Originally Posted by
seawolf
You do realize just because public transport being more efficiently doesn't mean the "savings" is being passed back to the passenger?
Then why are the prices lower?
You should do the math before claiming that car rental can't be cheaper than the train. It's a matter of fixed vs. variable costs. At some point, the car hire will be cheaper than train transport.
I've done the math. The problem with your statements is that, while you seem to be well familiar with autos, you don't seem to be at all familiar with trains and how they work (at least in Europe) and that is why you keep assuming that filling a car with people will always be lower cost than a train ticket. Well, I'm sorry to say it like that, but you are wrong.
The cost of car hire plus fuel is fixed up to the vehicle's passenger capacity whereas cost of the train is variable (by passenger).
No, the cost of a train is either fixed or variable depending on what type of ticket you buy.
And you are changing the subject by stating public transport (as opposed to train) since public transport can contain other forms of transportation such as bus and aircraft. If trains are as cheap as you claim it to be, why are tour groups throwing money away by using buses instead of the train?
Tour buses, especially long-distance ones in Europe, are almost always run by private companies. I assume, since they are run by profit-making companies, they just pass the cost of the transport on to the customer. Secondly, these tours (from what I have seen, I have never been on one) use a group control system to keep the tourists and the guides together. Easier on a private bus than a train.
And it can be cheaper under certain scenarios. One can easily determine the actual cost just by going to the car rental site and pricing the cost of car hire and comparing it to bahn.com.
All the discounts you provided are not valid on ICE. If you exclude ICE, then you shouldn't be bashing about traffic associated with driving. DUS to FRA is 2.25 hours by car on a good day/time. Regional trains will take you at least 3 hours between the two cities and that's excluding the time to get to/from the Hbf.
As indicated earlier, first hand experience is that diesel from DUS to FRA is about $35USD and I was driving a 5-series doing 200km/h about a quarter of the way. I paid 130EUR for a 1-day rental. Total with petro is about 170EUR. The 5 series could have carried maximum of 5 passengers. Train is about 45 EUR (restrictive discount) to 80 EUR per person. Five passenger fare is about 225EUR (restrictive) to 400EUR.
Here is where your lack of knowledge about the German train system (plus your pro-auto bias) leads you to the wrong conclusion.
First, you say that driving between the two cities ("on a good day/time") is 2.25 hours. Does that include the time to go to the auto rental location? Does it include the time to drive from the rental location to the high-speed motorway? Does it include the time at the other end to get to the auto drop-off point? Does it include the time to get from there to your hotel?
Yes, you need to get from your hotel to the train station (and vice versa at the other end), however, if you do a bit of planning, the chances are excellent you can find a good hotel within walking distance of the train station. Such as the Nikko Hotel in Duesseldorf.
Secondly, there are no "on a good day/time" on trains. Trains run quite often and tickets are always available.
OK, now let's look at costs: your auto cost was €170. (Did you also need to take transport to or from the auto locations?) Either way, let's use your point that five people could share the cost of the auto. That comes out to €34 per person.
I see you're from New York. Assuming you want to fly to Duesseldorf on 11 July, do you go to the airport on 11 July, walk up to an airline counter and say "I'd like one ticket to Duesseldorf for today, please"?
It works pretty much the same with trains: show up at the station and ask for a ticket for today and, yes, you'll pay the highest cost.
But, if you knew that, you'd book your ticket well ahead of your travel date. In fact, using the homeprint option or the post option, you could even get your ticket at home before leaving for Germany. Did you know that?
IAC, looking at the schedule, I see an ICE train running direct from Duesseldorf to Frankfurt (leaving at 09:33) that takes 1:19 (about an hour faster than your car excluding the pick-up and drop-off) and costs €29 (Sparpreis). No coupons or loyalty cards needed.
How much is that for five people? €29 times 5 equals €145, so, in fact,
cheaper than your auto. However, since you apparently drove by yourself in your example, that would be
€29 vs. €170. As I had said, a fraction of the cost.
Secondly, I would imagine that for the three people in the back seat of the auto, it would not be very comfortable. On the train, each would have a full-size seat with plenty of leg-room.
And finally, wouldn't an auto with five people use more fuel than an auto with one?
If OP wanted to get on a train to FRA right after landing at DUS, discount tickets could be a problem if an unexpected issue occurs (flight delay/lost bag etc) since you lose the value of the ticket if it is not used on the reserved train. This leaves OP with two options. Buy a walk up fare which makes car rental financially attractive than the train OR buy a discount fare (in advance) and leave a enough gap between flight arrival and train departure. Depending on how much OP values his time, this also makes car rental financially attractive.
You seem to be very happy to mention problems with flights, but not so often with autos. So, let me help with that: the German road system, while well-designed for travel, is frequently filled to overflowing with autos - and I say that from personal experience. Secondly, roadworks (maintenance) is most often done in the summer when traffic is also heaviest. Then there are road accidents (not at all uncommon on roads with little to no speed controls), there are also unfavourable weather conditions and then, on some secondary roads in Germany, the military convoys (have you never sat behind one of those? I have.)
In two weeks time, I'm off to Bavaria for two weeks of travel, beer and food. The entire trip (except the flights from Amsterdam to Munich and back) will be done by public transport (train and bus). I'm travelling with a friend and staying within Bavaria so we're using Bavarian Land tickets that cost each of us €13 for unlimited travel (not on ICE) per day. These tickets are also valid on most buses and S-bahn.
I have nothing against trains. I much prefer ICE trains in Germany due to their punctuality and speed. However, between DUS and FRA, I don't find their non-restrictive pricing attractive at all especially if you need to get on a train right after flight arrival which is what OP is suggesting (ICE 80EUR vs Hyundai i10 102EUR with fuel). Now if OP indicated he will spend some time in DUS before travelling to FRA, then buying a discounted ticket for one passenger then it would be as fractional of a cost than car rental as you had indicated.
"non-retrictive pricing" What does that mean? Secondly, what does the OP "spending some time" in Duesseldorf have to do with buying a discount train ticket?
It takes planning and probably not much more effort than booking an auto rental. Simply give yourself a hour or two
extra after your transcontinental flight to get from the airport to the train. If you end up with an hour extra, go shopping, have breakfast or lunch, take a walk, stop at the tourist office or just find a nice sidewalk cafe and relax, knowing that you won't have to worry about driving while jet-lagged. Or buy travel insurance.