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[Park partly closed due to floods] "Visiting/traveling to Yellowstone Park" thread

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[Park partly closed due to floods] "Visiting/traveling to Yellowstone Park" thread

Old Apr 16, 2013, 8:44 pm
  #151  
 
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Thank you so much for all of your priceless tips and information!

Do you live nearby the parks, or are you have you just visited many times?

I'm so excited for this trip; I've been dreaming about this for so many years and am thrilled that I'm finally making it happen! My wife is busy planning a trip (our honeymoon!) to Japan, which is very exciting, but between you and me -- I'm looking forward to this much more!!

I've been fascinated with America's Nat'l Parks since I was a child; growing up with Disneyland's True Life Adventures series and the Ranger Woodlore cartoons! It brings me right back to childhood days of fishing and camping trips with my dad in Eastern/Northern Canada.

I proposed to my wife at the Ahwahnee in Yosemite this past New Year's (we're now married!) and it was absolutely the most special trip of my life. It was my first time visiting the Park and I was wholly captivated by it. What an enchanting place! I have been to numerous continents and have traveled overseas many times, but there's something about America's unspoiled wildernesses that speak to me most. I suppose it's intrinsic. It's now my determined goal to visit every last Nat'l Park in the country over the course of the next few years and I plan on focusing all of our upcoming vacations towards making this happen! I just recently watched the Ken Burns documentary series on the Nat'l Parks and have been reading John Muir's writings on his time spent in Yellowstone and the Tetons, so in my mind - I'm already up in the rugged high country of the great Western Rockies!

Now to plan for Glacier... I'm looking at flying into Seattle for 2-3 days and then taking the Empire Builder through the mountains to spend approx. a week in all sections of the park, including the Canadian side. Planning all of this out is half the fun!

Thank you so much djp98374 for everything!
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Old Apr 16, 2013, 9:17 pm
  #152  
 
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I have just a few more questions concerning our time in Teton...

How much time should be devoted to the Lupine Meadows and is that a full day in itself? Would we have time to experience it on our trip or does this require a multi-day hike? We're only planning day hikes or shorter excursions for this trip, so I'd just like to get a better idea of what to expect.

If we do Schwebacher Landing at sunrise one morning, followed by a dip in the Snake River and then an afternoon hiking through Cascade Canyon, Hidden Falls and Inspiration Point, would that be managable for a single day?

What about portions of the Teton Crest Trail - what is the best way to do that and from which vantage point should we set off and until where?

I would definitely like to spend one afternoon at Jackson Lake, swimming, picnicing and hiking around the trailheads. And several hours set aside one morning for kayaking on Jenny Lake.

I would also like to spend an early morning along the Gros Ventre Range and also around Oxbow Bend and Signal Mountain. And I've heard that Antelope Flats is best done around sunset; is this true?

Lastly, what about Death Canyon Trailhead? How essential is this hike and how much time would we need to invest?

With only 3 night in Jenny Lake, I imagine we'll have to plan our itinerary out very efficiently as there's so much that I would like to see and do!
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Old Apr 16, 2013, 9:25 pm
  #153  
 
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I guess the Jenny Lake Loop Trail, Cascade Canyon, Hidden Falls and Inspiration Point could all be done in one day, with the morning spent out on Jenny Lake (kayaking/canoeing). Would that be one full day? Perhaps a drive along Antelope Flats just before sunset?

Another day at Schwebacher Landing, Snake River, and then either Oxbow and Signal Mountain or Teton Crest Trail and/or Jackson Lake ?

When would be the best time of day for the Gros Ventre Range?

Sorry for all of the extra questions, I really appreciate all of your advice!
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Old Apr 16, 2013, 11:58 pm
  #154  
 
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Okay, I did a bit more research online to plan for our Teton itinerary... I'm not sure how familiar you are with the trailheads and access routes, but I figure we have at least 3 full days in this part of the park and I find the planning a bit more difficult then Yellowstone since the sites are not as well defined as the obvious highlights in YNP.


