wflanagan

This is a warning, and a request for advice.

TL;DR - 3 days ago, I transferred 254,000 (317,500 with conversion) MR points to Flying Blue. They, however, refuse to book the tickets, with FB staff stating the account is "Fraudulent." (the message on the website is that the booking request is too complicated, and that you have to go to a ticket office). I have:

• Gone to the ticket counter/office (at IAD) and verified my identity with Air France every way to Sunday (US driver's license, passports for all traveling members on the routing)
• Tried the next day, different route, shorter routes, all failed with the same error.
• A literal Air France employee/ticket agent at IAD (on the phone with Flying Blue France) tried, after looking at my passport and validating me, still could not book the ticket.
• I have attempted to reach out ot AMEX. They stated the miles transfer is 1 way, and they cannot get them back.
• Air France/FB has stated the miles can't be transferred back, because they're from a fraudulent account.

Does anyone have any suggestions? Writing off 317,500 points is not something i'm just willing to do. I'm just trying to book some airfare before all the miles seats are gone!

My original plan was to post EVERY conversation that i've documented, with PNRs, Employee names, dates, times, etc. But, I opted to skip it. But, if anyone wants it I'm happy to supply.

Instead, I will summarize the things I was told by Flying Blue personnel. Again, I have documentation of all of this I'm happy to share.

• Air France and Flying Blue are totally different companies. There is not much point (though they recommended me to do this) to try to deal with the AirFrance counter when trying to work with Flying Blue.
• I was told my account was fraudulent because of my credit card. However, my credit card was never attempted to be charged for the first 2 days (I verified this with AMEX, and the 3rd time they tried, the charge was approved). The net is that their answers are NOT always accurate as to why things aren't working.
• When Air France/FB puts a Record Locator on HOLD, this doesn't' actually mean anything. 100% of the 3 attempted transactions over multiple days were terminated and the "inventory" was pushed back.. I was told that they would give me 7 days to resolve the matter, but never was. Any any attempts to rebook that same routing the required miles magically went up by 100K miles.
• Air France and Flying Blue have a corporate policy that 100% demands that you can never, ever, ever, be handed off to a supervisor. If you don't like what the first person says, you're out of luck. This was validated by 3 different phone staff.
• Air France and Flying Blue hand out inventory in 2 seat chunks. So, if you're trying to book a family (or more than 2), you are forced to pay a higher fare for the 3rd person. Super family friendly!
• One person said "because it's your credit card, maybe you shouldn't use American Express." I'm sure the their partner American Express would love to hear that Air France/Flying Blue people are telling them not to use an AMEX to book airfare. He also suggested to go to the ticket counter with cash to see if that works.
• The dates and times that the "ticket offices" are open on the Air France website are incorrect. They do not open at IAD at 9am. They open at 2pm, or aren't open at all unless a flight's coming in or going out. There are, at least in the DC area, no other "ticket offices" to go to resolve the matter. I went at 9am (which I was told to do by a Flying Blue agent), and got to go to a Starbucks and wait for several hours (on the phone with Flying Blue and AMEX in the meantime).
• Copa Airlines (who were the next over), one of their people saw me waiting for the Air France gate agent to come out.. went into the back, and grabbed them for me. Thumbs up for friendly Copa! The bright spot of the day!
• Hold times to talk to Flying Blue average 45 minutes to 1 hour.

This has been a *#*^%#^%* terrible experience, and continues to be. I'm honestly not sure what my next move is, though I can promise i'm not going to give up 254,000 miles without a fight. I've burned now 3 days on this. No end in sight. I'm a regular flyer on AA (Platinum for Life on American) and Star Alliance. I have an office in Europe. My wife is German. I get to Europe a LOT. This was my first experience with Air France. Not a business/first class experience by any stretch of the imagination.

Anyone have any suggestions?

FBplatinum

I see you are from North America, did you call the North America Flying Blue # ?

sbams

Did you open a new Flying Blue account specially to book these tickets? Are you yourself one of the travelling passengers? There are extensive accounts here on FT of similar cases to this. FB considers transactions on new accounts with transferred miles to be suspect, especially if the account holder is not travelling. And it doesn't take too much to understand why. That they freeze the points and you are not allowed to return them as MR points to Amex seems to go above and beyond but FB protecting themselves from potential fraud seems reasonable.

I am not saying you are being fraudulent (unless you want to divulge that you were intending to sell these tickets to a 3rd party, which is not allowed) just trying to offer reasons why FB sees it that way.

Often1

For how long have you had a FB account?
What was the account balance before you transferred in the miles?
Where did the miles which form the rest of the balance come from?
Have you ever booked FB tickets for anyone other than yourself?

wflanagan

It's a new account. I opened it to book the flights and fly... Yes. But, I also was willing and opening to flying with Air France in the future if it all went well.. I feel like things have gone downhill on the Star Alliance front as of late. .and was interested in expanding.. but this has been quite a nightmare.

wflanagan

The account was new. It was 0. All of the miles came from my Membership Rewards account (and there's still some left). I tried to book tickets for myself and my wife and daughter.

wflanagan

So, from the way I see it.. I opened an account. I transferred the miles in. they have the miles and they have them from American Express, through an AUTHORIZED API that validates me as an individual, an individual with 317,500 miles (and more than that actually). The credit card is in my name. The $1,000+ in fees and taxes for this was approved, and the address to for the credit card used is one of the accounts addresses on the Flying Blue account. Before the transaction happened, they texted the phone number on the Flying Blue account, and I answered with the code they gave me.

And, the credit card used to pay the taxes and fees is the EXACT same one that transferred the points.

So, at this point, we're approaching the amount of security required to access my bank account.

But, let's go beyond that. Today, per Flying Blue's instructions, I spent all day IAD. They saw me, my drivers license, my passports.. The passports of all the people traveling in my party. And, after that, they still stated that I'm a fraud, and that there is nothing they can do, other than keep my miles.

I get that you want to give them the benefit of the doubt, but c'mon. Really?

Even more to that, that entitles them to confiscate 317,500 miles?

And, someone else asked about the difference in miles. I transferred 254,000 and got 317.500. AirFrance/Amex are running a promotion right now that gives you a bonus to transfer miles. That was the reason i took the plunge versus sticking with star alliance.

wflanagan

Started with that. Today, from the IAD ticket counter, we called Flying Blue in Paris. The calls before that were to the North American number.

Maestro Ramen

May I suggeat you hit them up on twitter, calmly and clearly (144 character limit does wonders to calm the soul).

Community managers can do things that call centers agents cannot.

Since the account is clearly not fraudulent I can only believe you will get your miles unfrozen eventually. In time for your resevation? Maybe not... Can only imagine how frustrating it is. Hang in there!

Maestro Ramen

Example of wording if it helps:

@airfrance @FlyingBlue created new FB account. Transfered 300k amex miles. Now all gone. "suspected fraud". Intended to travel with my family. Please help.

wflanagan

Thanks. I almost did earlier. Then, decided the conversation on Twitter was so negative about Air France, that it might not help. I will, and use your wording. Thanks!

warakorn

You have so much time travelling to IAD and spending the entire day there.
Why dont you just buy a cash ticket?

ctbarron

Often1

Twitter is the way to go. Enforced brevity confines the writer to what matters. Remember that AF/FB have in front of them every detail of OP's interaction with both of them, so no need to repeat.

Norri

Maybe he wants his 317,000 miles back?