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I think Goj was being sarcastic and taking a jab at Eyecue. At least I'm reading it as that.
Originally Posted by Lara21
(Post 15482611)
I am just curious... Do you have a mother, sisters, nieces and friends with children whom you care about. See most men do get turned on because they are visual and I won't fault you for that. However I do fault you for your attitude.
Because how would you feel about this happening to the people you profess to love and care about. See you admit you enjoy it when other women and teenage girls are put through this. Well there are other men who are going to be enjoying and saying the same things about the women in your life when they see them getting abit of girl on girl action at the airport when they have to fly at some point and time. Are you going to just be able to stand there when you hear a man make a vulgar remark about someone you care about because they are turned on by them getting the sexual grope or are you going to end up in jail? See you can't have it both ways. You can't get turned on and think it is fun when seeing it done to other women, but get angry when other men are getting turned on and think it is fun when it is being done to the women you care about in your life. And before you point this out I'll do it before you do. Yes right now you can avoid some of this by driving, walking, riding the bus, taking a train or a boat, but if things continue the way they are. There just may come a day when you will find yourself going through a security check so intrusive inside your own home that it will make other countries where the citizens have no rights seem like a pool party. Because I see a day in the USA coming where if you refuse to be screened. They simply will lock you away without due process because you will be considered a criminal because you wouldn't comply to their authority. See the sheeple you refer to, in some of your post, who refuse to fight back and go along with NOS and the sexual gropes because they think it will make them safer. They are opening the door for it to be this way for everyone. So for you to say that you will just enjoy watching the sheeple who go for the sexual gropes because it turns you on will eventually effect you when it becomes mandatory for you and your family members to be searched before you are even allowed to walk out your front door. Because there is this saying about... He/she who laughs first is the one who ends up crying when the joke turns out to be on him/her. And before some of you say, but I don't live in the USA. What happens in the USA doesn't always stay in the USA. The USA could very easy negotiate outlandish security measures to be implimented in other countries. They did it with airport security with planes flying from other countries to the USA. So it could even go further when it comes to anything for safety and security. |
Originally Posted by JObeth66
(Post 15484176)
I canceled my upcoming flight for New Year's Eve and decided to drive the 5 hours to my destination, rather than flying.
I do have a trip coming up in February that I must fly for, and another in May (overseas - swimming to Barcelona is not an option. :) ) My intent is to wear a running bra, under a long-sleeve Unitard, which will be under my pants & top. No way to remove it without stripping down, and if the TSA wants me to strip, I'll be doing it in public. I will not accept a private room for any "pat down". No waistband for them to stick their grubby hands in. No way to 'lift' or 'separate' the girls. |
Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel
(Post 15485261)
Huh? How does this make no waistband? It's just they'll hit the unitard rather than skin. I do like the idea, though--you're giving them a pretty hard problem to solve.
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Originally Posted by JObeth66
(Post 15488224)
that's what I mean - they won't touch skin, they /certainly/ won't be touching the skin below the waist, and no private areas will be harmed in the making of this episode of Travel Security Theatre. :)
If they make you to disrobe, that disrobe only goes up to your waist. Sinec they cant touch or see naked skin ! How would that work if you are bare chested above the waist? Probable ( would not suprise me) you are told that you "interfere" with screening ! |
Originally Posted by tanja
(Post 15490165)
Yes There is only one tiny issue.
If they make you to disrobe, that disrobe only goes up to your waist. Sinec they cant touch or see naked skin ! How would that work if you are bare chested above the waist? Probable ( would not suprise me) you are told that you "interfere" with screening ! |
Originally Posted by susiesan
(Post 15490382)
I wondered about that too as I do not wear a bra. If I was forced to take my top off my breasts would be exposed, naked. If I refused to go into a back room, would they have me do this out in public? I don't have a problem with it to show the other travelers what the US has come to. I would not be embarrassed.
There are several reports from posters here (I believe that VelvetKennedy is one) who were ordered to remove their only item of clothing on their upper body by male TSOs. |
Originally Posted by susiesan
(Post 15490382)
If I refused to go into a back room, would they have me do this out in public? I don't have a problem with it to show the other travelers what the US has come to. I would not be embarrassed.
http://assets0.ordienetworks.com/ima....jpeg?112d666e |
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15478628)
You can be requested to lift or move/seperate the breasts in order to facilitate the pat down.
Besides - bras, particularly for the well-endowed, are designed to prevent free motion. Motion control/support and shaping are the main reasons most women wear the things! The only way to "lift and separate" with most bras is after removing the bra. |
Originally Posted by FaustsAccountant
(Post 15484991)
I think Goj was being sarcastic and taking a jab at Eyecue. At least I'm reading it as that.
