Two bad experiences in Club Europe, FRA-LHR & LHR-MAD
Jun 13, 2018, 9:06 am
#46
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The beauty of RM is that everything can be easily quantified and at least at the companies I have worked for, these awards are solely based on merit. Of course, some people would struggle with the notion that certain things in life can actually be attributed to hard work rather than rude and uneducated opinions without any facts. haha
Jun 17, 2018, 7:58 pm
#47
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You clearly have zero knowledge on this. Maybe at airlines that don't take any pride in their work like BA there aren't, but even cruise lines and hotels issue Excellence in Revenue Management awards every quarter. Some companies even name specific Revenue Management awards in honor of former staff who served that particular company for many years and implemented a lot of new RM tools (no, I don't have an award named after me, but I'm just explaining for reference since you seem to be lost in space on such matter).
No, there's no doubt at all these awards exist. It just seems an odd bit of back-slapping for people simply doing their jobs effectively.
That those jobs involve wringing the last dime from customers, means there's probably not much love around: so peer support is important I guess.
Pricing and revenue management represent vital and dynamic elements in the functioning of airlines. Yet I don't know if awards are offered to practitioners of what many see as a dark art
MacDonald's used to have employee of the month awards, maybe still does. Though I'm not sure how many of those awards make their way into CVs
Jun 19, 2018, 1:43 am
#48
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Jun 19, 2018, 2:23 am
#49
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BA service is going downwards from top notch to worst branded airline in Europe... I still use it because, in the end, it is the way to get to the places without a layover though.
Lately, my experiences in J and WTP are not as satisfactory as I expect, especially in J.
- The long-haul J cabin is outdated (in my opinion).
- Food is getting worst and worst, especially in CE.
- The lounge is overcrowded.
- Service is quite disappointing but depends on the flight though.
As said above, for LHR-MAD I normally take IB metal instead of BA, also the IB once with the 340, top J (and they provide blanket and pillow, for the second comment).
In a route I use to do now frequently (LHR-ORD-LHR) I do AA, best plane and lounge... (and normally cheaper in J).
Lately, my experiences in J and WTP are not as satisfactory as I expect, especially in J.
- The long-haul J cabin is outdated (in my opinion).
- Food is getting worst and worst, especially in CE.
- The lounge is overcrowded.
- Service is quite disappointing but depends on the flight though.
As said above, for LHR-MAD I normally take IB metal instead of BA, also the IB once with the 340, top J (and they provide blanket and pillow, for the second comment).
In a route I use to do now frequently (LHR-ORD-LHR) I do AA, best plane and lounge... (and normally cheaper in J).
Jun 19, 2018, 3:01 am
#50
Join Date: Jul 2009
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This is Intra-Europe J and, frankly, if you’re expecting blankets and pillows you don’t understand the market. Unsure why you think LX is any better (horrible seats, no tray table, food no better than BA).
A QF J ticket between SYD and MEL probably costs a multiple of what you paid for your FRA ticket.
Comments on meal size and cabin cleanliness both fairly fair game, however.
A QF J ticket between SYD and MEL probably costs a multiple of what you paid for your FRA ticket.
Comments on meal size and cabin cleanliness both fairly fair game, however.
Jun 19, 2018, 3:30 am
#51
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Flew economy on Turkish Airlines last week, Edinburgh to Istanbul (to avoid an LHR connection) - pillows and blankets in economy, individual IFE screens with a variety of films, food - a choice of hot options - which they did not run out by the time they got to the middle of the cabin where we sat; choice of wines, food quality and quantity much better than what I normally get in Club Europe. Super-friendly and experienced crew. I guess they fail to understand the market as well
Agree that BA's CE product is uncompetitive on longer routes and particularly inadequate on LHR-IST. However, I am hardly one of the biggest defenders of BA here but on short routes to Western Europe BA CE is no worse than the very low standard of competition most of the time.
Jun 19, 2018, 10:16 am
#52
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Flew economy on Turkish Airlines last week, Edinburgh to Istanbul (to avoid an LHR connection) - pillows and blankets in economy, individual IFE screens with a variety of films, food - a choice of hot options - which they did not run out by the time they got to the middle of the cabin where we sat; choice of wines, food quality and quantity much better than what I normally get in Club Europe. Super-friendly and experienced crew. I guess they fail to understand the market as well
While they don't compete with BA on LHR FRA they are getting a lot of African, Middle East and Asian traffic from non-London UK airports. And I dare say a fair amount from LHR and LGW.
