CX Lounge in HND
 

CX is launching HKG-HND route from 31/10, should CX set up its own lounge in HND or just use JL Sakura lounge for the F/J passengers and members of the MPC?

I suspect that decision has already been made...

CX Japan said that CX don't set up own lounge.

JAL and ANA will set up each 2 lounges and Haneda airport authority?
will also set up a lounge.

JAL will have First class Lounge and Sakura Lounge, and ANA will have
ANA Suite Lounge and ANA Lounge.

So I think One World Carrier will use JAL lounges, and Star will use ANA
lounge. Sky team and non alliance carrier will use Haneda Lounge...

Hopefully the JAL lounges will be as good as the ones at NRT in which case I'd prefer to use the JAL lounge than anything CX would setup.

There is lounge image photo on JAL web-site.
Above is Sakura lounge and below is Fist class lnouge.
But no English site, only Japanese virsion.

http://www.jal.co.jp/inter/lounge/topics/2010_09/

JAL will also set up an arrival lounge at HND

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/jal-m...nd-launch.html

some points mentioned.

Sakura lounge has business/dinning/relaxation areas.
network connectivity(wired/wireless).
shower facility, massage chairs.
drink, hot meal.

Arrival lounge also provided with shower/meal/network (not mentioned eligibility)

Absolutely, assuming any CX offering was Narita-like rather than HKG (or the new LHR) - like.

Oosp...wrong post

Not very happy with this lounge situation at Haneda.

CX does not have its own lounge and uses the JAL Lounge. Ok. Fair enough.

I am flying HND-HKG today in paid first. I'm a BA Gold (oneworld Emerald level).

Not allowed to use the first class side of the lounge, however, because "it is too small." The JAL agent in the lounge confirmed that the first class side can only be used by JAL Emerald level members and JAL first class passengers.

Two big thumbs down on this one. :td::td:

I am glad to hear that. :D But I hope the Sakura lounge won't be too crowded as a result :p

Be careful what you praise. What are you going to do if they relegate all JAL flyers to the business class lounges at other carriers regardless of status of fare paid? Not going to sound so sweet, is it?

It is a slippery slope.

Or perhaps you should just stay on the JAL board...

Actually I wouldn't mind. As stated, the lounge is too small and not letting OW elites / F passengers in is the right thing to do.

Then JAL should leave oneworld.

Lounges are subject to capacity controls in relation to its size regardless of airline or alliances. Its a safety requirement, not discrimination. Maybe CX should leave oneworld too since it values its INV/DM+/DMs higher than OW Emeralds?

In fact HND F lounge isn't the first JAL lounge OW Emeralds have problems getting into. Refusing entry to lounge due to capacity constraint is not a violation of OW rules. Airlines should take care of its own customers before taking care of their partners'. Even CX does that sometimes.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/onewo...times-7-a.html

That doesn't suprise me - Gold / Sapphire is the new Silver / Ruby - there are just too many of them.

But OW Emeralds should still be looked after. Even though there's plenty of them as well, it's not easy to maintain. Fortunately AA Platinum is not OW Emerald, you need to be Exec Plat.

B.S.

I walked into the F side of the lounge (with the agent running in after me) to see what I was missing. There was not a single person in there. And it isn't all that small.

Just like CX's case at TPE, JAL is reserving the space for the JMB elites that might show up at any time. That's nothing wrong with it. You can always fly on another carrier, e.g. *A's and Skyteam's, or another airport if being invited into the Sakura lounge instead of the F one at HND is a deal breaker for you :)

Just to make sure, are you sure the lounge agent didn't mix up the eligibility of the F lounge and the JAL Arrival lounge?

Yep. Was told by the CX agent at check-in and then again by the agent in the lounge.

I do see something wrong with it.

JAL is part of the oneworld alliance. The alliance has certain rules. If JAL wants to be in the alliance, they need to abide by the rules. If they don't want to, leave the alliance.

I gain status in the alliance and have a right to expect certain benefits that I am told in advance that I will receive. When a carrier denies those benefits, I am directly affected.

Now the business class lounge was very nice, but that's not the test.

I shouldn't have to wonder at each airport what the local carrier will provide at its whim.

Frankly, I'd like to see all the oneworld carriers at HND boycott the JL lounge and send their passengers to the NH lounge. That would probably get JL's attention.

well I agree that all OW airlines should look at what they agree to give tiers, publish it and stick to it so OW tiers know what to expect. sounds obvious to me but then I don't work in the airline industry :P

As stated before, denying entry to lounge due to capacity constraint is allowed by OW and JAL did not violate any alliance rules here unless they only deny certain partners' Emerald but not all.

But if OW Emeralds simply don't get access to the F lounge at HND, OW should publish that on their website (which by the way still hasn't been updated). OW's press release states OW Emeralds will get access to the F lounge will looks like that's not the case and therefore should update that (just like they did for the arrival lounge)

I suggest you made a formal complaint to Oneworld.

