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Originally Posted by hiima
(Post 26681017)
I haven't flown in PRC in a while, but if 5 flights were slight delay and the other 5 were on time, I'd buy myself a lottery ticket.When I flew PRC, 6 out of 7 flight were delayed by at least an hour up to a couple hours. 1 was on time, the one time I expected it to be delayed and was drinking in the airport bar and almost miss my flight. 5 out of 150 flights delayed out of PRC? That's unreal.
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Originally Posted by Guy Betsy
(Post 26679108)
Considering that you have travelled before, there are a few things that you simply do not understand...
1. CX's GDS are not like travel agents' GDS in that they cannot see all flights available. The GDS only shows CX flights. 2. The MH flight that you want to get on must also show up on CX's system as a codeshare. But codeshare flights usually cut off 4 hours before departure and that is the reason why the agent said, flight not operating because CX's inventory on that flight is gone. 3. Even if you want to get on MH's flight, and that you want to pay for it, CX cannot just 'transfer' you to the other flight on an existing ticket due to restrictions on that ticket. If you want to pay for the MH flight, you call MH yourself or get the CX agent to contact MH at the departure hall. But then you'd probably have to go to the MH counter yourself to sign the creditcard charge form. I was once on a MH flight which was cancelled and I tried to get on a CX flight while in the same lounge where you are at. It still took CX/MH about 2 hours to coordinate the tickets! 4. Knowing how flights can be delayed especially on China flights, you should have rescheduled your meetings to a more flexible time. Sure its 'important' but you have to take these things into consideration... what if there's a typhoon? You would not be able to go to KL at all ! 5. If you know that your flight was going to be delayed, then you could have just flown directly from CAN to KUL. And yes you do have a choice as to how and when you choose your flights irrespective of 'VVIP'. 6. Agents do not 'lie'. If they can't see it on their systems, why would they lie to you? In fact, they want to get rid of you as quickly as possible and the faster they put you on the plane, the less they will hear of your grumblings. Airport agents are always in the firing line when things go wrong. Please give them due credit for the work they do. Good luck.. Hope missing the flight didn't bring about too much trouble. |
Originally Posted by CXFlyerBoy
(Post 26680091)
There is nothing much you can do.
CX's part of the contract is to get you from point A to point B, which they did in the most logical and available method. Do bear mind that it is not imperative that same alliance partners are codesharing on every flight.
Originally Posted by CXFlyerBoy
(Post 26680091)
Bear in mind that even if you managed to get on the MH flight, there is a chance that checked bags if you have any might not make the flight due to the sheer size of the sorting facility, removal and rechecking process
Originally Posted by CXFlyerBoy
(Post 26680091)
Your meeting was no doubt important, but unless you only come to know about it he same day morning, wham bam trundle up to Baiyun to get on the next available flight, you ought to have planned it better to arrive in KUL well prepared. However, in reading your reply, it felt like cost was above the importance of your meeting which baffles me: the cart before the horse or the horse before the cart??
In summary, you could whine and cry, even try to pull a DYKWIA but you are probably lucked out. CX did not even need to give you the 10k miles. This is not compensation, this is for service recovery and customer retention. They have tried their best to reroute you. I do understand time to time sxxt happens. So what matter to me is their attitude and the way how they deal with it when things goes wrong. |
Originally Posted by natakating
(Post 26682475)
The contract is to get me from point A to point B in schedule, on that day the reason cause delay wasn't ATC, weather ，it is 'due to late arrival of the aircraft'. Which it means is airline's responsibility to reduce any inconvenient cause to me. Including provide an earlier flight.
