Why PC to a CFF? Do you need a CFF? Do you have a CFU?

What was your thought process in choosing the CFF as the card to preserve your UR points?

I changed Freedom to Flex yesterday. Online this morning my 5x tracker on the Flex card is showing the Amazon purchases I made before the product change. So this doesn’t appear to work.

As expected, a PC would carry over the card's previous activity.

After some product changes and downgrades, I now have this $95 fee Chase Quadfecta

Chase Sapphire Preferred
Chase Freedom Flex
Chase Freedom Unlimited
Chase Freedom

I will use these cards for Lyft (5x UR with any of the four cards), occasional dining (3x dining with Freedom Flex or Freedom Unlimited; most of my dining goes to Amex Gold), 5% back categories (Freedom/Freedom Flex), general travel like transit and rail (Sapphire Preferred), and some occasional general spending (1.5x with Freedom Unlimited).

Next fall, I will either be 3/24 or 4/24 (provided I don’t get any other cards), so at that point I can go for some combination of a Sapphire bonus and something like a United or Hyatt bonus. After I get those bonuses, I will probably apply for a lot of non-Chase cards (Citi Prestige, another AA card, Hilton Amex, Amex Green/Plat, etc).

Another cool benefit of the shift to World Elite Mastercard from Visa on the Freedom Flex is that you can now stack the Lyft ride 5x, get a $10 credit benefit with 5% earnings on Lyft rids by using the Freedom Flex.

FWIW, my Lyft Pink membership (activated as a Chase Sapphire benefit) still looks active through February 2021 at this point...

I have a CFU. I want to take advantage of the rotating categories since canceling the card does not have any advantage. I don't want to apply for new CFF since I want to apply for a CSR or CSP in a few months once travel gets back and I need to transfer my UR to airlines. Just don't want to deal with credit ding when I can PC. I'm ok with not getting the 20k SUB for CFF since its not a big chunk.

Changes to Freedom Unlimited earning
 

So now earn 5% on Travel, 3% on dining

Why am i paying the fee and carrying the Sapphire Reserve at this point?

1. Unlimited's 5% on Travel only applies if you book through the Chase portal operated by Expedia.
2. Unlimited does not have the same travel insurance as Reserve.
3. Unlimited does not provide Priority Pass membership.
4. Unlimited adds 3% foreign transaction fee
5. Unlimited has a $0.01 rather than $0.015 travel portal redemption rate.
6. Unlimited does not allow Transfers to airline or hotel partner programs (you need to Combine the Unlimited points with Sapphire Preferred, Sapphire Reserve, INK Preferred, to Transfer)

All true. And a CSP is a "pretty good" alternative to those who cannot stomach the CSR's AF.

Well, I already have 2 Freedom cards (one "native" and one a converted old CSP ... three if you count the CFU) so I wasn't planning to sign up for a new card for the new CFF, but I also wasn't expecting to be eligible for the SUB, and now that it turns out I am eligible, I am feeling like I guess I have to do yet another new account. I am spending a lot at grocery stores these days so the 5x points for a year may just be too good to pass up. (Granted, I also already have the Amex Gold so I'm getting 4x at grocery stores anyway, but I have more MR points than UR points so could use some diversification.)

I wonder how the 5x points on grocery SUB offer will work when there is likely at least one quarter in the coming year where grocery stores are the quarterly bonus category. Probably just 5x total (though then I wonder if it will count toward just one of the $1500 quarterly allowance, the $12K first year allowance, or both), but it would be especially nice if that meant a period of 10x grocery (or maybe 9x, 1 pt + 2x 4 pt bonus) earning.

1. I don't know if travel will return to "normal" ever much less soon. I don't even know if I'll be able to do my normal annual trip home for Christmas due to Hawai`i's ongoing quarantine provisions. As such, I have no need for a travel-based card on top of my existing cash-back cards, especially one at a $150 AF (assuming I did get to use the travel credits). A $450 AF just didn't cut the mustard.
2. I don't care about the Lyft or Doordash "benefits" -- neither is a service I use or care for
3. I did want to preserve the UR points until travel resumes.
4. I will convert back to CSR when it looks like I'll be traveling more regularly.

