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-   Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate-687/)
-   -   TSA breaking things (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1516729-tsa-breaking-things.html)

InkUnderNails Nov 1, 2013 5:29 am


Originally Posted by mre5765 (Post 21705692)
Are you sure this covers value items in luggage checked into a commercial aircraft? The extra insurance the airlines sell exclude valuables. Third party travel insurance has limited liability; haven't seen any that would support a $7K claim.

Yes. I specifically requested insurance that would cover checked baggage, things in hotel rooms, and other travel risks. It is a commercial policy that is part of my business insurance in which the items are already covered. It simply extends coverage to travel for the listed items.

StanSimmons Nov 1, 2013 10:22 am


Originally Posted by mre5765 (Post 21705692)
I believe the consensus is that a starter pistol or flare gun is immune from NJ/NY/NYC extreme firearm laws.

An orange plastic flare gun is ok, but a starter pistol gave a friend of mine trouble at JFK... he ended up with no charges, but lost 4 hours and the starter pistol in the process. YMMV

mre5765 Nov 1, 2013 7:55 pm


Originally Posted by StanSimmons (Post 21708286)
An orange plastic flare gun is ok, but a starter pistol gave a friend of mine trouble at JFK... he ended up with no charges, but lost 4 hours and the starter pistol in the process. YMMV

That's kind of weird since a flare gun can emit a lethal projectile and a starter pistol cannot.

gobluetwo Nov 4, 2013 9:30 am


Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel (Post 21699401)
Is there even any point to this?

We had a TSA agent help themselves to lunch from our suitcase. (Love note, one bag of nuts is gone. An identical bag remained so they obviously didn't look suspicious.)

Maybe not, but it can't hurt.

eyecue Nov 4, 2013 1:54 pm


Originally Posted by Himeno (Post 21687803)
TSA has never left a note in my bag, despite it being obvious they have been inside.
The item in question is a plastic toy/prop which is kept in bubblewrap. It isn't replaceable as it hasn't been made for 12 years. Some friends are suggesting that its repairable.

TSA has procedures in place that rule out the event that you are describing as being caused by them. There are cameras that record every bag that is searched, there are computer logs that show who opened that bag and there is no reason to open any device for further inspection to the degree that your photos show. Not to mention that the notice of inspection has to be inserted. I am sorry.

Mad_Max_Esq Nov 4, 2013 2:47 pm


Originally Posted by eyecue (Post 21726447)
TSA has procedures in place that rule out the event that you are describing as being caused by them. There are cameras that record every bag that is searched, there are computer logs that show who opened that bag and there is no reason to open any device for further inspection to the degree that your photos show. Not to mention that the notice of inspection has to be inserted. I am sorry.

TSA has procedures in place to inform the screeners that filming is generally allowed at the checkpoint, TSA has procedures in place that forbid stealing from passengers, etc.

Saying that something is ruled out based on the existence of TSA procedures carries very little weight.

Boggie Dog Nov 4, 2013 2:48 pm


Originally Posted by eyecue (Post 21726447)
TSA has procedures in place that rule out the event that you are describing as being caused by them. There are cameras that record every bag that is searched, there are computer logs that show who opened that bag and there is no reason to open any device for further inspection to the degree that your photos show. Not to mention that the notice of inspection has to be inserted. I am sorry.

And TSA screeners never violate the rules.:rolleyes:

Caradoc Nov 4, 2013 3:11 pm


Originally Posted by eyecue (Post 21726447)
There are cameras that record every bag that is searched, there are computer logs that show who opened that bag and there is no reason to open any device for further inspection to the degree that your photos show. Not to mention that the notice of inspection has to be inserted. I am sorry.

1) Except when the cameras are "inoperable," "too blurry," or "missing," as usually happens when they might show something more embarrassing than usual about the TSA.

2) Computer logs? Riiiiight. This is an agency that still hasn't managed to get "photography is not prohibited" propagated to all of their employees. But not for lack of trying, apparently. Computer logs? Laughable. Purely laughable.

3) TSA employees might be required to insert a "notice of inspection," but that really shouldn't carry as much weight as "don't steal things from the passengers" - which, again, is violated on a pretty regular basis.

Given the circumstances and the history of the TSA, I find it wholly believable that some blue-shirted "screener" opened the bag to poke around, broke something, and "forgot" to insert anything like a "notice of inspection" on the off chance the incident could be blamed on the passenger, a ramp rat, or any other non-TSA personnel.

StanSimmons Nov 5, 2013 11:00 am


Originally Posted by mre5765 (Post 21711843)
That's kind of weird since a flare gun can emit a lethal projectile and a starter pistol cannot.

