Waitlisted Upgrade?
 

I am a Platinum and I am flying to Paris from Newark in March and returning through Houston. I tried to use my miles to upgrade but they said all the seats were taken in the upgrade class, but they offered to waitlist me. I had never heard about this before for mileage upgrades (I don't travel internationally that much). Is there a point were they would just give me any BF seat available? Should I hold out any hope of actually getting the upgrade or will I probably remain stuck on the waitlist?

Thanks and sorry if this is posted somewhere else. I am just getting used to this site.

I can give you my two cents, but I won't be able to improve on all the other posts on the matter.

I have waited listed for BusinessFirst and have successfully cleared. March sounds like a promising month for CDG. If you want to fly BF, why not try. The sooner you get on the waitlist, the better off you'll be--higher priority. So, if you're interested in BF, get on the waitlist ASAP. If you're on an H (or Y) fare, you'll only pay with miles; any other coach fare has a co-pay. You won't have to pay any cash until the upgrade clears.

By the way, since you're platinum, you're able to grab choice seats in coach. I'd check out seatguru and select the seat you want--I like exit row window--and call to secure it.

Good luck!

Definitely not. The waitlist expires 24 hours prior to departure; if your upgrade award has not cleared by then, it will NEVER clear. That's how OnePass works. I do believe that CO tries its best to match remaining supply with expected demand, but they are not always 100% correct. Sometimes this helps you (when they upgrade you and end up having to forego a paid BF ticket sale), and sometimes it hurts you. There have certainly been instances of people here whose upgrades have not cleared despite there being empty seats (or nonrevs/employees) in BF upon departure, either due to last minute cancellations or because they didn't sell the last few seats they were holding back.

Why is that? Surely it can't be that hard to keep the waitlist going up until departure (especially with international check-in closing earlier than domestic) DL, AA, and even US AIRWAYS are capable of doing that. If US can do it (even in Philly) then clearly it can't be that complicated, I am constantly surprised they ever manage to get every checked-in passenger on the plane so this cannot be too hard. There is no reason that non-revs should be able to fly up front when there are people willing to pay miles and money to do so. I understand CO wants to hold out until the last minute to get someone to pay or upgrade using miles, but it seems that once check-in was closed they could go to the waitlist for any remaining seats. I know this has been discussed before, but has there ever been a satisfactory answer explaining CO's reasoning?

Because that's their policy. The waitlist used to end 72 hours prior to departure but was recently loosened to only 24 hours after much complaining.

Satisfactory? I guess that depends on who you ask...

There were apparently some purported phantom bookings trying to block inventory and game the system.

Last year, that's 2006, COInsider informed us all that the 24 hour expiration date has gone. The waitlist now stays open until the flight is ready to depart.

The post was interesting, because it gave a very reasoned explanation as to why they had the 24 hour window.

The waitlisting has always driven me a little crazy. I've been platinum this past year, and I've been waitlisted for an upgrade many times. I usually pay the lowest price and then if I clear, they charge me the $450 or whatever it is. Recently I was waitlisted CDG-EWR on the 767 flight at 2pm, and there was only 1 seat left until a few days before I few. I thought it was impossible, but I got a note 2 days before the flight saying I cleared the upgrade list and was sitting in BF. That was pretty exciting, and it all worked out, but it does add undo stress wondering if you're going in the back or front...

Most recently I bought a ticket EWR-DEL. I was told the upgrade seats were available, and paid the higher fare class price plus some fees exchanging an unused ticket to Europe I had from the summer with the same fees ($350 1 way, $200 the other) so they matched the fare classes. All seemed good until I got my itinerary online and it said WAITLISTED on both flights. Surprise! That's not what they had said when I got the new ticket. What really stinks is that my sister is on the same EWR-DEL flight, got her tix a couple of days before me using a complete reward ticket, and got a BF seat at 45,000 miles the one way. I paid, cashed in 40,000 miles, paid the upgrade fee, and I find out I'm in the back. She's not even Elite. I just hope I clear and get to fly in the front with her.

So yeah, you do clear, especially as a Plat, but it's not too much fun waiting around to find out. My friend who flys AA seems to always get an upgrade without much fanfare or stress, but then again, they suck, and she knows that. But at least she's in a comfy seat...

Rats, I was this close to waitlisting on AA (where I am only a Platinum). I was told when booking that this would be no problem.

AA has some interesting ways to upgrade. If your an EXP, you get upgrade on a large percentage of domestic flights--they're complimentary. They also give SWU's to upgrade on international flights: 8 a year for EXP's--that's four round trips. Not a bad deal.

Thanks again for all of your help. I just had one more question (well actually a set of related questions).

When it gets closer to the date of flight and assuming Continental starts releasing more seats do I have precedence over those waitlisting for a reward seat in BusinessFirst or are they two completely different fare classes. If they are different fare buckets, how do they determine which one to release the seats into and would they be more likely to put them into the total reward category or the upgrade reward category? This whole system completely baffles me.

Hey Continental Fan can you post a link to that? The website still shows that it is 24 hours and I searched and couldn't find anything. Would like to see the reasoning behind it.

Thanks!

That is incorrect. The 24-hour waitlist rule still applies for BF mileage upgrades. See, for example, CO Insider's reply to a question about BF mileage upgrades:

The CO website is correct: BF mileage upgrade waitlists expire 24 hours prior to departure.

