They are different fare buckets, and it has been revealed that there are different groups within the revenue management department that handle the availability. That's why somtimes you'll see a flight with a reward ticket available and no upgrades, and sometimes you'll see the opposite (and many times you'll see neither!). So I don't think there's any "rule" about who has priority. Others may have comments based on experience as to whether one is generally more likely to open up before the other.

To the OP. I was waitlisted for PEK-IAH-PEK for months and months and my waitlist didn't clear either way. (I just got back Thursday afternoon.) I was unhappy about that, to say the least, but when it came time to fly coach wasn't full and I got a row to myself on the way to IAH and an empty seat next to me on the way back to PEK. I hadn't even stopped to consider this possibility, being so preoccupied with the waitlist's clearing.

Having flown BizFirst before, I have to say that if I could know I'd enjoy a less than full coach cabin, I would never try to upgrade again. In my opinion, BizFirst is not worth the miles or the money if you can score empty seats next to you in the back.

So if you don't get upgraded, don't fret too much. I quite happily survived 13+ hours in the back of the bus!

Scott

And if you can get two tickets to, say, Europe in the off season for ~$500-700, you might as well...buy two tickets for yourself. It will be cheaper than paying the upgrade co-pay!

And if there are two of you traveling together, buy three seats in coach -- significant savings over the BF co-pays!

I have to agree with Houstonredhead. I didn't clear a couple of times in BF and then I had a whole row to myself and got to stretch out in coach. It was really fine. You do forget that that might be an option...

As CO 1E said, waitlist close out 24 hours before the flight.

One can still wailist, even on the day of departure at the airport, for a reward ticket (not an upgrade) should they have redeemed a BF reward and not been able to confirm seats upfront.

No.

Many reasons are tossed around here as to why BF upgrades do not clear at the airport. While most of them have some merit, channa's explanation is spot on as the cold hard truth of the matter is that CO felt they were loosing too much cold hard cash through people screwing with inventory (this pratice is often referred to as 'phantoms' or 'ghosts' here) to permit BF upgrades that the airport.

People often chide CO for "wanting to protect the integrity of their BusniessFirst product" and sight how the customers' experinces will not be negatively impacted by doing X or implementing policy Y. But what they fail to realize is the invisible word in this statement: revenue. I do not think CO feels the product integrity of BF will be threatened by allowing the cabin to fill up with upgraders on the day of departure, rather the revenue integrity will be threatened as hopeful upgraderes may engage in less than scrupulous ways to secure their front cabin seat at the expense of a fare paying J customer.

FWIW, my recent waitlists to BF have cleared (IAH-LGW) but did so only a few days before departure. Capt. Obvious is quick to point out CO would rather sell those J seats than give them away -- but should the powers that be decide the seats probably wont be sold, than they'll start to release them over to F (which is the upgrade fare bucket). So, don't give up hope yet as upgrades DO clear... they just might do so a few days before the flight.

Good luck :)

I'm confused
 

A question. How can you "ghost" book a seat? You can't reserver and buy the day of departure anymore (right?), so you would have to buy and pay. You could in theory, no show or cancel day of and refund the ticket, but my guess is that Continental would be able to flag the number of times a credit card number or a person does that stuff. There has to be a way, but CO has got to WANT to do that and the bottom line is I don't think they WANT to allow U/Gs less than 24 hours out. What I don't understand is how they could let elites sit in the back and allow non-revs to fly up front. I understand it is a requirement for some and perk for others who are employees, but doesn't that just seem counter-intuitive to allow your BEST customers to take a "back seat" to your employees?

One would buy a refundable J fare.

Yeep. I believe folks were 'buying' full J tickets on their CC's close to their flight so the charge and refund could be conducted in the same billing cycle.

Again, I think you're right. Granted people could use different CC's and names but regardless of how sophisticated the upgrade seeking customer was CO came to notice what they considered an unacceptable amount of last minute cancellations.


I do think CO wants to upgrade us - I mean think about it, it's a win-win. What CO does not want is the integrity of their BF revenue stream jeopardized. When a customer wants to do a BF upgrade CO will either collect more cash as a result (the upgrade fee) or they would have collected more cash upfront due to selling a more expensive Y ticket. Add to that upgraded customers are happy customers and happy customers are repeat customers... meaning even more potential $$$ for CO.


1. CO feels that in allowing elite to sit up front (via DOD upgrades) the revenue intregrity of BF will be jeopardized. As such, elite, or any other customer, are not upgraded DOD and BF seats can potentially go out empty.

2. Employees have the perk of being able to snag empty seats on flights assuming they exist. As one can argue empty seats are more likely with no DOD upgrades confirmed for OP members, they're more BF seats for the non-revs.

3. I guess the non-revs could create phantoms in the BF cabin to assure them of their seat... but I'd assume such actions are risky... very risky... and therefore avoid 'ghosting' when trying to secure their upgrade. Point is non-revs do not/did not cause the inventory problems FF'ers did.

4. As the BF seats will be empty anyway, and non-revs do not generate phantoms (or at least enough phantoms to be a problem) CO allows them the perk of being able to standby DOD for BF.

Spot on.

But in the same vein CO's 'best' customers are already sitting in BF... on paid tickets (I a'int saying I agree with this, just what I'm guessing CO thinks of the situation). And while CO is happy to sell full fare Y/H/K/etc. tickets to Plat/Gold/Silver elites and upgrade them to BF when they feel space will be open, they're even more happy to sell full J tickets to a last minute, schedule conscious (business) customer... even if s/he will only fly CO a handful of times during that year.

If we want DOD upgrades, we will have to show CO a scenario where their BF revenue stream will not be compromised by phantom bookings.