But a starter pistol LOOKS like a mean, nasty gun and a flare gun looks like a toy.

chollie Nov 5, 2013 12:39 pm


Originally Posted by eyecue (Post 21726447)
TSA has procedures in place that rule out the event that you are describing as being caused by them. There are cameras that record every bag that is searched, there are computer logs that show who opened that bag and there is no reason to open any device for further inspection to the degree that your photos show. Not to mention that the notice of inspection has to be inserted. I am sorry.

eyecue, aside from pax experiences, we have had TSOs post on this forum in the past that keys are regularly lost (in one instance, the supervisor kept the TSA lock keys) and when the keys are lost or not readily available, the locks are cut. TSOs have posted that y'all run out of forms sometimes, but baggage inspection has to continue.

There have also been 'bad apple' TSOs caught raiding bags or writing notes on the inspection slips or working in conjunction with baggage handlers to facilitate theft. They may be a small percentage of the workforce, but since they have access to hundreds of bags a day, they can impact a lot of pax. You point out the cameras, but the cameras don't mean anything if no one is reviewing them regularly, particularly when thefts or damage is reported.

After all, it surprises me when an LE is caught behaving inappropriately or even illegally on his own dashcam and subsequent investigation reveals multiple instances of the same behavior (like the cops in Texas doing cavity searches in broad daylight or the cop who was making women raise their shirts and bras for him). Checkpoint cameras didn't stop the (now former) Florida TSO from stealing an Ipad. These guys know exactly where the cameras are, but they don't worry because they know how unlikely it is that anyone will review the footage.

Personally, if the bandwidth were available, I wouldn't mind seeing all footage available to the public live at all times. At the very least, I see no reason not to allow the public access to all footage (that doesn't display anything SSI). After all, if the TSOs aren't doing anything wrong, there's nothing to hide. If they are, we're all better off knowing about it and addressing the issue.

Rare Nov 5, 2013 2:16 pm


Originally Posted by eyecue (Post 21726447)
TSA has procedures in place that rule out the event that you are describing as being caused by them. ... Not to mention that the notice of inspection has to be inserted.


Originally Posted by chollie (Post 21732679)
TSOs have posted that y'all run out of forms sometimes, but baggage inspection has to continue.

I know of at least one instance that my suitcase was searched even though there was no notice of inspection.

DeafBlonde Nov 5, 2013 2:55 pm


Originally Posted by Rare (Post 21733369)
I know of at least one instance that my suitcase was searched even though there was no notice of inspection.

Mine was, too. I have a suitcase with a buckle closure over the zipper opening. It was unbuckled when I picked it up at my destination, and there was no form or "TSA Love Note" in the suitcase. Just glad they zipped the darn thing back up, and I had no valuables in there. :rolleyes:

Boggie Dog Nov 5, 2013 5:41 pm


Originally Posted by DeafBlonde (Post 21733619)
Mine was, too. I have a suitcase with a buckle closure over the zipper opening. It was unbuckled when I picked it up at my destination, and there was no form or "TSA Love Note" in the suitcase. Just glad they zipped the darn thing back up, and I had no valuables in there. :rolleyes:

Never trust your valuables to TSA. THEIVES BE THERE!

Loren Pechtel Nov 8, 2013 1:58 am


Originally Posted by eyecue (Post 21726447)
TSA has procedures in place that rule out the event that you are describing as being caused by them. There are cameras that record every bag that is searched, there are computer logs that show who opened that bag and there is no reason to open any device for further inspection to the degree that your photos show. Not to mention that the notice of inspection has to be inserted. I am sorry.

Except video that shows a problem is always missing.

Ralph1964 Nov 11, 2013 10:12 am

The Truth about the TSA
 
The truth about the TSA(and the other border patrol people) is that they are arrogant government scum who have no respect for people's property or privacy. I can't remember number of times that they have messed up our luggage or actually destroyed our property.

Nothing every happens to our luggage unless there is the inspection paper in bag. They open creams or shampoos and don't put the lid back on properly. Then the suitcase is full of shampoo(or whatever) by the time you arrive. They unwrap bubble wrapped stuff and just put it back without the wrap allowing it to be later damaged.

They interrogate my girlfriend when she enters the US asking her why she has lingerie in her suitcase or asking her if she plans to get married. Then they try to give her their phone number. She hates coming to the US because of the people at those people.

My recommendation is to not put anything into your luggage which has any value. There is a good chance it will be destroyed. This only seems to happen when flying to/from/in the US. Other countries seem to have much more respect.


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