I'd love to see that post too, because I don't remember it!!! :)

They are different fare buckets, and it has been revealed that there are different groups within the revenue management department that handle the availability. That's why somtimes you'll see a flight with a reward ticket available and no upgrades, and sometimes you'll see the opposite (and many times you'll see neither!). So I don't think there's any "rule" about who has priority. Others may have comments based on experience as to whether one is generally more likely to open up before the other.

To the OP. I was waitlisted for PEK-IAH-PEK for months and months and my waitlist didn't clear either way. (I just got back Thursday afternoon.) I was unhappy about that, to say the least, but when it came time to fly coach wasn't full and I got a row to myself on the way to IAH and an empty seat next to me on the way back to PEK. I hadn't even stopped to consider this possibility, being so preoccupied with the waitlist's clearing.

Having flown BizFirst before, I have to say that if I could know I'd enjoy a less than full coach cabin, I would never try to upgrade again. In my opinion, BizFirst is not worth the miles or the money if you can score empty seats next to you in the back.

So if you don't get upgraded, don't fret too much. I quite happily survived 13+ hours in the back of the bus!

Scott

And if you can get two tickets to, say, Europe in the off season for ~$500-700, you might as well...buy two tickets for yourself. It will be cheaper than paying the upgrade co-pay!

And if there are two of you traveling together, buy three seats in coach -- significant savings over the BF co-pays!

I have to agree with Houstonredhead. I didn't clear a couple of times in BF and then I had a whole row to myself and got to stretch out in coach. It was really fine. You do forget that that might be an option...

As CO 1E said, waitlist close out 24 hours before the flight.

One can still wailist, even on the day of departure at the airport, for a reward ticket (not an upgrade) should they have redeemed a BF reward and not been able to confirm seats upfront.

No.

Many reasons are tossed around here as to why BF upgrades do not clear at the airport. While most of them have some merit, channa's explanation is spot on as the cold hard truth of the matter is that CO felt they were loosing too much cold hard cash through people screwing with inventory (this pratice is often referred to as 'phantoms' or 'ghosts' here) to permit BF upgrades that the airport.

People often chide CO for "wanting to protect the integrity of their BusniessFirst product" and sight how the customers' experinces will not be negatively impacted by doing X or implementing policy Y. But what they fail to realize is the invisible word in this statement: revenue. I do not think CO feels the product integrity of BF will be threatened by allowing the cabin to fill up with upgraders on the day of departure, rather the revenue integrity will be threatened as hopeful upgraderes may engage in less than scrupulous ways to secure their front cabin seat at the expense of a fare paying J customer.

FWIW, my recent waitlists to BF have cleared (IAH-LGW) but did so only a few days before departure. Capt. Obvious is quick to point out CO would rather sell those J seats than give them away -- but should the powers that be decide the seats probably wont be sold, than they'll start to release them over to F (which is the upgrade fare bucket). So, don't give up hope yet as upgrades DO clear... they just might do so a few days before the flight.

Good luck :)

I'm confused
 

A question. How can you "ghost" book a seat? You can't reserver and buy the day of departure anymore (right?), so you would have to buy and pay. You could in theory, no show or cancel day of and refund the ticket, but my guess is that Continental would be able to flag the number of times a credit card number or a person does that stuff. There has to be a way, but CO has got to WANT to do that and the bottom line is I don't think they WANT to allow U/Gs less than 24 hours out. What I don't understand is how they could let elites sit in the back and allow non-revs to fly up front. I understand it is a requirement for some and perk for others who are employees, but doesn't that just seem counter-intuitive to allow your BEST customers to take a "back seat" to your employees?

One would buy a refundable J fare.

Yeep. I believe folks were 'buying' full J tickets on their CC's close to their flight so the charge and refund could be conducted in the same billing cycle.

Again, I think you're right. Granted people could use different CC's and names but regardless of how sophisticated the upgrade seeking customer was CO came to notice what they considered an unacceptable amount of last minute cancellations.


I do think CO wants to upgrade us - I mean think about it, it's a win-win. What CO does not want is the integrity of their BF revenue stream jeopardized. When a customer wants to do a BF upgrade CO will either collect more cash as a result (the upgrade fee) or they would have collected more cash upfront due to selling a more expensive Y ticket. Add to that upgraded customers are happy customers and happy customers are repeat customers... meaning even more potential $$$ for CO.


1. CO feels that in allowing elite to sit up front (via DOD upgrades) the revenue intregrity of BF will be jeopardized. As such, elite, or any other customer, are not upgraded DOD and BF seats can potentially go out empty.

2. Employees have the perk of being able to snag empty seats on flights assuming they exist. As one can argue empty seats are more likely with no DOD upgrades confirmed for OP members, they're more BF seats for the non-revs.

3. I guess the non-revs could create phantoms in the BF cabin to assure them of their seat... but I'd assume such actions are risky... very risky... and therefore avoid 'ghosting' when trying to secure their upgrade. Point is non-revs do not/did not cause the inventory problems FF'ers did.

4. As the BF seats will be empty anyway, and non-revs do not generate phantoms (or at least enough phantoms to be a problem) CO allows them the perk of being able to standby DOD for BF.

Spot on.

But in the same vein CO's 'best' customers are already sitting in BF... on paid tickets (I a'int saying I agree with this, just what I'm guessing CO thinks of the situation). And while CO is happy to sell full fare Y/H/K/etc. tickets to Plat/Gold/Silver elites and upgrade them to BF when they feel space will be open, they're even more happy to sell full J tickets to a last minute, schedule conscious (business) customer... even if s/he will only fly CO a handful of times during that year.

If we want DOD upgrades, we will have to show CO a scenario where their BF revenue stream will not be compromised by phantom bookings.