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WestJet to launch ultra-low-cost carrier 'Swoop’

WestJet to launch ultra-low-cost carrier 'Swoop’

Old Sep 19, 18, 9:00 pm
  #316  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 125
Originally Posted by james dean View Post
President Steven Greenway is adamant that his team be a diverse group, mostly with backgrounds outside commercial aviation, “We don’t want airline people. We have gone out of our way to make sure that our staff is from digital, retailing, oil & gas.” It is a drastically different take on what an airline can be.

For me I kinda like my guys/gals at the pointy end to have some airline background, preferably flying airplanes....
Planes fly themselves. If we can drill 4km lateral wells blind within a 5m reservoir surely we can push a few buttons and make a plane fly.
calgaryhhr is offline  
Old Sep 20, 18, 8:57 am
  #317  
 
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Originally Posted by calgaryhhr View Post
Planes fly themselves. If we can drill 4km lateral wells blind within a 5m reservoir surely we can push a few buttons and make a plane fly.
I'm sure all your Swoop & WS pilots would love to hear that, but on second thought they might just say that it's a typical HR dumb dumb comment from HQ
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Old Sep 21, 18, 12:09 pm
  #318  
 
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Passenger rights advocate launches complaint against new low-cost airline


https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/pass...line-1.4103574

"There is no law that says you have to always offer baggage with every fare but rather you have to have one fare which is unrestricted and includes transportation for an adult with reasonable baggage."

Ron.
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Old Sep 21, 18, 12:16 pm
  #319  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 222
A personal item is perfectly reasonable baggage for an adult.

I've done trips of 48 hours flying only with a personal item.
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Old Sep 23, 18, 5:37 am
  #320  
 
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WS under scrutiny

Originally Posted by newfbc View Post

Passenger rights advocate launches complaint against new low-cost airline


https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/pass...line-1.4103574

"There is no law that says you have to always offer baggage with every fare but rather you have to have one fare which is unrestricted and includes transportation for an adult with reasonable baggage."

Ron.
I (for one) am elated that Gabor Lukacs is scrutinizing Swoop. IMO, WS has received a complete free ride (no pun intended!) when it comes to air transport regulation.
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Old Sep 23, 18, 10:14 am
  #321  
 
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Originally Posted by Antonio8069 View Post
I (for one) am elated that Gabor Lukacs is scrutinizing Swoop. IMO, WS has received a complete free ride (no pun intended!) when it comes to air transport regulation.
All Canadian airlines are subject to the same set of air transport regulations, so I'm not sure what you mean by a "free ride". If you mean the regulations have been applied differently for Swoop and/or WestJet compared with other airlines (Air Canada, Porter, Air Transat, Sunwing, etc), please provide examples.
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Old Sep 23, 18, 10:43 am
  #322  
 
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Originally Posted by newfbc View Post
Passenger rights advocate launches complaint against new low-cost airline


https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/pass...line-1.4103574

"There is no law that says you have to always offer baggage with every fare but rather you have to have one fare which is unrestricted and includes transportation for an adult with reasonable baggage."

Ron.
This is going to be an interesting case, as there are a number of relevant sections of the regulation, but inconsistent information.

The "basic fare" is defined in Section 55 (http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/a...-20030101.html):
_____________________________
"basic fare means
  • (a) the fare in the tariff of the holder of a domestic licence that has no restrictions and represents the lowest amount to be paid for one-way air transportation of an adult with reasonable baggage between two points in Canada, or
  • (b) where the licensee has more than one such fare between two points in Canada and the amount of any of those fares is dependent on the time of day or day of the week of travel, or both, the highest of those fares; (prix de base)"
_____________________________

Then what needs to be displayed is described in Section 67 (http://www.lois-laws.justice.gc.ca/e...0.html#docCont):
_____________________________
"Tariffs to be made public
67(1) The holder of a domestic licence shall
  • (a) display in a prominent place at the business offices of the licensee a sign indicating that the tariffs for the domestic service offered by the licensee, including the terms and conditions of carriage, are available for public inspection at the business offices of the licensee, and allow the public to make such inspections;
  • (a.1) publish the terms and conditions of carriage on any Internet site used by the licensee for selling the domestic service offered by the licensee;
  • (b) in its tariffs, specifically identify the basic fare between all points for which a domestic service is offered by the licensee; and
  • (c) retain a record of its tariffs for a period of not less than three years after the tariffs have ceased to have effect."
_____________________________

How this is displayed is elaborated on in the Air Transportation Regulations Price Advertising Interpretation (https://www.otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/public...pretation-note), in Appendix III it defines checked and unchecked baggage as optional services that don't need to be included in the advertised price:
_____________________________
Appendix III: Examples of Optional Incidental Services

Optional air services are those services that do not form part of the total advertised price.As optional services constitute a business practice and can vary by service provider/carrier, it is the advertiser who determines the type of optional services to be offered. The consumer is not obligated to purchase the optional service to obtain and complete the advertised air travel.