I suspect he has no idea how sexist or generally awful he comes across, and not just in this thread. |
Man, eyecue really turned the thread upside down didn't he? That was an incredibly awful and callous statement - but it probably reflects SOP.
Originally Posted by whitearrow
(Post 15492050)
Given his other posts, I would have to disagree.
I suspect he has no idea how sexist or generally awful he comes across, and not just in this thread. The fact that the TSA is pretending that nothing sexual could come out of the situation is the ridiculous part. I know I'm not the only one that instinctively wonders what a hot girl's boobs look like on the monitor when I see one in the scanner. I'd be a little worried if I didn't, to be honest. The TSA guys are exactly the same, except that they have someone on their earpiece that can describe what her nipples look like. Open to abuse doesn't begin to cover it. I mean seriously, what is everyone thinking about when they see this? Don't lie. http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/8...2782200986.jpg |
Originally Posted by whitearrow
(Post 15492050)
Given his other posts, I would have to disagree.
I suspect he has no idea how sexist or generally awful he comes across, and not just in this thread. |
Originally Posted by eskachig
(Post 15492097)
Regardless, what he said is informative. Men find watching beautiful women touched in that manner sexually stimulating. That's the damn truth and that's all there is to it.
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Originally Posted by whitearrow
(Post 15492196)
It's also about as informative as saying it's dark out at night. And it's hardly something to brag about.
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Originally Posted by FaustsAccountant
(Post 15492098)
Oh. If so then he and Eyecue are a match made in-....."someplace."
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Originally Posted by PVDtoDEL
(Post 15492482)
While they are both ignorant (on this topic) males, they happen to be on the exact opposite sides of the issue we are discussing.
"I'll tell her to lift." "Thanks, I can watch then." Edit: sorry bumped the wrong button before I finished. I meant to also put forth What would a real Law enforcement officer say about this if a TSA was to make such a request? |
Originally Posted by MikeMpls
(Post 15479490)
This sounds so incredibly stupid. :rolleyes:
That Sounds Assinine |
Originally Posted by susiesan
(Post 15490382)
I wondered about that too as I do not wear a bra. If I was forced to take my top off my breasts would be exposed, naked. If I refused to go into a back room, would they have me do this out in public? I don't have a problem with it to show the other travelers what the US has come to. I would not be embarrassed.
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Originally Posted by Caradoc
(Post 15490729)
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Originally Posted by FaustsAccountant
(Post 15479034)
This is starting to sound like a porno!
And no, being 'requested' to touch myself so you can watch does NOT make me feel safer. And the line "For your safety" doesn't fly with me. (Pun intended) Eyecue, I'm really trying to give you benefit of doubt, but each time you post stuff like this, your creditability drops dramatically.
Originally Posted by kbug43
(Post 15491669)
Eyecue, if you really are a TSO and if you really do think that in some stretch of the imagination this is OK - would you be perfectly content to have some stranger demanding that your wife/girlfriend/sister/mother/daughter lift and move her breasts in public at a TSA checkpoint? You're really OK with that?
Besides - bras, particularly for the well-endowed, are designed to prevent free motion. Motion control/support and shaping are the main reasons most women wear the things! The only way to "lift and separate" with most bras is after removing the bra.
Originally Posted by buckeyefanflyer
(Post 15481337)
When did a breast become a lethal weapon?
In reality though the breast can and has been used to hide many things including guns and knives. When they are capable of doing this because of their nature they will be checked further. |
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15478628)
In reality though the breast can and has been used to hide many things including guns and knives. When they are capable of doing this because of their nature they will be checked further.
So why then have they been 'checked further' to the point of causing bruising? |
Yes it is different.
I walk up to a child or anyone on the street, in a school to take and shake their hand. That is much different than walking up to them and taking their breast or phallic to shake. Either you know this is true and are being stubbornly obtuse or else you have very serious sociopathic issues.
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500260)
A male passenger with a huge overhanging stomach is treated the same way.
It is no different than a male with a large belly that hangs over the belt. You all are attaching the sexuality to it. To us it is just a part of the body that needs to be checked. If you ask the more radical thinkers on here they would have you believe that a terrorist would have breast removal surgery and then implant explosives under the skin. In reality though the breast can and has been used to hide many things including guns and knives. When they are capable of doing this because of their nature they will be checked further. |
Originally Posted by FaustsAccountant
(Post 15500532)
Yes it is different.