Option for Day 1:

• Scenic Drive along Teton Park Road
• Check into JLL, Unpack, Explore, Relax, etc.
• Lunch at Jackson Lake Pioneer Grill
• Late Afternoon Boating on Jackson Lake
• Wildlife Viewing in the Gros Ventre Range

Option for Day #2:

• Canoeing on Jenny Lake at Daybreak - (Jenny Lake Boating Rental)
• Morning Hike along the Jenny Lake Loop Trail to Hidden Falls, Inspiration Point and Cascade Canyon - (Possibility to continue on to Lake Solitude?)
• Picnic Lunch
• Return to JL Lodge
• Relax, Dinner at Jenny Lake, Stargazing, etc.

Option for Day #3:

• Oxbow Bend and Signal Mountain at Dawn
• Early Morning Hike on Teton Crest Trail [OR] Lupine Meadows Trailhead from Moose Pond to Garnet Trail Junction, Surprise and Amphitheater Lakes [AND-OR] Hiking, Swimming, Canoeing, Portaging and Picnicing at String Lake and Leigh Lake via South String Lake and Leigh Lake Trailheads
• Sunset Drive along Antelope Flats
• Dinner at Mural Room, Jackson Lake Lodge

Option for Day #4:

• Daybreak at Schwebacher Landing
• Sunrise Float down the Snake River
• Hike the Death Canyon Trailhead from White Grass Ranger Station past Phelps Lake - (?)


We'll probably not want to leave too late on our final day at Jenny Lake as we'll want to get a head start into Yellowstone. I just wonder if 3 nights is enough in Teton?

I absolutely want to do the day hike from Jenny Lake to Cascade Canyon, and that seems like a full day. I would love to start it off at sunrise by paddling on Jenny Lake.

I definitely want to spend time at String and Leigh lakes too, and possibly do a canoe and short/easy portage along their trailheads.

I'm not sure whether the Teton Crest Trail is possible to do in a few hours, but I would like to explore the Lupine Meadows Trailhead if possible. I'm not sure which of these should be of highest priority for inspiring vistas and panoramas as well as wildlife sightings. The truth is that neither my wife or myself are very serious hikers, however I plan to train for several weeks before our trip and would like to do a few day or half-day hikes according to which are most rewarding and which take you the furthest into the backcountry.

I obviously have to do Schwabacher Landing and Oxbow at sunrise too.

Is this enough time to do all that should be done in Teton?

Also, is bear spray necessary and recommended for these day hikes?

Thanks!!
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Old Apr 17, 2013, 12:39 am
  #155  
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I personally would recommend straddling the season.

Several years ago, I spent about a week at Yellowstone National Park and Grand Teton National Park over Memorial Day weekend. Before that weekend, the parks were not crowded — but then, certain venues were closed. After the weekend, it was noticeably more crowded — but then, everything was open.

If you plan your trip right, you will get to enjoy the best of both season and off-season.
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Old Apr 17, 2013, 11:28 am
  #156  
 
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Originally Posted by OliverB

Option for Day 1:

• Scenic Drive along Teton Park Road
• Check into JLL, Unpack, Explore, Relax, etc.
• Lunch at Jackson Lake Pioneer Grill
• Late Afternoon Boating on Jackson Lake
• Wildlife Viewing in the Gros Ventre Range

Option for Day #2:

• Canoeing on Jenny Lake at Daybreak - (Jenny Lake Boating Rental)
• Morning Hike along the Jenny Lake Loop Trail to Hidden Falls, Inspiration Point and Cascade Canyon - (Possibility to continue on to Lake Solitude?)
• Picnic Lunch
• Return to JL Lodge
• Relax, Dinner at Jenny Lake, Stargazing, etc.

Option for Day #3:

• Oxbow Bend and Signal Mountain at Dawn
• Early Morning Hike on Teton Crest Trail [OR] Lupine Meadows Trailhead from Moose Pond to Garnet Trail Junction, Surprise and Amphitheater Lakes [AND-OR] Hiking, Swimming, Canoeing, Portaging and Picnicing at String Lake and Leigh Lake via South String Lake and Leigh Lake Trailheads
• Sunset Drive along Antelope Flats
• Dinner at Mural Room, Jackson Lake Lodge

Option for Day #4:

• Daybreak at Schwebacher Landing
• Sunrise Float down the Snake River
• Hike the Death Canyon Trailhead from White Grass Ranger Station past Phelps Lake - (?)


