I can see the headlines now - Homeless man sues TSA over loss of hand when lotion donated exploded!

Where is the logic of the TSA (rhetorical question) - it's either a risk/safety issue or it's not. Stop trying to pretend your looking out for the safety of the airline industry and then turn around and do something so ridiculous.

Nonsense. Either these things are safe, or they're not. If they're safe, don't confiscate them. If they're not, don't give them to the homeless, treat them as hazardous materials. You can't have it both ways.

All righty then let me see if I can clarify this more. I have been to training where two liquids are combined that are in themselves not considered explosive till they are combined. The liquids by themselves are a hazmat but not in a quantity that has to be disposed of as a hazmat. This is according to ground rules (DOT) whereby you have to have an amount that is over a limit before it has to be disposed of as a hazmat. Some things you need to have gallons of in order to treat them as a hazmat. So therein is the misunderstanding. You have 4 oz of a liquid and TSA doesnt know what it is. You cannot take it on the plane but it is only four ounces and doesnt qualify due to "quantity" regardless of what it is, as a hazmat. It can be put in a huge bin with no precautions and it is the airport not the TSA that decides how to dispose of those huge bins of liquids. The other interesting thing is that if it was a hazmat at its face value (like checked bags with a gallon of bleach in it or a chainsaw with a full tank of gasoline), then it is up to the airline that you are flying on to come and deal with it. TSA is not the hazmat police. TSA has a duty to inform the airline of potential FAA violations relating to hazmat that is attempting to be put on the plane.
The liquid ban probably isnt going away. Sometimes I think that someone in high places watched too many James Bond movies.

I know members of the media peruse this forum fairly frequently.

So I am directing my next comments only at them...

Why don't you people show some cajones and start investigating this stuff??? How about the No Fly List? That fiasco died after the 60 Minutes broadcast...where is the follow-up? Where is the outrage?

When are we going to see an investigation into this type of illogical behavior by the TSA?

Until we get rid of the liquid ban, which I hope is really, really soon, does it make more sense to just destroy the 'dangerous' personal hygiene supplies or give them to someone who can use them.

I agree that it is a double standard, and I want the stupid ban gone just as quickly as you do, but given the situation, I think that more good comes from giving this stuff to someone who can use it than just tossing it or going through the expense of hazmat storage / disposal. We all know that it is just security window dressing anyway.

So when you toss those confiscated liquid bottles into the trash can next to passengers lined up, they could potentially cause an explosion and injur some of those passengers? I thought TSA was for protecting us.

Field trip to a high school chemistry class?

So, since the individual containers do not qualify as a quantifiable hazmat item [my bold], they can be loaded into a "huge bin" with other non-quantifiable hazmat items [my underline]? Since, as you have mentioned in several posts, the TSA is not the "hazmat police," who makes the determination on when a quantifiable level of hazmat has been reached in these "huge bins?"

Sorry - the Hazmat-operations certified EMT part of my brain does not find this logical. Combining non-quantifiable Hazmats in a large bin leads to a more extensive Hazmat situation:

1. Multiple Hazmat components
2. Unknown total quantities
3. Potential synergistic effects of various hazmat components

If we, the traveling public, are being told that liquids are not permitted beyond a certain size due to hazmat and potential explosive use, ALL confiscated liquids MUST be treated as complete, individual hazmat exposures with commensurate hazmat mitigation efforts applied, regardless of the container presented or labeling shown on said container - remember, the TSA is not the Hazmat Police, they cannot be sure of the hazmat status of any individual item. Either that - or admit that this is unjustifiable BS of the highest order and stop the F-ing charade.

No we went out an blew up airplanes!

Couldn't have put it better myself.

Okay once again its the people on this board that insist that TSA is telling people that they cant take liquids on a plane because they may be explosive therefore they should be treated as hazmat. If they were treated as hazmat, as you well know, the cost to dispose of them would be astronomical. The purpose of the no liquid over 3.4 oz is to prevent any possible binary explosives from getting on. It is a deterrent to someone thinking about it. Remember in hazmat training that if you know that it is, or you discover that it is, then it is YOUR responsibility to properly dispose of it. Since we dont know and we are not allowed to know then it is treated as a plain liquid. ORM/D wont make it either.

God help us all.

How is it that you are not allowed to know what hazmat materials are, but you are allowed to know what illegal drugs look like?

No offense, but this is one of the most contradictory policies I've ever heard. In a nutshell, you're saying that liquids are not hazmat/explosive/dangerous at the checkpoint, but they *could* be if they got onboard an aircraft....and the determining factor is the cost of disposal?

Either they are, or they're not - they can't be treated two different ways based on where they're located in the terminal. If your agency is confiscating them as potentially dangerous and hazardous material, they should be treated as such and disposed of appropriately.

The whole "binary liquids" theory is bogus anyway outside controlled lab conditions, as many scientists and industry professionals have already demonstrated.

So five guys decide to carry full ziplocs with "binary explosives" in an assortment of little < 3 oz. bottles. They all stow their bags close to each other in the overheads and while no one is looking they consolidate to one bag.

No, you're right. It's impossible. The exclusions for baby formula and prescription drugs make it even more impossible. :rolleyes:

You contradict yourself in your own words. In one sentence, you state that it is people here screaming that the TSA treat liquids as hazmat. In the other, you plainly state that the TSA's reason for the liquid carnival is since anything over 3.4 liquid oz could be used as a component in a binary EXPLOSIVE - in discussions with several highly-qualified Hazmat Technicians, I have learned there are not very many chemical compounds that are part of a binary explosives recipe that are not themselves HAZMAT components regardless of size of item.

Your hazmat training must have been significantly different than the National Fire Academy approved Operator level (first responder...the actual Hazmat techs are trained at least to Technician level) course that I went through as part of my required training at my volunteer department. That course, which is supposed to train first responders to recognize potential hazards and their initial mitigations, maintains that if I have the remotest thought in my head that the material(s) in question may be Hazmat, I am to initiate a Hazmat response. Call the cavalry, request all the manpower and specially-trained personnel and allow them to PROPERLY and SAFELY identify the component and the APPROPRIATELY dispose of it.

The liquid carnival is not a deterrent. As others have mentioned, there is nothing in this asinine policy to prevent several people from carrying upwards of 20 oz of fluid, EACH, into the sterile area and recombining them prior to boarding an aircraft...absolutely NOTHING, zip, zero, NADA. Don't give me the standard BS of the Explosives Detectors catching it...the only time the TSA uses the damn thing is when the X-Ray tech detects an "anomaly" in their routine scans. Given the number of times they haven't said a damn thing when I have forgotten to remove my INHALER from my bag...needless to say, I still profess this is an asinine, WORTHLESS carnival that is a total mockery of even the SHADOW of security.