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-   -   bullet train accident (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/china/1239982-bullet-train-accident.html)

chenny02 Jul 28, 2011 10:37 am

I think it is him
 
I think the authority threats him that he might be jailed, if he keeps on. If he is in jail, he will not be able to take care of his father in law. That is, what I think, he meant.

The Accident is definitely a tragety. What happened afterwards is a shame.

jiejie Jul 28, 2011 11:44 am

Interesting Op-Ed piece
 
Here it is, and in China Daily, no less. The author eloquently puts his finger on one of the most pervasive and troubling drivers of modern Chinese behavior (individual and governmental)--the need to "beat" or "be better than" somebody else.

susiesan Jul 28, 2011 12:07 pm

This story is getting a high level of play here in the US. Something about it every day. Here's today's story:

http://news.yahoo.com/china-train-cr...011250335.html

Looks like some Chinese worker bee is about to be thrown under the bus, I mean, train. Blame it on the rail staff:

"Soon after the crash, domestic media had blamed foreign technology. But Thursday, railway authorities said a signal, that should have turned red after lightning hit the train that stalled, remained green, and rail staff then failed to see something was amiss, the state-run Xinhua news agency said."

moondog Jul 28, 2011 12:10 pm


Originally Posted by chenny02 (Post 16814924)
I
The Accident is definitely a tragety. What happened afterwards is a shame.

While I agree with you that dodging bullets is shameful, I feel compelled to proclaim that China's (nearly nonexistent) tort program is one of the main reasons that makes it an attractive destination for FDI.

Suppose I want to build a playground and my two choices are Changchun and Fresno (similar real estate prices). I will choose Changchun because I can save $500 per square meter (mostly in insurance premiums).

And, if a kid dies on my playground, a fair settlement will be proclaimed within the course of a week; lawyer fees <$2,000.

China's tort laws are in need of an upgrade, for sure (e.g. polished marble floors suck). But, the system seems to work okay at present.

anacapamalibu Jul 28, 2011 12:34 pm


Originally Posted by jiejie (Post 16815429)
[the need to "beat" or "be better than" somebody else.

"Faster and Higher" seems to work for their economy.

Beat or be better can be translated into "make more money".

anacapamalibu Jul 28, 2011 12:55 pm


Originally Posted by moondog (Post 16815621)
China's tort laws are in need of an upgrade, for sure (e.g. polished marble floors suck). But, the system seems to work okay at present.

Chinese courts operate on the importance of equity and justice.
US courts rule based on the "law".

A recent high profile case in the US gives an good example of
the possible result when the trier of fact must rule "strictly"
on the "law".

Taiwaned Jul 28, 2011 4:58 pm


Originally Posted by anacapamalibu (Post 16815963)
Chinese courts operate on the importance of equity and justice.
US courts rule based on the "law".

Getting off topic but facinating nevertheless.

Agree with this statement, problem is "equity and justice" for whom? Unfortunately in China, the definition is most times skewed for equity and justice for the rich and powerful or the ones with "guanxi".

It is the primary topic of conversation here in Wenzhou City. Amazing thing here is the attitude of the locals here. "It is what it is" "Sure it is unfair but what can we do?" "This is China" "Justice is for the wealthy" It is almost like they have given up on the concept and accept the decisions of those who are above them.

It is a facinating country.

anacapamalibu Jul 28, 2011 6:54 pm

[QUOTE=Taiwaned;16817608] "Justice is for the wealthy" It is almost like they have given up on the concept and accept the decisions of those who are above them.
QUOTE]

I don't believe economic injustice is a Chinese phenomenon.

Taiwaned Jul 28, 2011 9:42 pm

[QUOTE=anacapamalibu;16818228]

Originally Posted by Taiwaned (Post 16817608)
"Justice is for the wealthy" It is almost like they have given up on the concept and accept the decisions of those who are above them.
QUOTE]

I don't believe economic injustice is a Chinese phenomenon.

LOL - absolutely not.

However it is so transparent here and it seems like everybody is just resigned to it. This fatalistic resignation in their lot in life.

anacapamalibu Jul 28, 2011 10:04 pm

[QUOTE=Taiwaned;16818937]

Originally Posted by anacapamalibu (Post 16818228)

LOL - absolutely not.

However it is so transparent here and it seems like everybody is just resigned to it. This fatalistic resignation in their lot in life.

As a foreigner you should convey to them that the eyes of the world are on them and they should stand tall and every adversity has the seed of an equivalent benefit.

moondog Jul 28, 2011 10:34 pm

[QUOTE=Taiwaned;16818937]

Originally Posted by anacapamalibu (Post 16818228)

LOL - absolutely not.

However it is so transparent here and it seems like everybody is just resigned to it. This fatalistic resignation in their lot in life.

Better than being mesmerized my Rupert Murdoch's empire. Fortunately, Big Brother saw through the "marry a Chinese gal, infiltrate minds" ploy.

As the US government continues on its fatalistic path, I find myself increasingly impressed with the Chinese system (on a relative basis, of course; the US is still better on the whole due to that "constitution" thing).

I also applaud the power of the internet; it appears that Big Brother has his hands tied with respect to 微博.

anacapamalibu Jul 28, 2011 11:12 pm

[QUOTE=moondog;16819127][QUOTE=Taiwaned;16818937]
Better than being mesmerized my Rupert Murdoch's empire. Fortunately, Big Brother saw through the "marry a Chinese gal, infiltrate minds" ploy.
QUOTE]

Old dude ain't quite that savy. More like dragon lady spikes the perp
to insure that prenup payout.

mnredfox Jul 29, 2011 2:13 am


Originally Posted by azepine00 (Post 16810345)
+1. Unless we see a pattern of new accidents I'll assume new trains are just as safe as flying or perhaps driving in LA.

Sadly, in China it takes people dying to get real action. I don't think another train crash will occur at least til next year.

tauphi Jul 29, 2011 8:31 am


Originally Posted by mnredfox (Post 16819751)
Sadly, in China it takes people dying to get real action. I don't think another train crash will occur at least til next year.

Well it isn't just China, look at the history of safety in the airline industry.

Scifience Jul 29, 2011 9:59 am


Originally Posted by jiejie (Post 16815429)
Here it is, and in China Daily, no less. The author eloquently puts his finger on one of the most pervasive and troubling drivers of modern Chinese behavior (individual and governmental)--the need to "beat" or "be better than" somebody else.

Even CCTV is jumping on the bandwagon now:

http://tv.sohu.com/20110726/n314600374.shtml


Originally Posted by CCTV
We need to ask four questions that must not be ignored by the Ministry of Railways:

1. Was this really lightning that caused the accident?
2. Why did the train behind not know that the train in front had stopped?
3. Why were the trains buried so quickly before saving lives of the victims?
4. Why has there been no list of passenger names published yet?

http://video.sina.com.cn/v/b/57371456-1741995950.html


Originally Posted by CCTV
If nobody is safe, should we still want this kind of speed? Can we drink safe milk? Can we live in a flat that won't collapse? Can roads we travel in our cities not fall? Why can we not travel in safe trains? And when an accident does occur, why are we in such a hurry to bury the trains? Where is the people's sense of security? Please, China, slow down! Going too fast will leave the souls of our people abandoned.

Sorry if the translations are somewhat rough... in any case, from a civil society development perspective, this incident has proven very interesting indeed. And the aftermath appears, dare I say, quite promising.


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