We'll probably not want to leave too late on our final day at Jenny Lake as we'll want to get a head start into Yellowstone. I just wonder if 3 nights is enough in Teton?

I absolutely want to do the day hike from Jenny Lake to Cascade Canyon, and that seems like a full day. I would love to start it off at sunrise by paddling on Jenny Lake.

I definitely want to spend time at String and Leigh lakes too, and possibly do a canoe and short/easy portage along their trailheads.

I'm not sure whether the Teton Crest Trail is possible to do in a few hours, but I would like to explore the Lupine Meadows Trailhead if possible. I'm not sure which of these should be of highest priority for inspiring vistas and panoramas as well as wildlife sightings. The truth is that neither my wife or myself are very serious hikers, however I plan to train for several weeks before our trip and would like to do a few day or half-day hikes according to which are most rewarding and which take you the furthest into the backcountry.

I obviously have to do Schwabacher Landing and Oxbow at sunrise too.

Is this enough time to do all that should be done in Teton?

Also, is bear spray necessary and recommended for these day hikes?

Thanks!!
Bear spray is an abslute necessity if you do any of the longer hikes. You never know where a bear may pop up.

Im not sure on some of the up to date permit requirements for some of the trails. some of the trails you mentioned i backcountry permit required for day or overnight hikes.

I dont have a tail guide in front of me. i dont know enough about your hiking skills. What is easy or hard for you?

You need to flexible with plans. alot depends on the weather conditions. On a day with a high thunderstorm threat dont do Cascade Canyon or the teton trail hike. If you have a very cloudy morning pass on doing ox bow that AM.

In an AM you can go to OXbow for first sunlight (need to be there about 45 min before sunrise to claim a spot with a tripod for pics. Then stay there for about an hr after sunrise. From there go to Scwebacher for the rest of te AM till around 11:30am then go to lunch.

In the afternoons with the heating of day winds tend to get stronger on Jenny Lake. Away from the lake you arent getting as much wind. Jenny lake at sunrise you may be able to get a reflection in the water for a pic.


If you are planning on staying in Teton Village the first night then do the tram to Teton Crest trail and do that for the AM/early PM. have a late lunch in Teton Village then go to Jenny Lodge

day 2---
I would try to do Ox bow/Schwabacher on that AM after your first night at Jenny Lodge.
PM take the boat across Jenny Lake and do the Cascade crest trail or the other one from Jenny Lake into the Lupine meadows.

Day 3---Do the other trails around Jenny Lake and rent the boat like you mentioned to explore the other trails and nearby lakes including the falls trail. Have dinner around 5pm. Then in the evening go back to OxBow or Schwabacher looking for wildlife.

Day 4--- this day explore some of the other parts of the park with other small lakes. Between Day 3 and 4 in the evening---do one night in Ox Bow and the other in schwabacher....depending on where you hear where the wildlife is out.

Alternate option---flip day 1 and day 4. get acclimated first. Teton Crest trail has alot of ups and downs.

Day 5---Do Ox bow again in AM (not first light--9am), check out then have lunch someplace in Teton before going up to Yellowstone.

On all the nights--look to see if the park service has anything going on with Astonromy stuff/ or park ranger led things. Because of furloughs and budget cuts some of the se programs may be cut back so they are only happening on certain days (weekend peak visitor time of year) instead of every night.

Last edited by djp98374; Apr 17, 2013 at 11:47 am
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Old Apr 17, 2013, 11:43 am
  #157  
 
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Originally Posted by OliverB
I guess the Jenny Lake Loop Trail, Cascade Canyon, Hidden Falls and Inspiration Point could all be done in one day, with the morning spent out on Jenny Lake (kayaking/canoeing). Would that be one full day? Perhaps a drive along Antelope Flats just before sunset?

Another day at Schwebacher Landing, Snake River, and then either Oxbow and Signal Mountain or Teton Crest Trail and/or Jackson Lake ?

When would be the best time of day for the Gros Ventre Range?

Sorry for all of the extra questions, I really appreciate all of your advice!
With Gros Ventre....you could opt to do this on of of the days instead of doing some of the other lakes. This is a wilderness area so its something you hike into. This is something you could do on day 1 instead of d0oing the tram/crest trail (save that for day 4). Its located roughly SE of Jackson.

