Seems the price just keeps going up...
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...a34850cb72.png

This was me telling what my wife refers to as "a joke for your flight-nerd friends" about the fact that ANZ business award space to/from North America in partner programs is like Sasquatch. Everybody swears they know somebody who met a guy who saw it one time.

Ha :)

It certainly appears to me my fears have been confirmed - Aeroplan was a great deal for business class flights and no longer appears to be. Good thing I cashed out my points for an epic all-business-class trip to Dubai and Muscat in February (right before COVID!)

I wish people would stop saying this.

Some routes have gone to hell, others have become terrific value.

The real problem with the new program is that AC announced a bunch of price ranges, then launched a system that ignores them completely.

...which is not terribly surprising, from AC, but since they managed to make some real improvements to the website, here I was foolishly hoping they'd clean up their communications act a little as well.

The problem is that people didn't read the fine print. From the awards chart published when the new AE was announced (https://www.aircanada.com/content/da...chart-en.pdf): "Points displayed are estimated ranges for one-way travel, and are for informational purposes only".

People took these numbers as being hard numbers, and they never were meant to be - although I'll give you AC being abismal at communications. I figured when the program went live there would be some surprises, although in terms of my needs it's actually working out to being better. I started out with AE as being a source of rewards flights to London. High YQ killed that for me, and I eventually branched out to other Europe redemptions. With the elimination of YQ on redemptions, suddenly that simple YQB-whatever connection city-LHR is back in play - and points-wise I'm finding plenty of acceptable J options in the 44,000 range, which is less than even before the last devaluation.

However, you need to know how to read the results. For instance...

You need to click on the top of the column to sort the options from lowest to highest points. When you do that, I'm seeing options starting at around 50,000 (albeit with stops).

I'd expect an estimate to be correct most of the time. Or at least some of the time. I checked 70 flights for one route, and Y was never in the "estimated" range. J was in range less than 10% of the time.

And while you offer one quote, here's another: "You can expect your reward flight to fall into this range during normal times."

My searches were all during normal times. Not Christmas, not March break, not reading week, etc.

So in my one search so far, for my most commonly used reward route (AB to BC). A reward that was 7500 miles a couple of weeks ago is now 20-30k (in standard). That's what I expected and it sucks.

I actually quite like the new program, since J in AC metal TPAC is now cheaper with P25K and VIP card. I used to have to spend 75K plus fees for one-way in EVA BR J, now I just redeemed 110K for a roundtrip in AC J and $75 in fees, and 13 eUpgrade credits.

Sure AC is not as good as BR, but on the other hand, it's a direct flight and the AC bed isn't bad (when it's not deflated).

Honestly, a big improvement!

Nitehawk, were you looking close-in (<7Days) or/and a route with competition?

I'll have to go with YOWgary here, there are some plus, alot of Minuses but at least the entire thing didn't get butchered to SkyPesos/Skyyens.

Pluses
- Non-stop AC Metal J YVR-Asia, YYZ/YUL-Europe seems to have gone 10-15% cheaper in miles + YQ Difference
- Likewise for some YVR-YYZ/YUL transcon
- Lat Y award + E-Upgrades for R Class, VERY curious if this is the Sweet Spot in the future!!!
- P25 or CC seems to give the roughly the same ~8-10% Mileage Discount, not a Bad $139 investment :)

Minuses
- Partner Redemptions have gone up, the West Coast - EU crowd really got whacked here
- Close-In (<7days), Last Minute Getaway crowd also got whacked, forget that Last Minute 7.5K Short haul award
- Non-Competitive route, those folks most likely got whacked, maybe try Partner Miles or different alliance altogether?

- Holiday Crowd? Haven't tested this yet, but were Errorplan releasing X/I for Sun/Sand Destination even at T-355?

Wishes
- Perhaps they can highlight certain options as Savers?!?

TBD
- Stopover Pricing

I mean with some planning, this new offering isn't completely God-Awful.
*You're not getting the Delta "Never-Saver" Transcon Pod treatmeat, 69.3K LAX-JFK for Delta One, at least not yet...
Hard to say Post-Pandemic if we ever get to that point.

The program change definitely seems to want to incentive us to fly more AC metal for award burns, especially if AC is badly underselling on a particular day!

That's not TBD. It's 5k per stopover, max 1 stopover per bound.

I'm looking close in, and on a domestic route. The only competition is WS. Just check YVR-YYC or YVR-YEG.