I walk up to a child or anyone on the street, in a school to take and shake their hand. That is much different than walking up to them and taking their breast or phallic to shake. Either you know this is true and are being stubbornly obtuse or else you have very serious sociopathic issues.
Originally Posted by exbayern
(Post 15500359)
My breasts are far too small to hide anything. They are smaller than many men's breasts. There is more than enough space between them for a hand to be placed flat against my chest.
So why then have they been 'checked further' to the point of causing bruising? |
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500571)
We are talking about searching a persons body for possible weapons.
The TSA has physically searched..and now is irradiating and/or strip-searching and groping...literally billions of Americans without catching one single terrorist. I know that, respectfully, this is beyond your pay grade but I've got to ask at what point does this this asinine "security" escalation come to a halt? |
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500260)
<snip>
In reality though the breast can and has been used to hide many things including guns and knives. When they are capable of doing this because of their nature they will be checked further. |
Originally Posted by Cholula
(Post 15500630)
But that begs the simple question which everyone conveniently avoids.
The TSA has physically searched..and now is irradiating and/or strip-searching and groping...literally billions of Americans without catching one single terrorist. I know that, respectfully, this is beyond your pay grade but I've got to ask at what point does this this asinine "security" escalation come to a halt?
Originally Posted by barbell
(Post 15500634)
So, what is being done to prevent injury to female screeners (or male, I suppose given other comments on this topic RE: guarantees of same-sex frisks) when the resistance their hand meets actually is a weapon such as a knife? Is there a plan in place to handle the sliced hand of the screener?
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Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500697)
Saturate and displace. Did you see the news about tainting salad bars? Airports are not a soft target anymore.
Although this might do wonders for the obesity levels in the US. :D |
Originally Posted by JennyElf
(Post 15500742)
Please tell me that I'm not going to have to be searched before getting close to a salad bar now...
Although this might do wonders for the obesity levels in the US. :D |
Originally Posted by barbell
(Post 15500634)
So, what is being done to prevent injury to female screeners (or male, I suppose given other comments on this topic RE: guarantees of same-sex frisks) when the resistance their hand meets actually is a weapon such as a knife? Is there a plan in place to handle the sliced hand of the screener?
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500700)
NO.
That's just stupid. |
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500614)
IF you wear a bra, and most women do then you can thank those lovely people that test us EVERYDAY with small items in the bra. An officer has to press hard on that area in order to detect those items. IF they miss it then they get the bad thing on their record. Granted if TSA could use another method to check that area then we would not have to press that hard. But when we are searching for something that can be 1/2 inch long and 3/16 inch wide a lot of pressure has to be placed on the area.
Why are you looking for microSD cards in a bra? You are supposed to be looking for things that go boom. Smart terrwists will put the detonation device where you can't find it. oooooo...."the bad thing". How adorable, you get black marks? Does that mean you get a gold star when you behave yourselves? |
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500614)
IF you wear a bra, and most women do then you can thank those lovely people that test us EVERYDAY with small items in the bra. An officer has to press hard on that area in order to detect those items. IF they miss it then they get the bad thing on their record. Granted if TSA could use another method to check that area then we would not have to press that hard. But when we are searching for something that can be 1/2 inch long and 3/16 inch wide a lot of pressure has to be placed on the area.
Your medical examples are not valid because TSOs do not have the same level of training as a physician, or those in EMS. It is clear that they are not concerned with causing no harm or injury to their customers because quite often we see that they do just that. |
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500614)
IF you wear a bra, and most women do then you can thank those lovely people that test us EVERYDAY with small items in the bra. An officer has to press hard on that area in order to detect those items. IF they miss it then they get the bad thing on their record. Granted if TSA could use another method to check that area then we would not have to press that hard. But when we are searching for something that can be 1/2 inch long and 3/16 inch wide a lot of pressure has to be placed on the area.
Are you saying that it is now acceptable (and in fact, standard) practice for U.S. government employees to intentionally cause immediate physical harm to a potential airline passenger in order to assess whether they are carrying weapons? If a doctor - a trained medical professional - left bruise marks from palpating an area under anything but the most emergent circumstances (like CPR), he would be held to account faster than you can say "malpractice." How in the world do you believe your non-medically-trained self to be qualified to perform any "professional" procedure that an actual Medical Doctor would be hesitant to perform? And you still haven't answered the question, at least that I've seen, about what happens the day you tell a woman to take off her shirt and she does, baring all for the world to see. Then what do you do? Arrest her? |
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500614)
IF you wear a bra, and most women do then you can thank those lovely people that test us EVERYDAY with small items in the bra.