There is alot of other things you could explore here and if you go about an hr south in the wind river range area in terms of hiking and boating options.
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Old Apr 17, 2013, 11:56 am
  #158  
 
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Originally Posted by OliverB
I have just a few more questions concerning our time in Teton...

How much time should be devoted to the Lupine Meadows and is that a full day in itself? Would we have time to experience it on our trip or does this require a multi-day hike? We're only planning day hikes or shorter excursions for this trip, so I'd just like to get a better idea of what to expect.

If we do Schwebacher Landing at sunrise one morning, followed by a dip in the Snake River and then an afternoon hiking through Cascade Canyon, Hidden Falls and Inspiration Point, would that be managable for a single day?

What about portions of the Teton Crest Trail - what is the best way to do that and from which vantage point should we set off and until where?

I would definitely like to spend one afternoon at Jackson Lake, swimming, picnicing and hiking around the trailheads. And several hours set aside one morning for kayaking on Jenny Lake.

I would also like to spend an early morning along the Gros Ventre Range and also around Oxbow Bend and Signal Mountain. And I've heard that Antelope Flats is best done around sunset; is this true?

Lastly, what about Death Canyon Trailhead? How essential is this hike and how much time would we need to invest?

With only 3 night in Jenny Lake, I imagine we'll have to plan our itinerary out very efficiently as there's so much that I would like to see and do!


with Lupine meadows I would do two half days. Being there on different days you may see something different. By planning two days you could do the falls on a cloudy thunderstorm threat day, and then do Casacde on a clearer day...or if its going to be cooler on one do the more strenuous hiking of canyon on that day then do the falls on the other day.

I am thinking with Teton Cresct Trail to do it from Teton Village and take the tram up and do the trails from there. How much depends on the day and how you feel.

In August water levels tend to be lower since its snow melt driven. that is the uncertainty. I have been there at different times and water levels fluctuate.
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Old Apr 17, 2013, 12:21 pm
  #159  
 
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Originally Posted by OliverB
Thank you so much for all of your priceless tips and information!

Do you live nearby the parks, or are you have you just visited many times?


Now to plan for Glacier... I'm looking at flying into Seattle for 2-3 days and then taking the Empire Builder through the mountains to spend approx. a week in all sections of the park, including the Canadian side. Planning all of this out is half the fun!

Thank you so much djp98374 for everything!
I live in the shadow of Mt Rainier right now.

I have regularly been a park visitor every year. i regularly get an annual eagle pass.

I have done most of the parks in the continental 48 . I have visited them numerous times.

Because of my ashtma its rare that I ever do those overnight backpacker permit required overnight or multiday hikes.

The only ones I havent done much with has been Some in Alaska, The Black Hills area of South Dakota, Joshua Tree, Great Basin, and Some of the national monuments in southern Arizona.

One trip I would do would be in late March/early April and do Joshua tree and southern arizona.

This summer Im debating about doing SD parks or go to New Mexico and the 4 corners area. Some of those parks I havent been to in over 15 years. either way Id travel out of Denver.

With many of the parks i have done---now its targeting certain seasons to hit the parks.

I have done Yellowstone and Grand Teton in late september a couple of times for fall colors.

I have a particular date in mind that I will go to Grand Teton. I think its Monday August 21, 2017. Total eclipse. hits Grand TetonPEak line crosses just north of Teton Village and the totality band covers just about all of Grand Teton except for the extreme northern part.

http://eclipse.gsfc.nasa.gov/SEgoogl...21Tgoogle.html
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Old Apr 17, 2013, 5:14 pm
  #160  
 
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Thanks again, great info!!

So I'll add an extra night in Jenny Lake then?

