TSA trying to get flight deck privileges
 

I was talking with an airline capt. today & he advised me that the TSA has been trying to get flight deck privileges.

No reason to think it will ever happen & like he said even it did no airline capt. is going to allow them to ride:D as they hate the TSA so bad.

Easier for TSA to take control of the aircraft if they are already in the flight deck.
TSA has already shown they are willing to damage aircraft...

Flight deck privileges? They already made a disaster out of their TAT probe privileges.

God help us all

Can someone find a link to this? It seems as if pilots have so far been tolerating the TSA since they don't have to endure their worst, but I can imaging them making a pretty good scene if the TSA wanted to put their finest McDonald's rejects in the cockpits, either during flight or while on the ground.

What, exactly, is the TSA's stated reason for wanting to do this? I'm no pilot, but if a TSA clerk inspected my bicycle for safety, I wouldn't ride it until I gave it a thorough once-over to make sure he didn't steal the brake shoes and wheel hubs.

A TSA Employee would have no clue as to what anything in the Cockpit is for. Only one reason I can think of. TSA wants access to the flight deck / Airline Pilots are starting to use iPads in the Flight Deck. Make sense to you?

Huh...maybe the TSA clerks want to steal the iPads and shove them down their pants.

OK, so...the TSA wants to make sure the iPads haven't been accessed by Terrorists(TM) who will alter the flight plans and make the pilot crash?

I was thinking more along the line of your first sentence.^

My cousin is a pilot and simply adores the TSA; I'll ask him if he's heard anything about this.

That's what I want to know, too. Inspection before the flight? Last minute random patdowns of pilots? Free rides between airports? Just trying to see what new outrageous thing they can get away with? None of it sounds rational, but this IS the TSA we're talking about. :eek::eek:

Anyone with a link?

If I had to guess, it sounds like TSIs. But this is only rumor and speculation, it appears. It wouldn't surprise me if it were true, though.

Let me guess...flies for Delta?

Nope...Continental Express. Why do you ask?

Delta employees and management usually have their nose up the TSA's behind.

Unfortunately, the Internet doesn't carry sarcasm very well--he hates the TSA and has choice words to describe them. He wears his pilot uniform when he's flying personal/non-deadhead, since you get through the TSA faster with a pilot uniform and airline ID.

Let me rephrase that: something resembling a pilot uniform and airline ID.

Don't the FAMS fall under the TSA? If so, not sure what the issue is. If it's non-LEO, then it gets interesting.

FAMs don't belong in the flight deck either.

Until someone provides an authoritative source, this is just scuttlebutt.

After 9/11, back when I was a ramp guy the first thing that the TSA took away from us was jumpseat privileges. If they get jumpseat privileges, they may get to their destination, but I will guarantee you their baggage won't.

They are welcome to access the flightdeck as soon as they get past the armed pilots, the FAs with beverage carts, and the fire axe.

I don't get the reference. Does jumpseat riders' baggage frequently not make it, or would this be a special treatment for TSA clerks who might invoke a rule forcing airlines to let them take any flight for free on demand? (If my memory serves me right, can FAMs currently do this?)

That was sarcasm with humorous intent. The ramp guys load the jumpseat rider's baggage in the ABK, since there isn't exactly space on the flight deck. Since the TSA took away our flight privileges because they thought it was too burdensome to verify our trustworthiness, I could see some of the ramp guys "accidentally" forgetting to load their baggage, because after all, we aren't very trustworthy. :)

We know the TSA is trustworthy because they told us there's no problems in a recent press release and because passenger luggage theft has doubled since the TSA was put into place. Aren't you glad they are providing security to protect against those untrustworthy baggage handlers...oh wait, ignore that part I mentioned about the doubling in passenger luggage theft. That wasn't in the TSA's press release.

The day they decide they are equal to the FAA is the day I surrender my certificate. I'm not an airline pilot, but no $#@! way would I let any of them on an aircraft I was piloting.

I'm not ok with the idea of them being on the flight deck on a plane I was a passenger on, for that matter.

Given the stories I've heard about FAMs knocking off first-class passengers so they can "protect" the flight, I'm wondering if ramp guys ever "forget" to load the FAMs' bags.