And yes, Istanbul really is a bit of a nightmare in its rush hours. But at least there's no terminal interchange malarky on (international) connections.
To cap it all, I got a quibble free EUR600 for a delay CAI into IST and the missed connection to Manchester. They bought me a ticket on Lufthansa through Frankfurt as well.
Jun 19, 2018, 11:49 am
#53
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Just had two negative experiences with BA's Club Europe and wanted to share my thoughts.
FRA - LHR
I find it ridiculous how BA has claimed that it needs to reduce the size of the Club Europe cabins due to the cost of meals as if they were actually serving quality food.
FRA - LHR
I find it ridiculous how BA has claimed that it needs to reduce the size of the Club Europe cabins due to the cost of meals as if they were actually serving quality food.
LHR - MAD (4-class 772 sold as 2-class)
(FIRST was completely full with families and nonrevs). Meal presentation was again awful and the quality of the meal was quite poor (very fishy salmon appetizer, odd tasting cheese course, small chicken breast as entree, and a bland coffee mousse for dessert). No blankets or pillows onboard despite this being an aircraft that primarily flies international routes. Some members of the cabin crew seemed like they were going to have a heart attack due to the large number of Club Europe passengers in two cabins and very few displayed a calm, professional image.
(FIRST was completely full with families and nonrevs). Meal presentation was again awful and the quality of the meal was quite poor (very fishy salmon appetizer, odd tasting cheese course, small chicken breast as entree, and a bland coffee mousse for dessert). No blankets or pillows onboard despite this being an aircraft that primarily flies international routes. Some members of the cabin crew seemed like they were going to have a heart attack due to the large number of Club Europe passengers in two cabins and very few displayed a calm, professional image.
. From now on, I will avoid BA as much as possible.
Jun 19, 2018, 12:00 pm
#54
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Yes, and if you're fortunate enough to get in their business cabin on short haul flights, it's a winner with dedicated US domestic first-class style 2x2 seating.
While they don't compete with BA on LHR FRA they are getting a lot of African, Middle East and Asian traffic from non-London UK airports. And I dare say a fair amount from LHR and LGW.
And yes, Istanbul really is a bit of a nightmare in its rush hours. But at least there's no terminal interchange malarky on (international) connections.
To cap it all, I got a quibble free EUR600 for a delay CAI into IST and the missed connection to Manchester. They bought me a ticket on Lufthansa through Frankfurt as well.
While they don't compete with BA on LHR FRA they are getting a lot of African, Middle East and Asian traffic from non-London UK airports. And I dare say a fair amount from LHR and LGW.
And yes, Istanbul really is a bit of a nightmare in its rush hours. But at least there's no terminal interchange malarky on (international) connections.
To cap it all, I got a quibble free EUR600 for a delay CAI into IST and the missed connection to Manchester. They bought me a ticket on Lufthansa through Frankfurt as well.
Jun 19, 2018, 2:13 pm
#55
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 614
Club is limited on the neo/ceo aircraft on long sector flights as the catering cannot be accommodated in the miserable galleys we have to work out of. This maybe a thing of the past when Club Europe catering is relaunched (again) in September. I'm sure someone on this board will have the details well ahead of the crew who have to deliver it, so I'm watching like a hawk!
Last edited by bwaflyer; Jun 19, 2018 at 2:33 pm Reason: fat fingered typing! Thanks Oxon Flyer
Jun 19, 2018, 6:40 pm
#56
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But the high TK fares are for LON IST, so i guess the airline is using pricing to protect the limited number of (dedicated) business-class seats for the passengers connecting to the wider network.
Jun 28, 2018, 10:56 pm
#57
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No, there's no doubt at all these awards exist. It just seems an odd bit of back-slapping for people simply doing their jobs effectively.
That those jobs involve wringing the last dime from customers, means there's probably not much love around: so peer support is important I guess.
Pricing and revenue management represent vital and dynamic elements in the functioning of airlines. Yet I don't know if awards are offered to practitioners of what many see as a dark art
MacDonald's used to have employee of the month awards, maybe still does. Though I'm not sure how many of those awards make their way into CVs
That those jobs involve wringing the last dime from customers, means there's probably not much love around: so peer support is important I guess.