The total eclipse over Teton must be magical; perhaps I'll be back for that as well!
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Old May 30, 2013, 6:47 am
  #161  
 
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oliver, i am planning a similar trip for august this year.

i have a few different observations/different goals than you - thought i would share.

we are doing glacier becuase we have family nearby, and have tacked on tetons/yellowstone.

we fly into JAC. 2 nts. there. we want to cross the border into Idaho just to say we did it, see a few things in Jackson, wife so some shopping. Will take a ski lift to the top just for the view; kids may take the summer toboggan down, etc.

we decided to do this relatively late so we are taking lodgings that are available. I'm told the view from the jackson lake lodge is unbeatable and is about half the price of jenny lake lodgings. its also a bit more centrally located.

if you are going to yellowstone, there are accomodations in between tetons and yellowstone on what used to be the rockeffeler property. i forget the name. some of them are rustic/bare minimum, but to me the attraction is that you base yourself a bit further north with each lodging change.

i can't add much more. at the risk of stating the obvious, Old Faithful Inn is the most difficult property to get a reservation for.

we are planning to take the bear tooth highway out of the park which takes you NE and a bit and out of the way from Glacier, but apparrently worth it, and then an all day drive to glacier. the moon guide gives a couple of alternatives. We plan to drive all around Glacier and go to Waterton, so we'll probably take the most direct way to Flathead, with the caveat that we'll drive around the more scenic eastern shore of flathead lake on our way to Glacier. There is a post somewhere on flyertalk with the directions.

we'll probably buy the annual pass for $80 but i have read that a weekly pass is only $25.

One of the things we want to do is whitewater rafting. I get the sense that the rafting is better near glacier than around yellowstone.

i mentioned on the other thread that i like the Moon series of guide books.

we are renting a car in JAC one way and returning at FCA. paying about 300/week for the car this way, but its cheaper than flying between JAC and FCA.

since you seem to have some flexibility, i think the earlier you go in the season, the rivers/waterfalls may have more flow, and the wildflowers may be more abundant, but you may have more concerns about snow and adverse weather. I think this applies more to Glacier than to Yellowstone. If i had more flexibility, i might do the week after labor day just to avoid some of the crowds, although you are bumping into colder weather and more precip.
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Old May 30, 2013, 12:40 pm
  #162  
 
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Originally Posted by LemonThrower
oliver, i am planning a similar trip for august this year.

we are doing glacier becuase we have family nearby, and have tacked on tetons/yellowstone.

we fly into JAC. 2 nts. there. we want to cross the border into Idaho just to say we did it, see a few things in Jackson, wife so some shopping. Will take a ski lift to the top just for the view; kids may take the summer toboggan down, etc.
.
Going into Idaho isnt that big of a deal. An alternate path to Yellowstone from Jackson is to to Idaho Falls then to West Yellowstone. Its an option if you want to get cheaper lodging for one night.

Day 2 all day till sunset in Jackson then drive about 2 hrs to Ifaho Fallas/Rexburg then in the AM drive to yellowstone. Many chain hotels are there so if you have points you could stay for free.


Originally Posted by LemonThrower
we decided to do this relatively late so we are taking lodgings that are available. I'm told the view from the jackson lake lodge is unbeatable and is about half the price of jenny lake lodgings. its also a bit more centrally located.
.
Its central in the sense of being closer to Yellowstone...but Yellowstone will be still a long back and forth drive if you want to explore the northern part

Its also farther from the city of Jackson. You have this lodge and then Coulter area of lodging/camping facilities.

Originally Posted by LemonThrower

if you are going to yellowstone, there are accomodations in between tetons and yellowstone on what used to be the rockeffeler property. i forget the name. some of them are rustic/bare minimum, but to me the attraction is that you base yourself a bit further north with each lodging change.

i can't add much more. at the risk of stating the obvious, Old Faithful Inn is the most difficult property to get a reservation for.
.

Its called Flagg Ranch


Originally Posted by LemonThrower
we are planning to take the bear tooth highway out of the park which takes you NE and a bit and out of the way from Glacier, but apparrently worth it, and then an all day drive to glacier. the moon guide gives a couple of alternatives. We plan to drive all around Glacier and go to Waterton, so we'll probably take the most direct way to Flathead, with the caveat that we'll drive around the more scenic eastern shore of flathead lake on our way to Glacier. There is a post somewhere on flyertalk with the directions.
.
Oliver isnt doing both at the same time. these are two seperate trips done in different summers. Teton/Yellowstone is this year, Glacier is next year.

