JetFuelBlood

https://www.westjet.com/en-ca/news/2...ent-ratified--

They buried the most important part, really:

What's kinda bad is that this announcement hasn't been coordinated at all. There's nothing on Swoop or WestJet's websites or social media channels. And this news article notes that WestJet did not immediately respond to Global News� comment request. If you're about to announce something like the closure of the airline (even if it's a sub-brand), then you need to be ready for this. So odd.

tracon

Swoop website no longer selling seats after Oct. 28.
I checked YEG-YXX. No n/s seats for sale on the WS site. Yet?
How long until the paint scheme disappears?
Some of the fleet has been painted relatively recently.

Got to love the spin:

"This integration will enhance our ability to serve a broader spectrum of guests. ..., each aircraft, ... will offer ultra-affordable travel options through to a premium inflight experience.”

If integrating Swoop into mainline is an enhancement, why was Swoop created in the first place?

JetFuelBlood

I can only presume they'll re-configure the cabins to standard WS pitch?

But will they have enough premium seats to install those? Or perhaps leave them as all economy to run on routes that don't have much premium traffic (if so, that would likely look similar to the current swoop route map).

And my final question for now, will we see the increased WS capacity loaded into the system for the fall right away, or will they wait until August-ish when they ordinarily release their winter schedule.

FlyerJ

According to the press release:

Granted, the current version of their �premium inflight experience� is less �premium� than it used to be in terms of the product offering � but the release seems to indicate that the Swoop fleet will be changed to match the WS mainline configuration, including 2x2 at the front, and presumably better legroom in the first few rows of Y.

diburning

This change probably had something to do with the recent negotiations due to the pilot strike. Might have something to do with contract terms that makes Swoop unprofitable to operate.

tcook052

No 'probably' about it as the linked press release in first post says "As negotiated in the collective agreement".

Jebby_ca

I assume the Swoop flight attendants have a different pay scale compared to Westjet FAs... does this integration mean Swoop FAs are going to be migrated to the Westjet pay scale and work rules?

What about seniority?

robsaw

From what I've read elsewhere (with no specific pointer to a fully verifiable source):
- all Swoop employees will be migrated to Westjet where they weren't already part of a Westjet workgroup (i.e FAs),
- Westjet mainline and Swoop FA have separate contracts and Westjet FAs are "protected" from Swoop/Encore transfers (i.e Swoop FAs will therefore go to the bottom of the FA seniority list).

Antonio8069

I (for one FT) was not surprised by the demise of Swoop.
tcook052 is technically correct i.e. its demise is being blamed on the recent CALPA agreement.
But was it ever really viable? And why did they hire Bob Cummings at its President last year? To close it?
IMO, Swoop's fate was sealed when Lynx and Flair gained a foothold in the CA market. This made Swoop irrelevant?

tracon

WO was designed to compete with/slow the expansion of RV, Y9 & F8.
WS would have been happy to make most of it's fleet pink if wages could have been kept low enough.

Most airlines within an airline don't last very long. RV being an exception.

Lots of posts around by Aerobod explaining the cost/revenue advantages of various seat configurations.

FlyerJ

Totally agreed.

Except on RV ... it's turned into a weird outlier in the aviation world. AC started it as an 'airline within an airline' - separate business entity, separate identity, separate marketing, its short-lived attempt to offer unique service with their Disney service training, flippant on-board announcements, jaunty hats. Now, they're really nothing more than an aircraft type that's assigned to specific routes with the AC network, all flying under "AC" flight numbers, all sold as AC flights. Mainline A320s and Rouge A320s really just function as different aircraft types now, not different airlines ... aimed at routes where customers either won't notice or won't care that it's a diminished experience. For passengers, the visible difference is that they'll see the word "Rouge" painted underneath "Air Canada" on the outside and they'll experience horrendous seat pitch (and virtually zero 'Preferred' seats with better legroom available) on the inside. For Air Canada they'll enjoy lower labour costs and more seats on those routes. One airline, but with two seating configurations on the same aircraft type.

That's all pretty different than Swoop that really did function as a totally separate, distinct airline in every way. It just happened to be owned by WestJet.

I agree that WS would have preferred to keep Swoop in order to keep the ULCCs in check. This line from their Swoop press release:

... indicates that they're now going to try to combat the ULCCs with mainline WestJet. Which seems reminiscent of when Air Canada turned Tango from a separate airline to a fare class on mainline AC.

My hunch: Basic fares on mainline WS will become the new ULCC weapon, at least on routes where WS and a ULCC compete. That may mean Basic fares go lower ... which would probably also mean that the features (and restrictions) of Basic undergo a corresponding shift.

FlyerJ

AVH in an video interview with Bloomberg on Friday 6/09:

Here's the video:

https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/video/we...-brand~2705330

The quote from AVH, at about the 1:40 mark of the video:

aerobod

I�m pretty sure in the next 2 years or so that WG (Sunwing) will become the main substitution on what would have been WO routes, discount fares in the short term on WS are a market share defensive move, I think. Typical WS 80% load factors with 174 seats will not be sustainable to compete against ULCCs with 90% load factor and 189 seats in the same aircraft, due to the 22% cost disadvantage, all other factors being equal. Once WG flight crews are all on the same contracts as WS, there will be more flexibility for a coordinated ULCC defence.

tracon

That link was from a week ago.

Didn't WS already match the fares of ULCC?
ULCC fare + the ULCC charge for carryon = the lowest fares that AC & WS offered.

Now the WS product is going to get more complicated with fares that don't include carryon?

FlyerJ

Corrected my earlier post.