There is no logic in your response. I realise that you may just be parroting your employer, but regardless if the words are yours, or your employer's, they still don't make sense. |
No.
Not a strawman argument. You compared a stomach as the same as a breast. It is not. You and/TSA are not medical professionals. Doctors and EMT only perform the 'check on my chest' When I am in an accident. They do NOT check anyone they 'randomly' perceive to have injuries. And furthermore, not everyone that visits a doctor will have the possibility to be called out for a breast/phallic check. *I*, the patient, make an appointment and request that kind of exam.
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500571)
That is a strawman argument. We are not talking walking up to someone and shaking their hand because of social greetings. We are talking about searching a persons body for possible weapons. There is no comparison. When you are in an accident and the paramedics check your chest for flail or other injuries involving personal areas, are you going to object? There are doctors and other professionals too that have to perform in this area of discomfort to the recepient everyday. They treat it like it is without any stigma attached to it.
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Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500571)
That is a strawman argument. We are not talking walking up to someone and shaking their hand because of social greetings. We are talking about searching a persons body for possible weapons. There is no comparison. When you are in an accident and the paramedics check your chest for flail or other injuries involving personal areas, are you going to object? There are doctors and other professionals too that have to perform in this area of discomfort to the recepient everyday. They treat it like it is without any stigma attached to it.
However the airplane passenger can't find out that same information when it comes to the enhanced patdown because the patdown procedure done by TSA Agents is SSI. |
Originally Posted by JennyElf
(Post 15500742)
Please tell me that I'm not going to have to be searched before getting close to a salad bar now...
Although this might do wonders for the obesity levels in the US. :D Strip search/grope anyone approaching a buffet line. Think of all the dangerous things you can put in food. Don't like it, don't eat. They're using poison, so we're going to have to ban liquids from restaurants. The constitution doesn't say you have the right to order liquid with your solid foods. |
I have asked a few times what level of first aid training TSOs receive, and went to do a search. The answer I found was even more disturbing - not only would it appear that they do not receive training, but they are not permitted to provide assistance unless excused from their duties by a supervisor or a manager.
b. TSA employees may voluntarily enroll in local first aid, CPR, and AED training programs. The training must be on their own time and at their own expense regardless of who offers the training. c. TSA employees trained and certified in first aid or CPR/AED, may provide emergency care as a Good Samaritan only when excused from security duties by their supervisor or manager. The fact that the TSA appears to actually discourage TSOs from any form of medical training and yet we have TSOs comparing themselves to EMS or physicians is very telling indeed. |
On groping breasts...
Originally Posted by eyecue
(Post 15500614)
... when we are searching for something that can be 1/2 inch long and 3/16 inch wide a lot of pressure has to be placed on the area.
This is fraud, waste and abuse at it's finest. |
Originally Posted by VegasCableGuy
(Post 15501407)
...under the fantastic delusion that some amazing unknown terrorist device the size of a nickel can be placed in a bra to bring down a 757.
This is fraud, waste and abuse at it's finest. Apparently it is a good thing that I only ate nuts during my flight as I cannot imagine what sort of response a stray nut in my bra would have caused at the checkpoint. (Of course, some may use my cashew story to support the argument of why breasts must be examined in this fashion) |
"[Female breasts are] no different than a male with a large belly that hangs over the belt." --Eyecue
To whom? Only to the twisted. The female breast is a (secondary) sexual organ. As such it has always been protected by laws in our culture and has requirements for proper covering. As a sexual organ, it is intimately tied to the personhood and dignity of its owner. To equate this to a man's belly is ridiculous. "You all are attaching the sexuality to it. To us it is just a part of the body that needs to be checked." --Eyecue It is our sexual organ. It is part of our privacy. Who in the hell cares what it is to YOU. It does not belong to YOU. "When you are in an accident and the paramedics check your chest for flail or other injuries involving personal areas, are you going to object?" --Eyecue I have the power to object and refuse treatment. It is I who allow them to treat me or if unconscious am considered to have allowed them to treat me, as it is customary to expect a person to want to be treated and live. You, who paw my sex organs, provide no such benefit that I want, and I do not want your services in any way shape or form, yet you coerce me into this at gunpoint--being stranded at an airport. "Don't Fly" when it is our livelihood? Don't live is more like it. |
Originally Posted by exbayern
(Post 15501428)
(Of course, some may use my cashew story to support the argument of why breasts must be examined in this fashion)
Yeah, that could be real dangerous to air travelers. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: |
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