http://downloads.cathaypacific.com/c...ge.pdf#page=23 ARTICLE 10: SCHEDULES, CANCELLATION OF FLIGHTS 10.1 SCHEDULES 10.1.1 The flight times shown in timetables may change between the date of publication and the date you actually travel. We do not guarantee them to you and they do not form part of your contract with us. |
Originally Posted by Guy Betsy
(Post 26679108)
6. Agents do not 'lie'. If they can't see it on their systems, why would they lie to you? In fact, they want to get rid of you as quickly as possible and the faster they put you on the plane, the less they will hear of your grumblings. Airport agents are always in the firing line when things go wrong. Please give them due credit for the work they do.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/catha...l#post25029757
Originally Posted by percysmith
(Post 25029757)
I added domestic LAN Argentina sectors to the CX-QR booking I previously worked on http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/catha...l#post23788425
I worked with a quite efficient Tsuen Wan agent, got the LA flights locked in, had the itin read back to me (my wife and I were doing four-eyed checks on the amendments in real time on MMB), had the miles quoted (190,000 no change), gave my credit card for the US$120 fees and new YQ, hung up and had the MMBs (with 00:00 deadlines) printed out and checked again (OK). Received the itins by email (OK again) and went to bed. E-tickets were issued a day later. I somehow received a 30,000 mile refund, no idea why. On investigation I found my QR DOH-GRU segment dropped. I called two Tsuen Wan agents asking for an explanation. In my previous experience they have either fixed it after prompting (for CX) or in one case without prompting (for JJ). I was hoping someone will quickly confirm the error and confirm a correction is necessary. The agents stonewalled: 1. The booking agent made a notation saying I asked for it during the change call 2. QR took the availability back when the tickets were replaced 3. In any case nothing can be done cos there're no more seats now 4. I created an illegal booking, so the agent had to create an open jaw Gobstopped. I rebutted each item as the agents made them R1. I made no requests of the sort. I did not even use the term "cancel" throughout the call at all (I wasn't cancelling anything). The agent quoted me back 190,000 miles no change - she should've quoted 160,000 if she understood me to be dropping the QR DOH-GRU. And I shouldn't see QR DOH-GRU after the call if my intended action was to cancel that segment. R2. Not my problem is it? CX ticketing shouldn't have let QR do that. R3. i. Talk to QR and get the seats re-released ii. Buy it out of their revenue (still I9 right now) iii. See you in small claims for the cash DOH-GRU price. R4. Explain to me how illegal. I counted o=4, x=3 and //=1 Your booking agent corrected me to say o=3, x=4 and //=1 Is substitution for o to x allowed? Yes? Eventually both agents suggested getting the booking agent to call me back. I agree the agents do not lie on purpose but they can be very driven apologists out there "it is what it is". |
Two thumbs up to Guy Betsy for the very informative post!^
Though I agree with what you said, I think the situation may be a little different depending on where you are in the world, or which airline you're flying with. I had two completely opposite experiences with two different OneWorld airlines: 1) Like the OP, I had a delayed CX flight. Six months ago, my flight from MNL-HKG-LAX-DFW was delayed at MNL because of a malfunctioning aircraft door. The flight eventually left 8 hours late, and I missed my connecting to LAX. During the whole time, the lounge staff denied the existence of a PR flight to HKG, and several other alternatives to the USA (e.g., JL via NRT). When presented by schedules on mobile phones and tablets by several MPC members, the staff scratched their heads and said it "would have to be looked into by the manager." The manager came and said she would not authorize unloading of bags because of the sheer number of bags to sort. They basically didn't want us to "leave" this flight. Eventually the flight left 8 hours later and dumped all passengers at HKG for the staff there to sort. I ended up being given a hotel to catch the exact same flight to LAX the next day. I was traveling alone back home (USA) and I met this lady and her mom who were traveling to Canada. Both of us have experienced severe delays with American carriers, and were scratching our heads at the way CX handled the whole situation. What CX did would have been the equivalent of "illegal detention." Then again, it happened in Manila/ Hong Kong and the local culture may not subscribe to international norms. In contrast, I have had a VERY different experience with American Airlines (and my experience with UA, CO, US have not been far off): 2) On a delayed flight from DFW-LAX (connecting to HKG then TPE), the AA Eagle flight was delayed. After two hours, the gate agents announced that anyone who will miss a connection from that point forward "may approach the podium to be given alternative flights." ;) This was at 7PM, and I would still catch the 1130PM CX flight. But the agent told me I will be placed on waitlist on the 1AM flight. Eventually, the Eagle flight got canceled. Initially, I was offered to fly the following day with a free overnight hotel at DFW. I reasoned that if I miss my meeting on Monday (was flying out Fri night to get to TPE Sunday early AM for a Monday appointment), then I would rather cancel my entire itinerary! The ticket by the way was CX stock. Initially, she offered to fly me to LA the following day then onwards on PR (and that's not even a OW carrier!!!:confused:). I insisted on canceling my itinerary. Eventually, she decided to offer me a flight the following day to ORD, then to NRT both on AA, and onwards to TPE on JL. I reluctantly agreed, but said I would be willing to take compensation for the downgrade from PEY to Y. She said, "don't worry about it." She handed me