Other Factors:

1. I already have existing cash-back credit cards including revolving categories of 5% cash-back on the Discover.
2. My other cash-back card is a Visa with 0 FTF.
3. I estimate $60K spend is roughly my break-even point on the value-back differential between CSR with a $150 AF (assuming I got the $300 travel credit) but that would be on top of regular monthly charges to my existing credit cards (or a change in the automated billing I've already set up which is a hassle to do for a temporary interruption) or the spend I would need to do to keep the other 2 cards active.
4. I can still use the revolving categories on CFF to my best advantage in the interim until the CSR makes sense again.

I'm trying to understand the downsides to applying for the Freedom Flex as a completely new card for the signup bonus (20k is meh, though I'll take it, but the 5% on groceries for 12 months is the bigger benefit to me under current conditions).

I am definitely under 5/24 (we bought a new house last year so stayed far away from any new accounts in the months before that) and my credit is fine (780s range) the biggest issue would be whether Chase thinks I have too many cards (CF, CFU, CSR, Hyatt, Marriott, IHG).

My CFR annual fee is coming up soon too, so need to decide what I want to do on that front (have too many URs to ditch it but don't have an Ink or CFP alternative that I can use to stash the UR).

Do you mean CSR? Or I am forgetting an annual fee card with initials CFR?

In any case, if you just want to store UR points but aren't planning to use them in the near future, you could always transfer them to the CF or CFU (or the Flex if you open one). They're less valuable while stored there but at least the balance is preserved, and if you someday open a CSR or CSP again you can transfer the balance back and restore the option to transfer to partners. (There is some risk with this approach since there have occasionally been rumors that Chase might restrict or devalue the option to transfer points from lower-end cards like the CF & CFU to higher-end cards like the CSR; hopefully if they do ever do that there would be enough notice that you could reopen a Sapphire card and transfer the points back first, but it's not guaranteed.)

Wondering if a product change from CSP to CFF is an option for me. The CSP annual fee posted on Aug. 1 and I paid that statement Sept. 8. Could I get the fee refunded or prorated?

As an aside less directly about this discussion, my last charge on the CSP was for an upgrade on a European airline (a few hundred euros) collected on their onboard card reader before takeoff. It's getting close to two weeks without it showing even as pending. Is it reasonable to think that it still needs to be downloaded to their server and will post, or at a certain point can I conclude that we dodged the charge? If I product change and it posts later, would it still be without a foreign transaction fee and with 2 UR points per dollar?

Yes.

Yep I meant CSR -- whoops, too many CFs in a row. I guess I could downgrade to the CSP in the short-term when my account renewal for CSR comes up (if I have plans to use them in the next few months). I mostly use the CSR for 3x restaurants and 3x hotels anyway (flights go to AMEX Plat for 5x). The restaurants I can cover with the CFU and hotels aren't relevant right now.

Don't really understand the Chase strategy right now but okay

Since you’re under 5/24, and if you’re reasonably close to your 48 month CSR/CSP bonus reset date I’d highly recommend waiting to get one of those, especially now that the CSP bonus is 80k UR.

He may be able to get both bonuses

That might be the way to go -- I haven't had the CSP since I switched to the CSR back in 2016 so should be eligible for the CSP 80k bonus and I should be well under 5/24 so double dipping is feasible. Just would look to downgrade the CSR to something else (rather than close my account)

Sapphire cards have a unified bonus qualification. You cannot open any new Sapphire card until 48 months after your most recent Sapphire new account bonus.

I also got CSR back in 2016.

But I just canceled it within the past week.

So the plan was going to be to wait around Dec or Jan. Though my account show the new CFU number and the refund of the AF already.

Recall if you will the unprecedented number of people who got the CSR when it launched (with that astounding 100k SUB). Accordingly, Chase must now be girding for a wave of 4-year-old CSR cards being downgrading* or canceled to enable those cardholders to acquire new CSR/CSP cards.

*What a coincidence Chase introduced the CFF (an attractive downgrade product) just now. ;)

RNE, a little amazed -- but glad -- Chase didn't extend the 48-month limit to 60, like it changed the 24-month limit to 48.

