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Quote:

Originally Posted by sbm12 (Post 12814297)

Because CO uses the same bucket to sell upgrades as they do to give them away. And they are very much trying to sell them.

Hold on there a second -- CO, per their own admission, is only selling upgrades if they predict F seats will go empty. Theoretically there should be no competition for an upgrade-for-$ vis-a-vis an EUA as the former would never be offered if 100% of the latter was not satisfied.

Granted they could upsell F in terms a fare difference, but that again would not relate to the EUA/upgrade bucket as it would be pegged to a revenue one.

...and this is just in relation to automatic upgrades. God help you get on the right list, with the right priority if you're on a Plan B or mileage request upgrade!

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbm12 (Post 12814894)

If you request a miles or certificate upgrade from CO then it clears when the inventory opens up. Just like on UA.

Yes and no.

As long as the flight is still in the waitlist phase (I'm guessing that's before gets transferred to airport control) CO will process the upgrades instantly, just like on UA.

However at the airport and during the EUA window there's no mechanism to automatically clear upgrades in real time. This is different from UA's system where both customers waitlisting as well as those standing by are cleared as seats open up, not in set intervals.

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.Edward (Post 12814977)

I meant offering the fare-difference buy-ups. Sorry for the misstatement. Or they are holding out hope for selling Y/B/M fares to elites and giving them instant upgrades.

But, yes, they are trying to sell more of the higher fares for upgrades rather than upgrading folks on L fares.

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.Edward (Post 12814999)

However at the airport and during the EUA window there's no mechanism to automatically clear upgrades in real time. This is different from UA's system where both customers waitlisting as well as those standing by are cleared as seats open up, not in set intervals.

I was under the impression that it only stops with the auto-upgrade when you are inside T-24, not during the 96 hours between T-120 when EUA starts and T-24 when OLCI starts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbm12 (Post 12814894)

Actually I was suggesting that we simply discuss the entire system. Measuring a specific route and extrapolating that out to reflect the entire company's operations is just silly. I think that it actually makes sense to consider the entire company, not just the route(s) that any one of us think might be important on any given day.

The suggestion that anywhere close to 13% of the flights on a given day were affected by the OLCI upgrade loophole is preposterous. Simply laughable. There's no way.

You're talking about two different things. If you request a miles or certificate upgrade from CO then it clears when the inventory opens up. Just like on UA. The EUA is a different beast and operates as such. We'll have to see how EUAs play out.

This was your posit, after all.

All I did was point out that your proportions were not likely accurate.

You discussed this issue having possibly occurred on 20 out of 2,000 flights. First, the universe of "competitive" flights is at least +-136 flights a day, and the basis is no more than about 1,000 flights, since all the remaining flights are operated by the regional partners and thus have no premium class.

There is a huge statistical difference between 20 out 2,000 flights (1%) and 136 out 1,000 flights (13%).

Now, whether or not the loophole occurred on 20, 136 or more flights a day I don't think anyone beyond the confines of Smith St has any way of knowing.