Examples of services that might be optional services include:
  • checked baggage;
  • unchecked baggage;
  • in-flight entertainment;
  • meals and beverages;
  • access to a lounge;
  • pre-reserved seat assignment;
  • priority boarding; and
  • trip insurance provided by the advertiser.
Optional incidental services do not include services that are free and that are not incidental to the air service (e.g. additional miles for frequent flyer program or onboard duty free purchases)
_____________________________


Some of the issues that need to be resolved:
- The quantification of "reasonable baggage",
- When the "basic fare" has to be displayed in a booking flow - is it adequate that when you have picked what you think is reasonable baggage, the fare is then displayed?
- Does the advertising interpretation document define what has to be displayed, or the tariff document and how do they work together?

Lots of interesting things to be resolved, which may have implications to all airlines operating in Canada.

Last edited by aerobod; Sep 23, 18 at 10:53 am
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Old Sep 23, 18, 3:57 pm
  #323  
 
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Originally Posted by aerobod View Post
All Canadian airlines are subject to the same set of air transport regulations, so I'm not sure what you mean by a "free ride". If you mean the regulations have been applied differently for Swoop and/or WestJet compared with other airlines (Air Canada, Porter, Air Transat, Sunwing, etc), please provide examples.
I think the poster might be alluding to the media responses to AC & WS. For AC it's all hate, for WS it's a free ride. Now in all fairness that has been changing in the last while to a more balanced (did I say that) reporting...haha. Swoop and WS are under media scrutiny it seems as much as AC
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Old Oct 4, 18, 1:12 pm
  #324  
 
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Swoop adds $149 flights to Mexico out of Hamilton and $159 flights from B.C.


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamil...ghts-1.4850054

Ron.
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Old Oct 9, 18, 6:56 pm
  #325  
 
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Originally Posted by calgaryhhr View Post
Planes fly themselves. If we can drill 4km lateral wells blind within a 5m reservoir surely we can push a few buttons and make a plane fly.
Thankfully, they don't use Airbus aircraft.
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Old Oct 11, 18, 12:11 am
  #326  
 
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Originally Posted by newfbc View Post

Swoop adds $149 flights to Mexico out of Hamilton and $159 flights from B.C.


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamil...ghts-1.4850054

Ron.
I was flying on SWOOP 2 weeks ago and the FA mentioned that 'something exciting is going to be announced soon' - so obviously she was in the know. She also said that unfortunately when they fly south they are down and up on the same plane
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Old Oct 11, 18, 12:13 am
  #327  
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
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So I flew SWOOP for the first time.

To be honest - apart from not grabbing a free coffee on the plane you could have told me it was a regular Westjet flight.

One nice thing I noticed is how empty the overhead bins are. The entire boarding process was so much more pleasant without people worried about getting on to get their bags up top.
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Old Oct 11, 18, 6:28 am
  #328  
 
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Originally Posted by stevescott1983 View Post
One nice thing I noticed is how empty the overhead bins are. The entire boarding process was so much more pleasant without people worried about getting on to get their bags up top.
I guess that is what happens when carry-on is more expensive than checked baggage. Was boarding any faster than a regular Westjet flight?

My in-laws will probably be flying Swoop in early December. I'll advise them to share one checked bag between them.
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Old Oct 11, 18, 8:47 am
  #329  
 
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Originally Posted by smallmj View Post
I guess that is what happens when carry-on is more expensive than checked baggage. Was boarding any faster than a regular Westjet flight?
.
It absolutely would be with fewer carry on. Carry on is what slows the boarding process the most.
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Old Oct 12, 18, 8:21 pm
  #330  
 
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I have extremely limited experience with Swoop but from what I've seen, boarding is not noticeably faster than a regular WS flight in spite of the reduced volume of carry-on bags.
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