The beartooth highway is on the top 5 of most scenic in the USA. Going out of the park that way really isnt much of an issue to get to Glacier.

You just go to the east side from there by driving from Billings to Great Falls then up to Glacier.

With Glacier you really need to stay some nights on the east side. Its 2 hrs to get to the other side one way. On the east side you have more hiking and entry point options.



Originally Posted by LemonThrower
we'll probably buy the annual pass for $80 but i have read that a weekly pass is only $25.

One of the things we want to do is whitewater rafting. I get the sense that the rafting is better near glacier than around yellowstone.

i mentioned on the other thread that i like the Moon series of guide books.

we are renting a car in JAC one way and returning at FCA. paying about 300/week for the car this way, but its cheaper than flying between JAC and FCA.
.
The $25 for a week is just for one park. Yellowston, Glacier are about the same. Thats $75. Purchasing the $80 annual pass is good for 13 months. If you buy it in early July 2013 its good to the end of July 2014.

Originally Posted by LemonThrower

since you seem to have some flexibility, i think the earlier you go in the season, the rivers/waterfalls may have more flow, and the wildflowers may be more abundant, but you may have more concerns about snow and adverse weather. I think this applies more to Glacier than to Yellowstone. If i had more flexibility, i might do the week after labor day just to avoid some of the crowds, although you are bumping into colder weather and more precip.
Yellowstone is similar to Glacier in the weather. Yellowstone is one of the coldest spots in the lower 48. Its expected to see freezing temps and snow in June.

The issue with Glacier is more the higher elevation and that years snow pack. Much of the roads go through Valleys except going to the sun road where you go over Logan Pass so its can be snow up there, but fine at the lower elevations. In a heavy snow year you are going to still see snow at Logan Pass covering the trails.


With Yelowstone much of it is relatively flat except for a few exit points. Yellowstone is in a valley surrounded by mountains. The entry points follow mountain passes. or lower elevations near water.

In the mountains you can get thunderstorms on any day. the continental divide gets wins to come up the slopes and create clouds and instability which then generates showers and thunderstorms. there are days where you could be in Kalispell and its nice and sunny but the mountains its socked in with rain. This is true with all dense mountian ranges in the summer.
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Old May 30, 2013, 4:28 pm
  #163  
 
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thanks.

re Idaho, my son is trying to visit all 50 states. lets see, so far hawaii, cal, col, ill, ky, tn, al, ga, fl, sc, nc, va, wv, mass. that's 14, plus 4 foreign countries. on this trip, he'll get wy, id, and mt, as well as canada. he's got more states than he has years, so that is pretty good.

is the snake river valley worth seeing? if not, we'll just stop at the border and take his picture.

re lodgings, we're staying with family near Glacier. we may camp in Glacier or do day excursions. have reservations at a hotel in Waterton so we will do that part of the park. since we have family in the area, we are not trying to do it all at one time.
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Old May 30, 2013, 4:36 pm
  #164  
 
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Originally Posted by djp98374
The $25 for a week is just for one park. Yellowston, Glacier are about the same. Thats $75. Purchasing the $80 annual pass is good for 13 months. If you buy it in early July 2013 its good to the end of July 2014.
Might be missing something here, but the $25 fee for Yellowstone gets you into the Grand Tetons as well (during the same week). So I'm not sure where the $75 figure comes from.
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Old May 30, 2013, 6:43 pm
  #165  
 
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Originally Posted by uncertaintraveler
Might be missing something here, but the $25 fee for Yellowstone gets you into the Grand Tetons as well (during the same week). So I'm not sure where the $75 figure comes from.

3 parks around $25....75...dont know how long the trip is. I understand the $25 covers both for the week, but if the trip is 8 days or you lose the flimsy paper receipt you have to pay again.

the $80 is still worth the value if you plan on visiting any other national park, national monument, national recreation area, national seashores, BLM run land, national forest, and any other national site operated by the interior or forest service.

It's $30 good for the next 12+ months of you plan on visiting anything.

In Montana there is the national bison range just north of Missoula and south of kalispell, and there are other wildlife refuges also covered by this.

It doesn't cover parks operated by stste or tribal organizations.

Last edited by djp98374; May 30, 2013 at 6:49 pm
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