I'm not a pilot, however, if I were, as the "commander in charge" of the airplane, I would put it quite bluntly: the plane doesn't move until the cockpit door is locked and the cockpit is occupied only by people qualified to be in there. If TSA clerks "have to" be on board to ensure the "security" of the cockpit, they can stand outside the door during the whole flight, and every time I had to use the bathroom, I'd make sure to push the door open really hard to bean them in the head.

Unfortunately, pilots don't have quite that much authority. Certain FAA employees can jumpseat, for example, and there's not much a pilot (of a scheduled air carrier flight, at least) can do about it. If the TSA and airline say the TSA is allowed on the flight deck - that's it. Unless some pilot decides to make a scene, of course.

To make this a little less inflammatory and a little more appropriate for this forum, this is extremely concerning. When you look at safety issues like CRM, sterile cockpit, etc, it's very clear that TSA clerks do not belong anywhere near the people flying the aircraft.

No. The FAA must change the FAR because at the moment:

§ 121.547 Admission to flight deck.
(a) No person may admit any person to the flight deck of an aircraft unless the person being admitted is—

(1) A crewmember;

(2) An FAA air carrier inspector, a DOD commercial air carrier evaluator, or an authorized representative of the National Transportation Safety Board, who is performing official duties;

(3) Any person who—

(i) Has permission of the pilot in command,......

Unfortunately the FAA tends to roll right over for the TSA - at least that's what I see as a flight instructor.

Unfortunately, this tends to get resolved at the level of negotiation between the company and the pilot's union. If there's general agreement that someone is allowed access to the flight deck to jumpseat, then the captain actually needs a plausible (if thin) reason to eject them. For example, "he would obstruct my access to the fuel distribution panel on this 727 and is not competent to operate it in the event of a problem."

I'm only a PPL holder but I'm with you 100%. How would you file a flight plan for a flight a TSA person forced himself onto?

There's not enough room in the "Number on Board" block to put "2 when I takeoff but there will only be one by the time I land."

Is TSA asking for this as a 'perk' for TSOs (like FAA employees once enjoyed pre-9/11)? So they can joyride around the country for free?

Or can I now expect that I get ID/BP'd/Pre'd at the entry to the elite lane, ID/BP'd again at the TDC, groped because I can't assume and hold the NoS position, swabbed, SPOT'd in the bathroom, drinks tested in the boarding area, ID/BP/bag searched at the gate/on the jetway - and now, once I finally think I can breathe a sigh of relief as the doors close, we cruise down the runway, wheels up...

But NO!

Here comes the cockpit TSA, demanding to see BPs, IDs, drinks testing, bag searches, probing questions, frisks and gropes in the aisle, swabbing, resolution gropes in the bathroom or the galley....:mad::mad::mad:

Is there no escape?

I'm all for giving TSA clerks wheel well privileges. Just lower the landing gear over an uninhabited area and let the blue ice cube roll out. Could be a useful technique for RIFs.

Of course there is. No one is forcing you to fly anywhere. :rolleyes:

You mean United Express?

Speaking of that, anybody notice the TSA doing bag searches at gates lately? I was going through BOI and there was a TSA agent doing a "flying while brown" check on anybody who wasn't lily white. She was walking around the gate pointing at people's luggage and saying "I need to search your bag." That was a little beyond orwellian for me, especially since the profiling was so naked and brazen.

This quote here made me think. I could easily imagine the TSA having trouble hiring--I sure wouldn't work for them, even if I was back in college and happy to make $7/hr. Currently, an unofficial perk is that you get to steal from passengers, but you obviously run the risk of being fired as a scapegoat for that.

Perhaps they're trying to offer an official perk to TSA employees: you get to fly anywhere you want, any time you want, for free. Maybe they're having _that hard_ a time hiring.

They did at PSP two weeks ago. They checked my bag and I'm white, but then again, I did hassle them at the checkpoint, so that's probably bad data.

Excellent... 3 pages in and still no verification to the claim, which was originally stated as a rumor to begin with. How about this;

I think I heard someone who looked like they flew recently say that they heard that the smurfs were all getting dragonskin and sidearms. I am outraged by this claim.


FT, for when trolls want an easy meal.