If you have been AA forum, you will see from time to time, someone is complaining not gaining access to BA F in LAX/ORD, QF in HKG...
It's so normal

I flew BA SFO-LHR last week. My CX status and number was on the BP. In addition, the check-in agent also saw my MPC card. However, when I got to the lounge, I was still asked for my MPC card. The lounge agent volunteered the reason - the MPC status on the BP does not necessarily reflect my status on the day of travel. Afterwards, I have been to three BA lounges - two in LHR, one in EDI . They have not asked for my card anymore.

When you are a BA Exec Club member, you are always required to show your membership card at the lounge as apparently the status that shows on your boarding pass can be overwritten manually by the check in agent.

Based on your membership alliance certain *A top tier lounges does not grant entry to *A Golds, only to their own elites, such as LH. I was refused entry when I was an AC Gold to LH FRA FC lounge a long time ago.

So BS to you too.

Yes but you're missing the point here. On the *A website, it clearly states that *G members only have access to designated *G lounges (usually business class or similar tier lounges), which doesn't include the LH first class lounge. However, the issue here is that OW Emeralds are being denied first class lounge access at certain ports, even when first class lounge access is a published benefit for OW Emeralds. Different alliances, different lounge access policies.

Lounge access is subject to capacity constraints. This is stated clearly on OW website. So OW doesn't guarantee elites to have access to all of the lounges listed.

In the HND Sakura lounge now. Must say it is one of the best J lounges in the network and rivals some F lounges.

How about the food? It will get even better at dinner time :)

The lounge was empty. Empty as in not a single person in it (well, except for me and lounge agent chasing me and telling me I couldn't be there).

This was not a capacity issue. It is JAL ignoring the oneworld rules.

And you know it. You are just defending JAL regardless of the facts.

CX does that at TPE lounge too (check the link I posted a while back).

JAL is simply expecting more JAL elites will show up and therefore not granting OW Emeralds access. I stand by the belief that airlines should take care of their own elites before their alliance partners'.

What would you think if you show up at a BA operated F lounge and was told you can't get in because it's filled with non-BA Emeralds flying other OW carriers who arrived earlier than you?

That's why I don't think CX nor JL did anything wrong at the TPE and HND lounge respectively. They are simply protecting their own loyal customers and put their priority above others.

Yes the food was great, and definitely better than the CX narita lounge. However, since I will only be flying to HKG from HND in the near future, I don't think I'll get an opportunity to try out the dinner offerings.

One thing that is a little odd initially in the lounge is that they have catered for almost all people to have a desk table. The seats are good for working, but not great for lounging in.

One other thing is that when I was there, no one seemed to be collecting plates/trays. I thought this might have been due to the Japanese culture of cleaning up after yourself, but there was nowhere to put dirty plates either. Also, no one was replacing the empty bottles of wine. I hope this was an anomaly.

Firstly, I was not gaining access solely based on my BA Emerald status. I was also a paid F passenger.

This is not an occasional issue. It is a standing rule that the lounge is only for JAL elites/passengers and that clearly violates oneworld rules.

I can assure you I had a firm discussion with the CX manager at the gate. When I arrive back home, I will follow-up with letters to CX (F passenger), BA (oneworld Emerald status), and JL (arrogantly ignoring alliance rules it agreed to).

F passengers on CX not JL. Still doesn't change a thing about whether JAL should take care of their own elites before others and how JAL did not violate OW rules.

Good that you write the letters to the airlines as that's a more effective way if you want something to change. But may I suggest sending another letter to OW too as they advertise you will be granted access to the F lounge in their press release (and according to you that's not the case 100% of the time). IF JAL doesn't grant access to other OW Emeralds to HND F 100% of the time due to capacity constraints, OW should not advertise F lounge for elites at HND international terminal. I am interested to find out what responses you get from each of them. Please keep us posted.

That's interesting. They have staff dressed in purple uniform to stand by and collect trays at the NRT lounge. If you fly on JL flights in C, you can try the arrival lounge until March 31 2011 too.

Sometimes it takes them a while to replace empty bottles/food trays...I usually just go ask the staff for more.

At least you get to try the lunch food offering, I can only try their breakfast offering at my flight leaves at 10am :(

Why do you even post on the CX board? Just to be annoying?

I will. Not that it will change your mind.

But congrats! You have singularly done a very good job convincing me why I don't want to fly JAL...

I am looking forward to your updates on the HND lounge situation. In around a month, I will check myself to see if there are any OW Emerald signs outside the HND F lounge too.

OT: If you don't welcome different opinions, you might as well not post on any board. This is an open forum and people are free to express their opinions. It's not my job to convince people which airlines they should fly on, so it doesn't bother me whether you want to fly on JAL or not. But if you ever fly on JAL and need advice, you know where to get them :)