(Of course SFO's TSA are private-contractor "great pretenders")

Same at LAX T6, but only when when supervisor "Michael(plus five digit number that I do not have nearby at this time)" is incharge. As he said to me, "You forfeit your 4th Amendment rights when you pass throught the magnometer"

Something to ponder...

If you ignore their "suggestion", you automatically go to secondary, even if you don't beep.

They must be working off some specific threat information at SFO. They must have some reason to expect a shoe bombing type incident out of that airport. When I last went through there and was told to remove my shoes, I, of course, said they don't have any metal in them, but was told that they were looking for something different.

FYI - There is a directive from TSA headquarters that tells screeners when they should have shoes X-rayed. TSA does't like it when people are too much taller than they should be. http://www.flyertalk.com/travel/fttr...orum/smile.gif

"'Something different' could just as easily be in one's underwear or body cavity or molded to a person. How stupid can you people get???" http://www.flyertalk.com/travel/fttr...orum/frown.gif

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"Give me Liberty or give me Death." - Patrick Henry

I did the same thing in OAK. The screener was not happy about it though and promptly called a supervisor over to tell her what I wanted. She just stared at him and said "then screen his shoes and give them back". When I finished, I asked her if she thought I was being unreasonable and she just told me that the screened didn't understand that some people don't want to stand on a dirty floor.
More likely, he was not used to someone telling him that they were not going to do it his way!

Lowes_Man,

I'll do that if they request it or if they are in their bare feet. Problem is, I have to carry all your stuff over with me when we come to the wanding pit. Techinally, we can't let you touch your items before the process is done.

So pretty much, I have to call a screener if they are avaible to run the shoes and stay with you and your stuff, or I have to move you and your stuff closer to the xray to do that.

I personally don't have a problem with it. But I can see where a supervisor might get upset, because it's not techinally a procedure we are supposed to do, and we get in trouble for thinking.

You hit the nail on the head. Per the website and policy on "paper", it's not required. At many airports, in reality, it is required.

This past Friday I was told to take my shoes off. The carpeted floor was dirty and nasty. I told the TSA agent (respectfully) that the carpeted floor was dirty and nasty. He waived me through, no beep, yet off I goto secondary because I didn't remove them.

The floor in the area for secondary was a bit better, but still quite nasty. I had no choice but to remove my shoes to be x-rayed and get a full wanding. I suppose I could of declined further screening, but then I wouldn't be getting on the flight.

The official TSA shoe policy is a bunch of bull$hit.

There are some screeners who are familiar with the policy and as long as you don't beep, you're fine. Unfortunately, there are just as many that will put you through secondary, with manditory shoes off, after you clear without beeping just because you didn't remove your shoes (or sandals).

Best,

SDF_Traveler

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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Ben Franklin

"Screeners have been given explicit guidance on which shoes require X-ray screening. Loy said screeners are being instructed to encourage passengers to remove their shoes and submit them for X-ray examination. Passengers will not be required to take off their shoes before going through metal detectors, but should understand that their chances of being selected for a more thorough, secondary screening will be lower if they do. In most airports, TSA has found checkpoint lines move faster if people remove their shoes for screening.

While many people do not know if their shoes contain metal, Loy repeated that particularly thick-soled shoes and those with metal shanks or steel toes join other apparel, such as heavy metal jewelry and belts, that require secondary screening."

In a lot of the cases your all talking about, you refused to remove your shoes and they let you through. But that you were chosen for secondary anyway. That what the policy state will happen.

The policy doesn't tell you the critera we must use to select you into any depth. But the fact is, the policy states you have the option to remove or not reomove them before going through the walkthru, but if you get to the wanding pit, they must be removed or screened by ETD. That chocie was left up to the airports.

I don't agree with this policy but have to enforce it. But thought I might throw it out there. Those two paragraphs were taken fro TSA.gov.

If you think your concerned...How often do you change your gloves before touching the next passengers belongings, bins, or passengers person for that matter? I think I should be concerned.

BTW: It's also obvious to any FF that if you refuse to remove your shoes (depending on the airport) you will be secondarily screened. TSA Policy, written or not, it's fact.

edited to add:

What was this thread about?



[This message has been edited by CarmelGreg (edited Nov 12, 2003).]

I don't take my shoes off before going through the detector. I tell TSA politely my shoes are fine (based on experience) or I'm willing to go through secondary if necessary (I'm normally at the airport early enough it's not going to cause me to miss my flight if I have to do 2ndary).

Sometimes they say ok, I don't beep, no 2ndary. Sometimes they say ok, I don't beep, & they put me into 2ndary anyway. It's a crapshoot (that Vegas term was for iluv2fly http://www.flyertalk.com/travel/fttr...um/biggrin.gif)

Because in the summer I wear these flat 'mules' (type of description of shoes that women would probably know), taking them off would mean I'm standing on dirty carpet or floor in bare feet, and I won't do that for sanitary reasons.

I'm very polite (but firm) w/ them explaining my concern about sanitation, and tell them I'm willing to sit in a chair (feet not touching the floor) 'til they send the shoes through, or they can find something clean for me to stand on (SFO brought over a roll of paper towel & pulled off some sheets for me to stand on).

Sometimes they're suprised, but they've all been 'compliant' w/ my request http://www.flyertalk.com/travel/fttr...orum/smile.gif and it's not been a big bro-ha-ha.

Life's too short. I figure you all are out there battling on my behalf http://www.flyertalk.com/travel/fttravel_forum/wink.gif, I don't need to raise my blood pressure to do so too.

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Sharon

The condition of the floors at TSA screening checkpoints is actually the responsibility of the airports themselves. When the airport maintenance only mops the floor once a day they do get to be a mess. The screeners don't like working in these conditions either. My suggestion is to direct some of the anger towards the airport management.

Actually, the condition of the floors is a non-issue, except for your agency's asinine shoe fetish.

Welcome to FlyerTalk.

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"Give me Liberty or give me Death." - Patrick Henry

There isn't any "shoe fetish" as you state. With the enhanced walk through metal detectors shanks in shoes will trigger an alarm. Most people are advised to remove shoes so they do not have to be subjected to secondary screening. There are cases where passengers are told to remove shoes. These are because the type of shoe has been known to be able to conceal potentially dangerous objects. To get a look at possible items these shoes need to be X-Rayed. It is unfortunate but this has become a fact of life.

Reading posts from several people here shows me that it wouldn't matter what was happening they would complain. I and fellow TSA personnel that are on these boards are trying to convey information here. With the attitudes we have seen here no wonder you have problems.

The same volume that could be stored in the shoe could easily be stored under a person's garments, inside a person, or molded to a person's flesh. This nonsense about shoes being the only place that such potentially dangerous objects is bunk. Fact of life? No way. Your joke of an agency is going to be exposed for the fraud that it is.



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"Give me Liberty or give me Death." - Patrick Henry

Not at all true. End the harassment without probable cause. End the random security. End security without common sense, such as the Shoe Carnival. Keep the wait at the checkpoint to 5 minutes or less.

You'll never hear another complaint from me.

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"Give me Liberty or give me Death." - Patrick Henry