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-   Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate-687/)
-   -   How I brought aboard a bottle of water... (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/593462-how-i-brought-aboard-bottle-water.html)

Spiff Aug 22, 2006 3:23 pm


Originally Posted by crimyla
Instead of not allowing 5 year olds to carry their juice boxes aboard a plane, why don't they screen the baggage handlers and the people who supply the on board food carts?

Because that would be "intelligent security" instead of "senseless passenger harassment".

Comrades Chertoff and Hawley only have 1 play in the play book and there's nothing even remotely intelligent about it.

SJCFlyerLG Aug 22, 2006 3:29 pm


Originally Posted by Chuckles
At BUR last Friday (Aug 18), WN was doing random checks of carry-on bags at the gate......

WN staff or TSA? I have never seen any airline employees ever search a passenger's belongings. They have a right to make you check oversize bags, but what gives them the rights to do a search? AA barks at PAX during the initial boarding call, but certainly they do not search.

mikeon Aug 22, 2006 3:51 pm

deleted

NZguy Aug 22, 2006 5:27 pm

The only way to stop this lunacy is to take action. If we are sheep, then the oppressive state will take advantage of that. Business travellers should unite! Write to your congressman. THe frequent business travellers are among the highest paid people in the United States. Use that clout. Don't make the screening easy for TSA. Question it. If you have time, do the secondary screening. (I always did this when I had time and the "recommended" that you take off your shoes.)

Taking off shoes, becoming dehydrated, and having bad breath are all ways that you empower a totolitarian regime.

bocastephen Aug 22, 2006 6:35 pm


Originally Posted by kaukau
bocastephen's gonna tell 'em what to do:

Yes, I sure will. Toss them each a quarter and tell them to go buy some cajones.

crimyla Aug 22, 2006 6:47 pm

how does that help?
 

Originally Posted by NZguy
The only way to stop this lunacy is to take action. If we are sheep, then the oppressive state will take advantage of that. Business travellers should unite! Write to your congressman. THe frequent business travellers are among the highest paid people in the United States. Use that clout. Don't make the screening easy for TSA. Question it. If you have time, do the secondary screening. (I always did this when I had time and the "recommended" that you take off your shoes.)

Taking off shoes, becoming dehydrated, and having bad breath are all ways that you empower a totolitarian regime.


How does secondary screening help our cause? If it does, I'm for it!

Spiff Aug 22, 2006 6:50 pm


Originally Posted by crimyla
How does secondary screening help our cause? If it does, I'm for it!

One used to be able to refuse the "request" to remove footwear at the WTMD and receive a secondary screening. This screening was supposed to be an ETD swab for no WTMD alarm, full harassment for an alarm.

Now, thanks to Comrades Pawley and Cherkoff's ridiculous "all footwear must be x-rayed because we're disgusting little shoe perverts" mandate, the point is moot. :(

justageek Aug 22, 2006 6:54 pm


Originally Posted by crimyla
Instead of not allowing 5 year olds to carry their juice boxes aboard a plane, why don't they screen the baggage handlers and the people who supply the on board food carts?

Because those kinds of things don't make for a "show" the way inane rules at the screening checkpoints do.

The politicians who make the "security" rules pick the techniques that are most likely to win them re-election -- they do not care about the effectiveness. Stuff that goes on in the "background," like screening ramp workers, cargo, or catering, are invisible to the public and thus are a "waste" of tax dollars (and thus don't happen to the degree they should). Only security procedures that are visible to the public are considered worthwhile, because the ultimate goal is to put on a "show" that makes the passengers think "hey, my government is doing something to protect me!"

Given limited resources, politicians will always allocate them in the way that optimizes their re-election chances. Frequent travelers are now suffering as a result of this fact.

Traveller Aug 22, 2006 7:15 pm


Originally Posted by SJCFlyerLG
WN staff or TSA? I have never seen any airline employees ever search a passenger's belongings. They have a right to make you check oversize bags, but what gives them the rights to do a search? AA barks at PAX during the initial boarding call, but certainly they do not search.

At LGA last Friday it was the TSA doing the random gate checks of carry-on bags.

