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Program choices: decision making tools
I've started putting serious work into choosing a program for next year. It occurs to me that others might find this info useful, so I'll post it here. It's still a work in progress, and will continue to progress probably until the middle of January (as I don't have any travel scheduled until then.)
The first is a list of destinations that each airline under consideration flies to. This is important to me because generally you can only easily upgrade on flights operated by your carrier of choice, and not codeshares. (There are exceptions, but for my purposes they are not yet significant.) The first, and so far only, airline is AA. They are weak in the "A's" -- Africa, Asia, and Australia, not bad in Europe, and have a lock on the Americas including the Caribbean. Here's their list in no particular order, with other airlines to follow shortly. [(S) = Seasonal] AA --------------- Europe Glasgow (S) Manchester London Madrid Paris Zurich Frankfurt Brussels Rome (S) South America Maracaibo Medeilin Bogato Cali Quito Guayaquil Lima Santiago Buenos Aires Montevideo Asuncion Sao Paulo Rio de Janeiro Santa Cruz La Paz Belo Horizonte Caracas Asia Tokyo Central America Belize Guatemala San Salvidore Managua San Jose (CR) Panama San Pedro Sula Tegucigalpa Caribbean Freeport Marsh Harbour Nassau George Town Providenciales Bermuda Grand Cayman Montego Bay Kingston Port-au-Prince Santiago Puerto Plata Santo Domingo Caaa de Campo Punta Cana San Jaun (PR) Mayaguez St Thomas St Croix Tortola Beef Isl Anguilla St Maarten St Kitts Pointe-a-Pitre Dominica St Lucia Canouan Isl St Vincent & Gren Barbados Grenada Port of Spain Aruba Curacao Bonaire Mexico Monterry Los Cabos Aguascalientes Leon-Guanajuato Guadalajara Puerto Vallarta Acapulco Mexico City Cancun Canada Vancouver Calgary Toronto Ottawa Montreal [This message has been edited by Ken hAAmer (edited Dec 23, 2003).] |
guess that's why they are "American" Airlines!
Thanks Ken, didn't know they flew to ALL those places in South America |
Here's United. Good in Asia and Australia, weak in Africa, so-so in the Americas (particularly Mexico, after March 31) and Europe.
United --------------- Europe London Amsterdam Brussels Paris Frankfurt Munich Asia Singapore Bangkok Hong Kong Tokyo Taipei Shanghai Beijing Seoul Osaka Australia Sydney Melbourne Central America San Jose (CR) San Salvador Guatemala Caribbean Grand Cayman San Juan (PR) St Thomas Aruba Mexico Mexico City Canada Vancouver Calgary Edmonton Winnipeg Toronto Montreal [This message has been edited by Ken hAAmer (edited Dec 23, 2003).] |
Here's Delta. Excellent to Europe, weak to Asia, Africa and Australia, decent in the Americas.
Delta --------------- Europe Moscow Istanbul Athens Shannon Dublin Manchester London Madrid Barcelona Nice Paris Brussels Amsterdam Frankfurt Munich Stuttgart Zurich Venice Milan Rome South America Caracas Barranquilla Cartegena Medellin Pereira Cali Bogota Lima Santiago Sau Paulo Asia Tokyo Mumbai Central America San Jose (CR) San Salvador Guatemala Panama Guanacaste Liberia Caribbean Aruba Curacao St Maarten San Juan (PR) St Thomas Turks & Caicos Grand Cayman Montego Bay Nassau Freeport Mexico Cabo San Lucas Guadalajara Mexico City Leon Cancun Canada Vancouver Calgary Toronto Montreal Ottawa Halifax |
For United, I believe their U.S. hubs are IAD, ORD, SFO, DEN and LAX. For some reason, U.S. cities have been omitted from the listing.
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I think it's because Ken's just assuming the US carriers will fly just about anywhere and everywhere in the US.
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AA big hubs are in ORD, DFW, MIA, STL with major ops in LAX, SEA and BOS.
DL hubs out of ATL, SLC, CVG and DFW US hubs out of PIT, PHL, DCA NW hubs out of MSP, DTW, SEA and MEM CO hubs out of CLE, EWR and IAH i've probably missed a few... |
and what about Air Canada Ken? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif
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Thanks for the hub info. It hadn't yet occurred to me that that info might be useful. (Maybe it never would have.)
US cities weren't included because there are just too many, and it would overwhelm the list, making it less useful. Most major US carriers cover most of the US, but there are gaps. Some carriers (US) are primarily in the east, while others (AS) are primarily in the west, for example. One aspect that's important though, is what kind of equipment each carrier flies out of their Canadian cities, and perhaps more important, how many flight and to where from each Canadian city. Much as I like AA they are weak in this regard (at least from YVR.) From YVR they only have two flights a day, to DFW. So if you want to fly to BOS on AA metal, you'll have to fly YVR-DFW-BOS. (Good for accumulating miles, however.) Likewise, DL pretty much only offers CRJ service out of YVR for much of the year. You can get DL codeshares on NW metal, but then you're back to the "can I upgrade" question. More stuff to come. [This message has been edited by Ken hAAmer (edited Dec 23, 2003).] |
UA
Main Hubs ORD, LGA, IAD, SFO, DEN Mini Hubs MIA, LAX |
Once NW becomes a member of the DL/AF alliance, it will be a formidable option given links to AS in the west and service ex-YYZ and YUL as well as YEG, YYC, YVR and even YWG and YQR. MSP is a major gateway and the link with KLM and CO offer an array of FF benefits on numerous carriers. Not to mention, AmexPlat members have access to NW World Clubs and CO Presidents Clubs.
As always, the program of choice depends on one's travel patterns. For domestic travellers, AC is really the only game in town. Unless one foregoes programs altogether, fly WEST JET, and use any money saved, along with a credit card like AVION, the new DINERS, to the Scotia and TD Visas, to accumulate an alternative approach to "free" trips. [Design your own FF program. |
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Shareholder: fly WEST JET, and use any money saved, [Design your own FF program.</font> |
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">I find AC to be cheaper than WS 90% of the time. Not to mention the better schedule and lounge access.</font> WS can charge more than the "main line full service carrier" and yet their planes are still filling up and they are making money quarter after quarter. |
Come on KH, you know AC's overheads are far higher than WJ's not to mentioning operating costs on newer jets, younger staff, and far less infrastructure [res, maintenance, Aeroplan]. And my experience shows AC's flights are just as full on those routes it flies tail to tail with WJ.
The real issue is Canadians once more have a choice between two carriers on major domestic routes, each with a very different corporate/staff culture. Which is better, as you yourself point out in the whole theme of this discussion, depends upon what services one expects. |
My point was that it seems that people are willing to pay more for a WS flight, at least as inferred by the previous poster.
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