Old program, 7500 miles in X regardless of booking date.

New program, 20-30k in standard. (SE, no AE credit card).

I'm not surprised to see this based on the guidance we were given in advance. The new AE removed a lot of value for me personally from AE.

Long haul rewards should be better, I knew I was redeeming in a sweet spot. Like the loss of SPG, the loss of the old Aeroplan is a reminder to us that all good things can easily come to an end.

Nah.

When the published materials say "points displayed are estimated ranges", and literally every AC result is coming in at more than double the top end of the "estimated range" (as in the example of YVR-SYD), and every non-mixed-cabin partner result is coming in above the fixed cost specified in AC's marketing materials, we're no longer talking about a question of "you should've read the fine print more carefully".

While we're on the subject of Australia, just a reminder that YVR-MEL and YVR-SYD now both carry a 20-30% penalty over YVR-BNE, as the latter is the only one that falls just under the 7,500-mile cutoff.

All connections to Bangkok should now be through China or Korea, since flying through Tokyo now adds a similar penalty.

My apologies canadiancow, I should've meant my own testing on the stopover bennies :D:D:D

Nitehawk, I know this is not all that useful of a suggestion but I wonder if ones need to pay attention to a Routes "Advanced Purchase"

For example I was sitting on this since last night, was curious why I was still seeing "Saver" rates for YVR-YYZ 1 week out.
Screenshot was from 1 hr ago, however YVR-YYC/YEG or YOW/YUL-YYZ seems to be a completely different story.
Inside T-14 on any of thoses and you're whacked :(

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...3186917b82.png

And tbf, only reason why I would be interested in YVR-YYC/YEG would be last minute equipment swap into C-GBIA which seems to be YVR based recently :p

Well this is definitely a YMMV, because literally every result from my searches is giving me results that are below the range given in the chart. I'm talking sub-50,000 1-stop itineraries to LHR and ATH from YQB. So maybe the sweeping generalization we can take from this is that Europe-bound travellers are the winners, and Asia-Pacific-bound travellers are the losers...?

Maybe I'm just more cynical; I never thought that chart was going to be worth the PDF it's written on.

does anyone know if the points discount for having the entry-level (platinum) credit cards is the same as for having the core (infinite) cards? i'm just wondering if getting the no-fee CIBC card would be of any benefit.

I've never said that they weren't also wrong in ways that benefit the traveller, but those haven't been nearly as far off the mark as the ones that effectively blockade the affected routes.

Every card gets some discount. Not enough time has elapsed to know whether the discounts are ever different or significantly different.

But I see no harm in getting a no-fee card.

It looks like it is to the detriment of those of us in the small centres. Old redemption schedule worked well for us where flights to the nearest major hub were essentially free; the new one, not so much.
As I said in August, I was willing to spend points like a drunken sailor with zero regrets regarding that strategy. For our flying habits it was a good bet.
Flew the ladies YXS to YYZ with YVR-YYZ in Signature J for less than I could book either leg YXS YYJ return (both over 2 weeks out). I could show you the fare, but I didn't do a PNG before they cancelled the flight I wanted anyway.
Yes, short haul is usually not the best deal for AE points, but better options were available in the BEFORE TIMES.

[/QUOTE]

I also expected the program to get slightly worse, but as is it isn’t usable for me (YMMV). That being said, it’s early and the worldwide industry is broken from COVID. It’s certainly possible once things get back to normal and something close to a normal flight schedule resumes there will be more flights loaded in at more reasonable prices.

it’s also certainly possible that lower flights exist on certain days but the interface makes it very hard to find them. Needs a 30 day search window and better search options (non stop only, J only, etc)

^

That last paragraph about the PDF is not a quote from me.

Business Class lowest reward for YVR-EU flights are booking into P for YVR-YYC segments and I for everything else, including EU partner segments for about 110k pts RT.