Pricing and revenue management represent vital and dynamic elements in the functioning of airlines. Yet I don't know if awards are offered to practitioners of what many see as a dark art
MacDonald's used to have employee of the month awards, maybe still does. Though I'm not sure how many of those awards make their way into CVs
As for BA putting non-revs and families in the FIRST cabin instead of paid business pax, I can't blame the PRM team entirely for this, but they should work better with Operations. Thank God I'm not flying BA any time soon.
Jun 28, 2018, 11:06 pm
#58
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When did they say that? From a conversation that I had three weeks ago with a Senior Product manager at BA this is not the case at all.
These are your opinions, they are not facts. You would have no proof they non-rev or not - indeed you have no knowledge of whether there had been a previous cancellation which caused a lot of this crowded situation. That you did not like the food is, again, your taste. I have eaten the same menu as you and have no problem with it, but that is personal preference.
These are your opinions, they are not facts. You would have no proof they non-rev or not - indeed you have no knowledge of whether there had been a previous cancellation which caused a lot of this crowded situation. That you did not like the food is, again, your taste. I have eaten the same menu as you and have no problem with it, but that is personal preference.
Shame - you will be missed![/QUOTE]
If you have nothing educated to say, please don't comment on things you have zero knowledge of.
I suppose BA and IB sell staff uniforms at standard stores in London and Madrid and hence why several deadheading BA/IB crew came to say hello to the cabin crew working in the Club galley?!?!?! They then headed back to the FIRST cabin where they were sitting. Further, the cabin crew operating my flight did politely comment to one another that they felt bad so many paid pax were left in Club with broken seats including Gold members.
Finally, my comments were not just related to the quality of the food but also its poor presentation (plates didn't even fit on the tray), though I explicitly stated that I realized this was entirely outside the control of the cabin crew as they can only work with the limited resources BA gives them.
And yes, I'm sure BA will miss me as I will not be paying J tickets on them unless it is an emergency.
Jun 29, 2018, 8:30 am
#59
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[QUOTE=fly747first;29918841]
Who was talking about BA Dear?, I meant those of us that are eager to be educated. Quite what in I’m uncertain, but I’m sure it will be to the benefit of someone.
Shame - you will be missed!
If you have nothing educated to say, please don't comment on things you have zero knowledge of.
And yes, I'm sure BA will miss me as I will not be paying J tickets on them unless it is an emergency.
And yes, I'm sure BA will miss me as I will not be paying J tickets on them unless it is an emergency.
Jun 30, 2018, 12:17 am
#60
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I am not sure what BA is doing these days to make their intra-European meal service offering so hurried, minimal and ordinary. Perhaps minimal staffing? To think some 20+ years ago everyone on board was offered a meal and full bar service. I recall some very agreeable 737 flights in Y from CGN to LHR with a tasty cold meal service, or the 757 to HEL with a hot meal in Y that would better most CE meals today.
In contrast, my experiences on the relatively short SYD-MEL QF A330 run are a delight compared to the hurried and grubby experience on a BA 319 from HAM - about the same flying time. J-class gets a hot meal of some description (and a proper cabin) and Y-class gets a heated snack, as well as a full bar service. All unhurried with that particularly QF professionalism I appreciate.
I have 5 CE flights around Europe later in the year and I am prepared to be underwhelmed - I don't need the points and I chose them for the schedule timings. However, I do think the shocking UK airport experience (MAN/LBA/NCL - and non-BA airports like SOU/BHX) have a lot to do with the total experience..
In contrast, my experiences on the relatively short SYD-MEL QF A330 run are a delight compared to the hurried and grubby experience on a BA 319 from HAM - about the same flying time. J-class gets a hot meal of some description (and a proper cabin) and Y-class gets a heated snack, as well as a full bar service. All unhurried with that particularly QF professionalism I appreciate.
I have 5 CE flights around Europe later in the year and I am prepared to be underwhelmed - I don't need the points and I chose them for the schedule timings. However, I do think the shocking UK airport experience (MAN/LBA/NCL - and non-BA airports like SOU/BHX) have a lot to do with the total experience..