brunos

https://www.skyteam.com/en/about/pre...hina-Southern/

Speculations are that they willl join OW given their strong link with AA.

Zarmakuizz

Let's wait for the impact on the AFKLM - China Southern - Xiamen joint-venture.

I will not miss the Economy Supersaver offers.

KL803

The exit of CZ has been rumoured for some time now and is no surprise: see the South China Morning Post article from November 27, 2017. MF is a rather small player in the Chinese market, so a take over by CZ would be no surprise either. AFKL will tighten their relationship with MU I reckon, while the future of MF is a bit uncertain as they've started international flights only a few years ago with the arrival of the 787s in its fleet. The move of CZ will likely be followed by a move of CX out of Oneworld. Another Chinese player in this game would be HU with no tights to any alliance yet. Interesting times ahead in the Chinese market.

Concerto

tbaiyun

I am kind of confused of their decision though, and how AF/KL can potentially be affected.

For now, CZ basically has very limited service into OW's hub: NRT/HND for JL, LHR for BA, SYD for QF and basically that is it. Needless to say they tend to serve like 5 to 6 destinations to Australia (SYD, MEL, BNE, PER, CNS) so QF's connection is quite unnecessary. And CZ is not even flying into any of the AA's real hub: DFW, MIA, ORD, CAN-DFW may not have enough load and CAN-MIA shall be out of range, only with LAX and JFK that can be a blood bath.

On the other hand, they have quite some services into ST's hubs: CDG, AMS, NBO, MEX, (JFK), FCO, SVO, CGK, HAN/SGN, etc. The same, they tend to fly quite some short-hauls into Vietnam and Indonesia so connection is negligible. Eventually, CZ will lose a big game in Europe and it is lose-lose for both AF/KL and CZ. CZ will lose all the connections into the rest of Continental Europe, for any connecting through LHR or MAD will not be distance-wise. While AF/KL and DL will lose all connections in PEK and CAN, meaning for the rest of mainland China, they have to mainly rely on PVG which is not an easy point to connect to domestic flights, the rest WUH, CTU, XMN, HGH, non of them is a hub for MU, unless they have to count on the CDG-KMG for the connections.

AF/KL shall be quite unhappy about this I think, but there is nothing they can do as DL and MU shall be the main reason why CZ leaves ST.

AF shall drop CDG-CAN route later IMO.

Goldorak

NickB

It could indeed or, even if not a JV as such, at least an extensive codeshare agreement. The way I read it was that CZ wanted to be free to develop bilateral partnerships rather than alliance-wide arrangements but I may have misread it and brunos might be right that CZ's plan is to change alliances, in which case I would agree with him that OW would be the most likely one, although I can't see CX being very keen on this.

bodory

Discussed since some months here in Asia. Not really surprising.

I will miss their J fares

Goldorak

NickB

I think that you might have misread my post. I was not questioning whether CZ was leaving ST. This has been officially confirmed. Rather, what I was not sure about is whether brunos was right that CZ may join another alliance or whether my understanding that CZ is in fact moving away from broad alliances to pursue bilateral partnerships instead was correct.

brunos

I was only mentioning rumors that abound in China.
I agree with you that the development of JVs and code-shares within or outside alliances, make alliances less relevant today.
CZ and AA seems to have engaged in a close collaboration. And AA is rejoicing:
Newsroom - American Airlines Statement on China Southern - American Airlines Group, Inc.

OW is really agitated. I am not aware that CX has any plan to leave OW even if rumors abound. But QR is clearly unhappy with QF and AA, and might move to a closer link (including on FFP benefits) with only BA, CX and LATAM. Whether these airlines want it is another question. OW is not happy with the QF-EK link. AA needs a serious Chinese partner and is likely to engage in more codeshares and FFP benefit sharing even if CZ does not join OW in the short run. BA has also entered in a significant codesharing agreement with CZ.

Notwithstanding alliances, DL-AFKL-MU is a strong partnership and BA-AA-CZ another one. Again, my feeling is that global alliances are becoming less relevant. Even CX is now partnering with LH with (some) reciprocal FFP benefits.

Goldorak

NickB

no worries.

barracuda93

The best Chinese airline is Hainan Airlines (HU).

Concerto

And it has kept itself out of an alliance so far. I wonder if it will be possible to use China Southern next year and still profit from all the benefits of FB Platinum. Need to know that before making long term bookings. It would be silly to end up without any much needed XPs.