gorgeous Caribbean island with very friendly people and wonderful beaches.

Cuba today is overrun with tourists from virtually the entire developed world, including legions of Canadians and Europeans. But there are precious few Americans, except for the occasional journalist, filmmaker, and those who take those organized tours usually through Mexico.

Those with relatives, of course, continue to be allowed to visit on humanitarian grounds. The irony is the Miami's Cuban community, which is vociferously anti-Castro, remains one of the more significant sources of hard-currency income for the island.

Someday the Castro brothers will no longer control Cuba and there will be some major changes.

how would CO respond?
 

Is the OP wiling to ticket the itinerary and see how CO responds? I personally think they will cancel the itinerary as they did on the other thread (BOS-DCA-SAN with a stopover).

This scenario is fascinating -- we might have our first FTer arrested simply for flying on an airline (without obstructing the crew from their duties)! Well, I don't want the OP to be arrested, but I would love to know CO's response.

Read more closely what you posted - what the OP is asking is for travel through Cuba to a third country. This does not appear to be addressed, though I still think it would not be acceptable.

I'm fairly certain I have flown through Cuban airspace on CO93 before. Wouldn't that have involved being routed by Cuban air traffic controllers and presumably some fee paid by Continental to the Cuban government for using their airspace? How would paying fees to use Cuban airspace and air traffic control facilities be that much different than paying fees for using airport transit facilities? And if it is a problem, how does CO get away with using Cuban airspace?

I believe the overflight fee is around $40

CO still listed MIA-HAV on the flight monitors in MIA, last time I was there.

As a US citizen, working for a Canadian Co, selling INTO Cuba..i DREAD the phone call from the state dept every time a piece of equipment gets sold there!!! Ohhh..the allegations!!

And last i HEARD, the customs agents now HAVE to stamp ALL passports...but they may put a blank piece of paper in first!!

You don't have to go from Canada. There are other countries that don't bat an eye....:-:

I am thinking about a stealth DO.

Going to try to 'legal eagle' it in there?

Actually blogs are considered media these days, setup a legit blog and you can go on 1st amendment grounds ^

Gulfstream has HAV flights and Travel agencies approved by the US gov charter CO planes to and from HAV-MIA. I flew a CO plane back from HAV in 2002 when I went there. No ticket going to, from, or transiting HAV can be on 005 ticket stock, so I would be surprised if the system would let you complete that booking.

From the British FCO Webpage of star_world's link:

"You must pay an airport departure tax of 25 Convertible Pesos (CUCs) per person when leaving Cuba. This must be paid in local currency."

This would constitute "spending money in Cuba" in violation of US law, esp. since it goes to a Cuban govt. agency.

Please note that 1 CUC is pegged as = $1.08, but US$ exchanged in Cuba are subject to a 10% penalty tax, so U will pay about $1.20 for a peso. This penalty may be avoided by bringing Canadian $, English pounds (no Scottish or N.I.) or Euros.

Especially those that have big ships run through them...

Huh? Did you even read the BOS-DCA-SAN stopover thread? It's apples and oranges to this issue.

I'm really surprised you could book through because even Mexicana won't allow Americans to buy tickets to HAV onliine. You have to do it in person and not in the US. Unless you are under a special exemption, such as family visit, education or media junket, you are presumed to be spending money in Cuba the minute you land and violating. Yes, there is the airport fee of CUC 25, which translates into about $30 at the bloated official exchange rate, that is built into the price of the ticket, at least when you go via Cubana. (If you want a real aviation treat, try taking one of their YAK 43s.)

Well CM uses onepass, i'm pretty sure you can redeem if you're not from the US.

Somewhere around 1998 or 1999 the US government agreed to allow US airlines to pay the overflight fees to save time/money on the flights. Prior to that carriers did, in fact, have to fly around Cuban airspace.

Yes, but that will be a ticket on CM stock, which is different than a ticket on CO stock.

If you read the itin carefully, I don't see how this is an illegal ticket, except if a US citizen actually tickets it. We don't know if it actually would have allowed the ticket to process with a US address, and I don't think the OP specified if it was or wasn't.
1. From the DR to France, so no embargo in force on that route
2. No US carrier segments, just CM and AF
3. Wouldn't this be the same as going on the website of a Central American or Mexican airline and doing a basic reward search to/from/through Cuba? Without being logged and having your citizenship on file, they have no way to tell where you are from to prevent you from flying there. I assume a lot of other carriers would let you book for $ or miles without checking. In all practicality, why would LAN, et al. bother setting up a system to check and block US citizens from booking somewhere in South America to Cuba? It is probably easier to just block US-HUB-Cuba routings as not valid, like the 'invalid destination' we saw on the first post.

I know AA has a regular scheduled flight from MIA to Cuba.

Yes, but those are only charters for those of us allowed to travel there. I used Continental when we went for a visit 3 yrs ago. The bummer is that you accrue no miles for this trip since it is a "charter" flight.