25K/TD Aeroplan.
Actually cheaper than on the old redemption points.
Booked flex reward; as I've already cancelled one booking made previously. Well worth the extra 12k points for free changes/cancellations.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...1f2ba02511.png

Save yourself the 12k points. All reward tickets booked until the end of the year are flexible.
https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/.../covid-19.html

I found YYZ / BOM / YYZ ( NON STOP BOTH WAYS ) DEP JAN 11 / RET MAR 16


ALL CASH FARE ECONOMY $ 1722 BUSINESS $ 4514
NO STATUS / NO CC ECONOMY 100,300 PTS. + $83.70 BUSINESS 149,200 PTS. + $83.70
NO STATUS CC (TDVI) ECONOMY 87,700 PTS. + $83.70 BUSINESS 132,500 PTS. + $83.70

Might seem like an odd question, but does having certain credit cards result in reduced AP points needed to book a flight? I see people indicating what Elite level they are and what CC they have. I'm struggling to find an explanation on how this the CC is relevant. If it's true, can someone point me to an explanation? My searches are coming up empty.

YXS-NYC RETURN
Via YVR and either YYZ or YUL
The YXS-YVR leg is in Y regardless.


With 25K TD Visa INF
June 10
Y: 10,600 + $65 J: 22,500 + $65

June 24
Y: 10,600 + $13 J: 21,300 + $9

Without status/cc
June 10
Y: 11,900 + $65 J: 25,000 + $65

June 24
Y: 11,900 + $13 J: 23,700 + $9

And like the MHD "lite", those fares are cheaper than YXS-YYZ by about 10%.
Pull back to April, and those fares double unless its the red-eye or multiple connections.

Yes, aeroplan co-branded credit card holders get "preferred pricing," i.e. fewer points.

read this: https://princeoftravel.com/blog/new-...erred-pricing/

Thanks so much for this.

My CIBC Infinite Aeroplan CC renewed in October 2020, just before the new program rolled out. If I understand correctly, the link between the preferred CC and the aeroplan card is made automatically when you sign up, but does anyone if my pre-Nov 8 card is also eligible for the preferred rates?

[QUOTE=mgn2000;32820124]I found YYZ / BOM / YYZ ( NON STOP BOTH WAYS ) DEP JAN 11 / RET MAR 16


ALL CASH FARE ECONOMY $ 1722 BUSINESS $ 4514
NO STATUS / NO CC ECONOMY 100,300 PTS. + $83.70 BUSINESS 149,200 PTS. + $83.70
NO STATUS CC (TDVI) ECONOMY 87,700 PTS. + $83.70 BUSINESS 132,500 PTS. + $83.70[/QUOTE

Are you quoting one-way rates, or round trip rates? if one way, a major increase in the number of points from pre-Nov 9 classic fares.
If return fares, somewhat better than classic fares pre-Nov 8 (I think, but people can correct me if I am wrong - for J class it would have been 150,000 Aeroplan miles for return J class classic Aeroplan mile redemptions)

[QUOTE=FlyerGoldII;32821115]These are Round Trip Fares, the Departure and Return dates are mentioned on top of the post.
The Pre Nov. 8 fares were 100,000 pts. in economy and 150,000 pts. in Business.

MIA-YVR (one-way)
03 November 2021
Business Class
117,000 miles for the one-stop via YYZ

Blog post
 

Just read Cow's first post on Jeff's blog:

https://canadiankilometers.boardinga...ishing-a-chart

Interesting data point for domestic flights. For International flight it is the opposite. I was able to book a flight from YYZ-YVR-HKG for 70.3k + 56$ AC J at lowest level in early Jan 2021. Price jumped to 200k after I booked it.

In your case, I'd bet there was I space for you to book, which then disappeared.

But that just suggests that if there's no I space, it's not going to be within the range.

YYZ-AMS n/a one way. April 2021. In J

TD Infinite

43,900 + $54.15

Thanks!

YVR-TAS as a o/w 81,600.
TAS-YVR as a o/w 82,700
Both directions three stops all in J.

YVR-TAS-YVR as a roundtrip, same dates,
Just shy of 200,000 points. Two stops each direction.
Eastbound 40% in J, return all in J.

Do we know if the no fee CIBC AP card gets the same discount as the Infinite?
I have no intention to spend much on the AP card. Amex Plat will still be my primary.
If the no fee AP card gives the same discount, I may as well get CIBC VI instead of TD VI for the first year and then product switch to no fee AP.

When the ramp up preferred pricing to their goal, no, it will not.

Right not, maybe.

Well, this is a step in the right direction at least, looking ahead they do appear to have addressed the "600,000 points one-way to Australia" problem, and 85K on partner metal isn't awful.

...though, YOW-YVR-SYD is still cheaper than YVR-SYD on the exact same flight, so they have some hidden-city incentives left to chase down.



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