cxfan1960

Not to be rude, but this is a hassle for not just you, but also for CX. CX may change their policy in the future or the government may close this loophole one day, and you will be stuck airside for 12+ hours. 40 minutes is not a long wait given that CX is unlikely assigning anyone standing by just to handle such situations.

I do agree that you may as well just go to the pay-in arrival lounge to take a shower.

cxfan1960

They have a right to be there, but just not necessarily the right to return to the arrival level to exit airside.

QRC3288

Mate, don't think the condescending done is necessary.

I think you might be confused...this thread is referring to the practice of using airside lounges after arriving, then going landside. To achieve this flow you must get an escort to take you from the upstairs airside level (which is post security, post HK exit immigration) down to the arrivals level, where you then flow through exit immigration. It is a technically feasible, but definitely not in-the-spirit-of-things, with CX HKIA. I feel pretty comfortable saying that's abusing the intention of the departure lounge. The Arrival lounge is available for arriving passengers.

There is no issue with anyone using departure lounges who are departing, no matter how they got their ticket. No need to make this about anything more, including snide remarks about my business or whatever else.

renegurl

The reason I updated was to add a data point. What I read on FT last time vs this time was a very different story and didn't see updates on this. The last post was a year ago. I don't see how it's assumed that everyone who uses this loophole also leaves their bags and leave to go airside (I did not) or a leisure traveling award traveler (I paid for my own ticket -- not my company). I also don't see how business travelers would lose out since they qualify for Arrivals lounge. The definition of an emergency or legitimate reason varies by person.

If anything, the intent of my post is to discourage others from using a departure-side lounge before clearing immigration (the original intent of the thread).

I meant it's a hassle for them, I could care less for myself and yes, 40 minutes is reasonable. FWIW, I underestimated recovery time for a long trip in Y with a less than optimal seat.

QRC3288

Thanks for the datapoint. Very useful.

We don't assume everyone is leaving their bags, but I do think it's rather common. The concern about HK-based business travelers losing out is simply if this loophole gets abused, or security freaks out that someone's bag is left at The Wing unattended for 12 hours, the delays will impact those who are flying via HKIA frequently...which inevitably includes a lot of us on this board. And if CX gets heat from HKIA from an excessive # of people leaving the lounge daily to exit immigration, then inevitably those who fly CX the most will bear the heaviest consequences for the loss of a useful exit if an emergency arises.

The reason I suspect a lot of folks "abuse" (as I'm calling it) the spirit of the escort-to-arrivals-level is because we get a question at least once a month that goes something like this:

"We used AA points to book CX F and are traveling to Thailand for holiday. We land at HKG at 6am, and decided to take a late flight to BKK so we could see Hong Kong for the day before our BKK sector. Our plan is to proceed through transit security [using the BP for the flight in 12 hours], shower in the Wing, leave our bags in the Wing, and then go to Hong Kong for some dim sum....".

At HKG, a same-day boarding pass is required to navigate the flow from arrivals to departure. So whilst most arriving passengers cannot make use of this loophole (unless they are super extreme, and book a refundable same-day ticket ex-HKG), those who have a long layover can do it. My vested interest is I just don't want people abusing the heck out of it because in the off chance I ever need to use this channel again, it's still available for use.

I do recall a hilarious story years back about someone who, in a similar vain, booked a refundable ticket to use The Wing. He proceeded airside and used the lounge. Problem was....he needed a visa to Hong Kong, had a single entry, and of course airside in HKIA is behind both security and immigration. Which meant he no longer had a valid visa to HK. Oops.

Awesom Andy

Leaving bags shouldn't be an issue for security, as the bags need to go through security before going airside. If anything, it's safer than any of the landside luggage facilities.

Either way, it's a bit of a hassle, and you never know how long you have to wait for an escort.

jphripjah

I've always been happy to take my bag and store it at the regular baggage storage in arrivals.

cysyuen

What about getting one way reward ticket (to TPE in Y for example) to vist all the lounges then return to arrivals?

QRC3288

there are a few well-publicized cases of this on other airlines. Lufthansa and China Southern come to mind.

however, i'm pretty sure i recall an incident on CX at HKIA where they took a fellow to small claims court (?) for this years ago. IIRC he was hitting up the Wing and then not flying, but instead leaving the airport. i'm not a lawyer - apologies to the lawyers on here for my butchered interpretation of anything law related - but it was some type of civil thing, the equivalent of suing the passenger or something and I think CX won.

chater

This is an interesting discussion - I remember reading years ago that two fans got arrested for entering the Singapore protected area to get closer to their idol - they had boarding passes, but no intention to travel.

http://news.asiaone.com/News/AsiaOne...116-45295.html

Closer to Hong Kong, I'm pretty sure it's illegal to enter the restricted area with no intention to travel following entry - anyone who is not a "bona fide airline passenger" (which I would believe to be someone who intends to use lounges and then return to landside) should not be there without aiport ID.

warakorn

Actually I do not see any security issues in this backchannel scenario.

There are two types of scenario:
1) An HKG-based traveller is made aware of an emergency and needs to leave the airport at short notice.
2) A transit traveller with status or in J/F has a long same-day layover at HKG.
- The traveller obviously has the right to enter the departure zone (same-day boarding pass) and entitled to go the lounge, because he has a same-day departing flight. Thus, there is no commercial reason for banning this backchannel option.
- All the bags, a passenger brings to the lounge, have already been checked by HKG security. If HKIA would admit that these bags pose a security risk, then HKIA open up themselves to the allegation that their security checkpoints are not effective (letting through bombs).

Of course, in both cases the passengers have checked in bags for the flight and decide not to return to HKG. This is not a security problem, because the airlines have to ensure bag/pax match, thus, the bag will be removed from the plane, because the passengers has not boarded the plane.

Moreover, the backchannel option is no loophole to enter HK without a visa, because each backchannel user has to pass through customs/immigration at the end.

cysyuen

Does CX ban this practise in their condition of carriage?

jphripjah

As a data point, I did this about ten days ago. Flew F from LAX to HKG arriving at 6 a.m. with a ten hour layover on the way to PNH in J.

Landed at HKG, went through security to the Wing, grabbed a cabana, showered, got something to eat. Areound 9:30 told the staff I wanted to go into the city for a few hours. She told me there might be a wait for an escort because it was "peak time." I sat down, escort showed up in about 3 minutes and walked me though security to immigration. Very painless.

Took my carry on with me and stored it at the luggage storage, this was a little annoying because you have to walk 75 meters or so out of your way past the trains to get there and there was a 5-7 minute wait for people checking in luggage. I saw signs at the central train station for luggage storage, not sure if it would be better to store my stuff there in the future.

Pretty painless overall.

cxfan1960

Why didn't you leave it in The Wing?

cxfan1960

They don't need to ban it. They simply don't need to escort anyone back to the arrival level. It is up to the passenger to find his/her way back there.