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-   -   Where is everyone? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1283668-where-everyone.html)

N965VJ Nov 29, 2011 6:08 pm


Originally Posted by RosemaryT (Post 17504458)
Wonder how long before TSA shows up and ruins our trains?

From an account on TravelUnderground.com :D^ :

The day of, not before, the huge anticipated crush of Wednesday Thanksgiving travelers, TSA shows up unannounced and starts to set up inside Union Station.

Amtrak senior staffer sees TSA agents on the floor. Goes upstairs, asks a colleague:
"What's going on? There are TSA down there."
"Not for long."

...
Chief goes down, "What are you doing?"
"We're setting up surveillance."
"No. You don't have jurisdiction."
"We insist."
"No, I insist. You're leaving the building."
Amtrak security are there to help escort TSA off the premises
.

mahohmei Nov 30, 2011 9:25 am

^^^:D:D:D

Unfortunately...how long until Congress drags in Amtrak to chew them out over this incident and threaten to eliminate Amtrak altogether?

The personnel at Chicago Union Station definitely had some cojones to do that, but will the TSA go crying to Congress about it? After, transportation security _is_ the TSA's specialty, right?


N965VJ Dec 1, 2011 12:00 am

That's why I want to see the TSA placed under control of the FAA. Rotsa ruck infesting a train platform when the most you have is an airport SIDA badge. :p

clrankin Dec 1, 2011 9:22 am


Originally Posted by doober (Post 17536279)
A WBI machine was in a NJ PATH station several years ago for a couple of weeks and Chertoff himself has been seen and heard trying to get NJ Transit to install such machines.

How much trouble do you suppose one could get into by bringing a few raw eggs to pelt at such a machine? (Well, throw into, not at. Perhaps even pelting a TS"O" who may or may not be in the "line of fire".)

KDS Dec 2, 2011 12:25 pm

Amazing. The Amtrak version of "D Y W T F T" -- "Do you want to not be arrested for trespassing today?". The best part -- TSA is on the receiving end of the "threat."

mahohmei Dec 2, 2011 2:01 pm

Is there an account of this in a "mainstream" news source, like a newspaper, TV channel, etc?

Unfortunately, "incidents" like this can circulate to no end at TravelUnderground and Flyertalk, but until it makes it to, say, the Chicago Tribune or cnn.com, it's a pro-TSAer's favorite adjectives: anecdotal, unconfirmed, and only on "conspiracy sites".


RatherBeOnATrain Dec 3, 2011 10:34 am

Where everyone is: AMTRAK!
 
Here's some factual information about where all the travelers are:
WASHINGTON — Amtrak moved an estimated 720,000 passengers during Thanksgiving week, breaking its all-time record, the railroad announced based on preliminary data. That number puts this year’s haul 2.2 percent higher than last year’s, when the previous record was set.
Source:
Trains magazine:
Amtrak sets Thanksgiving week record

Published: December 1, 2011

nachtnebel Dec 3, 2011 11:28 am


Originally Posted by RatherBeOnATrain (Post 17559748)
Here's some factual information about where all the travelers are:
WASHINGTON — Amtrak moved an estimated 720,000 passengers during Thanksgiving week, breaking its all-time record, the railroad announced based on preliminary data. That number puts this year’s haul 2.2 percent higher than last year’s, when the previous record was set.
Source:
Trains magazine:
Amtrak sets Thanksgiving week record

Published: December 1, 2011

So, RBOAT, what ezactly do you think would cause such an increase? ;);)
hmm... haven't seen any stories about people being being groped or strip searched by Amtrak conductors or PD. Come to think of it, they have a policy forbidding frisking people on Amtrak without cause. Could that be it?

N965VJ Dec 3, 2011 12:37 pm


Originally Posted by RatherBeOnATrain (Post 17559748)
That number puts this year’s haul 2.2 percent higher than last year’s, when the previous record was set.

I guess the Air Transport Association now knows where their -2% drop went. :D

Letitride3c Dec 3, 2011 12:46 pm


Originally Posted by nachtnebel (Post 17560006)
hmm... haven't seen any stories about people being being groped or strip searched by Amtrak conductors or PD. Come to think of it, they have a policy forbidding frisking people on Amtrak without cause. Could that be it?

Up to 250 National Guard troops in uniform were assigned that weekend in NY's area airports, bus & rail stations (NY Penn & Grand Central for regional trains) - but, the media couldn't get any spin on the stories. Not sure if TSA was involved or co-mingled within ....

I see fewer & fewer, if any, random bag checks down in NY's subway system lately - and it's so easy only the blind would have trouble going around them, making it virtually useless. Of course, my retired MOS friends & their pals earned a great deal of OT for their homeland security assignments post 9/11.

GoAmtrak Dec 8, 2011 12:35 pm


Originally Posted by mahohmei (Post 17555675)
Is there an account of this in a "mainstream" news source, like a newspaper, TV channel, etc?

Unfortunately, "incidents" like this can circulate to no end at TravelUnderground and Flyertalk, but until it makes it to, say, the Chicago Tribune or cnn.com, it's a pro-TSAer's favorite adjectives: anecdotal, unconfirmed, and only on "conspiracy sites".

Amtrak police chief bars Transportation Security Administration from some security operations

Happened following this incident: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/pract...ed-thread.html

Thus, I'd definitely believe the above anecdote. Amtrak is in the driver's seat (engineer's seat?) when it comes to their own passengers' security. ^

essxjay Dec 8, 2011 1:04 pm

Great thread. Thanks for posting it. ^

mahohmei Dec 13, 2011 1:49 pm

Unfortunately, for a pro-TSAer, trains.com still means it's anecdotal, since there's obvious bias. It has to make it to CNN before anyone believes it, otherwise, trains.com is still a "conspiracy site" that's making it look like people are actively avoiding flying because of the TSA.


Originally Posted by GoAmtrak (Post 17590688)
Amtrak police chief bars Transportation Security Administration from some security operations

Happened following this incident: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/pract...ed-thread.html

Thus, I'd definitely believe the above anecdote. Amtrak is in the driver's seat (engineer's seat?) when it comes to their own passengers' security. ^


GoAmtrak Dec 16, 2011 11:46 am


Originally Posted by mahohmei (Post 17619965)
Unfortunately, for a pro-TSAer, trains.com still means it's anecdotal, since there's obvious bias. It has to make it to CNN before anyone believes it, otherwise, trains.com is still a "conspiracy site" that's making it look like people are actively avoiding flying because of the TSA.

The Trains article was written by a respected journalist who spent decades at the Washington Post followed by the International Herald Tribune. The onus is on you to check the other FT thread and use the Google to 'trust but verify' what I posted. @:-)

There are many, many news outlets that have covered the Amtrak-TSA spat; I posted the Trains article specifically because the author goes into a level of thoughtful detail that is sorely lacking in most MSM transportation coverage, especially vis-a-vis security.

RatherBeOnATrain Dec 16, 2011 11:56 am


Originally Posted by GoAmtrak (Post 17639763)
The Trains article was written by a respected journalist who spent decades at the Washington Post followed by the International Herald Tribune.

Don Phillips, the author, actually spent over a decade at the Washington Times, before he moved to the Washington Post.

I mention this because it shows that he worked for many years at both the liberal and the conservative newspapers.


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