<yawn> Chase had already done 100,000 miles on a BAEC co-branded card, and American Express had done as high as 250,000 (targeted) for Business Platinum. We need not fear original thinking from Chase, they are the ultimate me too bank, and that's a very profitable strategy. I don't see why they would become risk takers.

Yawn, really? C'mon. My main point is clear: the CSR experienced enormous adoption upon its debut and that 4-year-old wave crest is coming back now. I'm not sure why you fixated on my flippant, historical aside about the CSR's 100k SUB. I thought the parenthesis would have made its um-importance to the main point abundantly clear. But, OK. Next time I'll bold the brackets.

I'm a bit worried that Chase will extend the 48 month rule before I reach eligibility (in January). I don't expect to need SR or SP until about March, so I am contemplating a PC to Flex. If Chase does pull the sign-up bonus rug out from under me by extending that rule, do you believe I would be able to PC a Flex back to SR (or SP)? Failing that, would there be any problem PCing a Freedom Unlimited to SP? (In that case, I'd probably apply for a new FU because I would still want one, and get its sign-up bonus as a consolation prize.)

What is the window to cancel?

Did you realize that Lyft has upped its charges so that it is more expensive than Uber? So basically you are paying far higher in $$$ to Lyft for the additional points you get from Lyft.

Generally, Lyft is slightly cheaper than Uber right now, at least for me here in New York (with both Lyft Pink and Uber Pass on my accounts). I use both regularly and I generally check both when I am looking for a more expensive ride. I’ve been using these services regularly for years so I know the rodeo

EDIT - I just checked a couple of things - on a popular route for me, Uber regular price is about $13 versus $12 for Lyft. That said,
1) Lyft has cancelled my Lyft Pink after my CSR downgrade. I had about six months left on my free Lyft Pink year
2) Due to Uber Pass and some promotions I have, the Uber regular price is about $9 for that route

30 days from the statement on which the AF appears.

Even though I made a name for myself on Flyertalk for my uncanny clairvoyance, of late I've had to employ chaos theory to scry Chase's inner demons. The Bank, regardless of any longstanding rules and/or planned dates, is apt to change on a dime, given market, governmental, and societal forces. Indeed, perhaps Tarot card readings! What I'm getting at is, yes, no rule or date is certain. We must wonder every day which side of the bed Jamie Dimon got out of.

I still can't find this in the T&C. Does CVS caremark mailorder qualify for the drug store bonus points?

Thanks for pointing this out. It's another reason I'll keep my CSR till the next renewal date. One thing I like is that I can pay with another card and still keep the Lyft Pink Discount. I normally use my World Elite DoubleCash because it gives you $10 Lyft Credit after 5 rides.

Chase fixed the Doordash benefit so if you pay with any other card, it strips your Dash Pass benefits and reinstates the delivery charge.

The mail-order side is not indicated. You would need to test one (when the card eventually shows up) to see. Chase only indicated four retail chains (Duane Reede, CVS, Walgreens and Rite-Aid). I think Chase is using the MCC, but didn't want to deal with manual credit requests.

If you really want the credit for Caremark mail-order, most CVS PBM plans now allow fulfillment at same mail-order co-pay via retail locations.

Lastly, I did notice this card does not have a digital wallet option in the Chase app, but until the card appears in real life, we won't know for sure.

So i have:

CSR
Freedom Unlimited
Freedom

Applied for the CFF, wasn't approved for some weird reason. Should I give up Freedom and product change to FF? I know Freedom will be considered grandfathered.

You would need to be more specific to receive helpful replies.

Obligations too high w/ current annual income

What are you wanting from the new card? It seems you have an almost equivalent setup between the Freedom and the Freedom Unlimited (with added earning categories) and a product change doesn't let you earn the sign-up bonus.

Yes! On the CFU my mail order from them in the last few days shows 3%.

Honestly, just the 5x for first yr of grocery and the MC Cellphone Insurance.

Call reconsideration and ask if they can move some credit line from one of your other Chase cards in order to be approved.