Chuckles Aug 22, 2006 8:26 pm


Originally Posted by SJCFlyerLG
WN staff or TSA?

Sorry about not being clear. Looked like a combination of TSA and National Guard (at the WN gate). But no checks at PHX Sunday on the return.

PatrickHenry1775 Aug 22, 2006 9:22 pm


Originally Posted by FWAAA
AA40 LAX-JFK was delayed for an hour last Friday morning because too many pax had brought aboard their own beverages. According to the LA Daily News (the Valley paper), the Captain ordered the plane emptied and searched, and all the pax re-screened by the TSA.

This lunacy has to stop. I can't wait until the adults are once again in charge instead of delusional, paranoid morons.

Hate to say it, but since 9/11/01, no adults have been involved in formulating aviation security in the United States. Only delusional, paranoid, unimaginative morons have been in charge of aviation security policy that TSA has concocted and implemented.

Herb687 Aug 23, 2006 8:41 am

Will this water strategy work?
 
I just thought of this. Would it be possible to carry bottled water onboard a plane if one got a note from his/her doctor saying that one has a medical condition requiring hydration and as such having one's personal supply of bottled water is a medical necessity?

JS Aug 23, 2006 9:55 am


Originally Posted by Herb687
I just thought of this. Would it be possible to carry bottled water onboard a plane if one got a note from his/her doctor saying that one has a medical condition requiring hydration and as such having one's personal supply of bottled water is a medical necessity?

I doubt it. It has to be an actual prescription, which I suppose is possible but way too much trouble IMHO. Besides, you would be limited to 8 oz of water. I bring a liter bottle of water on the plane -- 8 oz is not nearly enough and I don't speak Imperial very well. ;)

I have an idea -- let's simulate the flying experience with the TSA screeners. Work your eight hour shift (or more if overtime, similar to an extended on-board delay) with no outside beverages. Every few hours a "flight attendant" will pass by and give you a very small cup of water (150 ml or thereabouts). There will be a call button nearby that you can press if you wish, although it's unlikely anything will happen.

studentff Aug 23, 2006 11:08 am


Originally Posted by JS
I doubt it. It has to be an actual prescription, which I suppose is possible but way too much trouble IMHO. Besides, you would be limited to 8 oz of water. I bring a liter bottle of water on the plane -- 8 oz is not nearly enough and I don't speak Imperial very well. ;)

I don't think there's any 8-oz limit on perscriptions. If I were still in school with a physician I knew very well and an energetic teaching pharmacy next door, I'd ask for a perscription for water ("take by mouth as needed for thirst and to counter low-pressure, low-humitidy air.") and get the pharmacy to stick a genuine perscription label on a typical 600 mL water bottle. Then I'd just use that bottle every time I fly. But alas, I'm fairly new here and do not know my providers well enough to make such a bizzare request.

I do have an actual history of getting sick (dizzy, exhaustion) from a combination of altitude and dehydration at altitudes way to low to bug most people (4000 ft., which is lower than cabin altitude on a plane), and when that happened, drinking lots of water solved the problem within hours. Since then I always drink very large amounts of water when working/recreating/travelling at altitude and have had no more problems. So I would have something of a legitimate reason to make the request.

Herb687 Aug 23, 2006 1:17 pm


Originally Posted by studentff
I do have an actual history of getting sick (dizzy, exhaustion) from a combination of altitude and dehydration at altitudes way to low to bug most people (4000 ft., which is lower than cabin altitude on a plane), and when that happened, drinking lots of water solved the problem within hours. Since then I always drink very large amounts of water when working/recreating/travelling at altitude and have had no more problems. So I would have something of a legitimate reason to make the request.

I think many people have a legitimate reason to make such a request. Even if not everyone is as severely impacted by the effects of cabin altitude and dehydration, hasn't medical advice always played up the importance of hydration when traveling by air?

I am quite tempted to give this water prescription strategy a try in the future. I won't be able to make it to the doctor in time for my next trip (a very short-haul, thankfully) but perhaps before the trip after that (I have no confidence that the moronic, liberty-crushing post-8/10 restrictions are going away any time soon...).

If my physician doesn't accomodate my request to write an official prescription for water, it's time to fire him and find a new one who will.


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