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Old May 2, 2008 | 6:53 am
  #71  
pbarnette
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: SEA
Programs: UA Silver, BA Gold, DL Gold
Posts: 9,779
Originally Posted by humanoid94
I would appreciate it if you would tell us definitively what inaccuracies we are reporting...

1. Delta is in the midst of a great devaluation.

Evidence: Delta is implementing a three tier system for award tickets. They have begun to charge fuel surcharges on award tickets originating outside of the United States. Some people have been told that these fuel surcharges will soon come to the United States as well. This is not yet confirmed, but seems likely. They have posted a new reward chart in which 120K miles is required for a business award to Europe.
The bolded section is one such inaccuracy. The reward chart has been updated and it looks like the 120k was a typo in the new chart. DL still seems to charge 90k for a J award to Europe - which is 10k miles less than NW, by the way, a fact oddly never mentioned by the NW posters decrying the DL fees.

Indeed, I have some issues with the whole fuel surcharge debate, at least vis-a-vis NW.
- The charges are restricted to ex-EU flights at this time. As such, I would suspect that the majority of the redemptions would be from EU-based members. Since NW does not allow EU-based folks to even join WP (instead forcing them to FB, which has equally high fees), I think it unfair to claim that NW is superior in a market that they really don't serve.
- For ex-EU itineraries, the DL mileage rates are lower than NW for almost every single J award. Take the US-EU J award, which is a 10k mile savings. Given that a J award is worth around 3c per mile, I think the value proposition is a wash. Other awards, like the EU-Middle East award are much, much lower than with WP.
- Such charges are common to all of the major EU FF programs, so a charge that matches the competition that DL is facing (and NW largely does not) is not out of line.
- There has never been any statement or guarantee from any other airline that they will not impose such fees. If one is so ready to assume that DL will choose this strategy, then why should we assume that other airlines won't do so as well? As I have previously stated, NW has shown you how much they care about WP and their elites by agreeing to this merger and the absorption of WP into SM.
- Increasing ticket prices have raised the value of the FF tickets. It is not unreasonable to expect inflation to rear its ugly head.

Other incorrect or unsubstantiated assertions from this thread:

- The same-day standby thing
- No 150% EQM for full-Y fares
- Lack of US-based call centers
- That, despite DL announcing plans to ground CRJs this year and shift away from them, they will become the standard
- That the A330s are going anywhere.
- That DL elite upgrades are rare. It isn't even clear that they are less frequent than on NW.

I am not guaranteeing that all of the worst fears won't come to pass. But I think that if they do, it will be because of industry-wide pressures that will cause every other airline to adjust their programs, as well. AA has changed their hold times. CO increased several award rates. Partial credit fares are everywhere in *A.

NW does not get a free pass because they have chosen to completely abandon WP. Sure, they haven't made any changes, but why bother if the program is disappearing? Indifference toward a lame-duck FF program should not be taken as some sort of confirmation that they wouldn't make similar changes were it a going-concern.

Last edited by pbarnette; May 2, 2008 at 7:46 am
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