the ticket and I was booked FIRST until NRT then business onwards! That is what I call service!!! That won me over and I have been with OW ever since. And what about the checked bags? Well, ours was waiting for us at baggage claim. In hindsight, it was smart of AA to have us sort our own bags. This is what the lady and myself were scratching our heads over when we had that delay in MNL. Experience #2 for me is not isolated. It happened several times over to me on several itineraries and AA will always try and give alternative flights when theirs is delayed (most especially on international itineraries). Now, I do not dispute what Guy Betsy posted but instead I do agree that it explains CX behavior, and perhaps most Asian carriers'. However, it seems the standard operating procedure is different in other parts of the world and certainly in the USA. It always amuses me whenever I am on a flight operated by an American carrier. They always announce this before closing the doors, "...anyone who wishes not to be on the flight, please make yourselves known to the FAs... this is your last opportunity to deplane..." Now I realize that they will never hold you against your will (but Asian carriers may.) |
And in this case, probably there's some reason why CX rebooked natakating the way they did also:
Originally Posted by natakating
(Post 26678326)
CX booked me on the next flight ( CX729 16:00 departure) to Kuala Lumpur. I told the KA agent I can not accept it, because by the time I arrive Kuala Lumpur, for sure I will miss my very important meeting I suppose to take part of it. When I pass the transit security check, I noted there is one Malaysia Airlines flight MH73 depart to Kuala Lumpur on 14:45 from the airport flight information screen
Although they are obliged to re-route you they are very reluctant to waive ticketing restrictions (e.g. for their redemption tickets they will go out of their way to find another redemption seat rather than buy a seat http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/catha...-cx-miles.html) (also in my Argentinian case they refused to buy a ticket out of revenue after QR liaison denied re-releasing the seats they snatched back, but further escalation was avoided by QR's subsequent release of redemption seats for the day before which were acceptable to me). --- But in this case there is no contractual issues. CX's obligation is to re-route you "within a reasonable period of time". Try telling a judge or regulator a 3 hour 10 minute delay is not reasonable. |
Originally Posted by hikouki
(Post 26682831)
During the whole time, the lounge staff denied the existence of a PR flight to HKG, and several other alternatives to the USA (e.g., JL via NRT). When presented by schedules on mobile phones and tablets by several MPC members, the staff scratched their heads and said it "would have to be looked into by the manager." The manager came and said she would not authorize unloading of bags because of the sheer number of bags to sort. They basically didn't want us to "leave" this flight.
That means a cash outlay for CX to a competitor that CX is trying to avoid as a whole. So they don't give front line staff or managers the option, and they keep on being Munich apologists. Given recent intitatives https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/cath...-pressure.html I think this behaviour will continue, if not worsen. |
Originally Posted by hikouki
(Post 26682831)
Eventually, she decided to offer me a flight the following day to ORD, then to NRT both on AA, and onwards to TPE on JL. I reluctantly agreed, but said I would be willing to take compensation for the downgrade from PEY to Y. She said, "don't worry about it." She handed me the ticket and I was booked FIRST until NRT then business onwards!
That is what I call service!!! That won me over and I have been with OW ever since. But you're dealing with a (currently generous) AAirline... |
Originally Posted by percysmith
(Post 26682913)
Well you are OWS...
But you're dealing with a (currently generous) AAirline... |
Originally Posted by natakating
(Post 26682475)
My company VP took the MH direct flights from CAN to KUL on that day. It's company policy we can not be on the same flight. risk management..... Plus China southern Airline's price is over company budget, and plus I prefer Cathay Pacific more. I'd feel pretty fortunate to be booked on CX...at least with that much travel, CX DM would allow me to hang out in the Pier. AK has 3x daily for CAN-KUL. I don't see how CAN-KUL on CX via HKG would be any cheaper than an AK non-stop, but it does happen from time to time. |
Originally Posted by percysmith
(Post 26682791)
You must be reading a different contract than me:
http://downloads.cathaypacific.com/c...ge.pdf#page=23 ARTICLE 10: SCHEDULES, CANCELLATION OF FLIGHTS 10.1 SCHEDULES 10.1.1 The flight times shown in timetables may change between the date of publication and the date you actually travel. We do not guarantee them to you and they do not form part of your contract with us. |
I just read OP's post about his 2015 delayed flight for a very important meeting. I would have assumed that he learned his/her lesson about this potential problem at that time and would have scheduled to accommodate potential delays this time around.
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Originally Posted by heyheyha
(Post 26683006)
Sounds like your company has an interesting travel policy...I'm surprised they didn't book a ticket on an LCC for you if cost is such a huge factor for a VVIP...
I'd feel pretty fortunate to be booked on CX...at least with that much travel, CX DM would allow me to hang out in the Pier. AK has 3x daily for CAN-KUL. I don't see how CAN-KUL on CX via HKG would be any cheaper than an AK non-stop, but it does happen from time to time. |
Originally Posted by natakating
(Post 26683788)
Airasia in on my black list. Can we not discuss why I choose CX but not other airline? I didn't have trouble on this issue.
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