Flyingboogaloo

Hello fellow VA folks hope all are well and managing to stay safe during these times.

I’m interested in hearing real world first hand experiences of those who have traveled during covid with Virgin Atlantic - especially upper class and ideally on the LAX -LHR route.

The reason I’m posting is because I had booked travel for my family - at fantastic expense - specifically as it was looking like the Upper Class cabin was going to be almost empty, so we felt safe to fly. Well, VA has consolidated flights and rebooked us onto another date, and the cabin is significantly fuller. There will be a full upper class I think by the time we fly.

They’ve also changed to a different plane that adds potential 12 PAX to upper class. It’s the A350-1000 with a 1-2-1 arrangement, instead of the 1-1-1 arrangement where we were sitting Row A that would have limited foot traffic to our aisle only - not two rows of people.

Having called Virgin - they’ve confirmed there are no capacity restrictions or blocks on booking in the upper class cabin (such as middle row blocking like in the other cabins). The inference is upper class is not as bad as PAX are more spread out. I don’t necessarily agree that is the case.

We’ve spoken to several VA reps throughout the booking process and afterwards when they cancelled our flight. They have without doubt been the most lovely bunch of people - a real credit to VA organization and wish them all well at these uncertain times. However, they can’t help with real world practices at LAX or mid flight, outside of the website script they have.

So, we’ve committed this far and are unlikely to be able to reuse any credit if we cancel these, and try to rebook before the deadline in the covid cancellation policy. To say I’m frustrated is an understatement. Can we still feel safe when flying?

A significant part of us feeling and being safe is how the boarding, flight, and disembarking are handled by the crew.

1. How is the A350-1000 boarded in LAX? Does everyone file through upper class to get to premium and economy, or is there a separate gangway for each class like some other airlines?

2. how strict are staff with policing PAX lingering around restrooms, or pacing around the cabin, or when there is the evening / morning rush to the toilets? We are sat at the bulkhead currently and can just envisage this being a cluster point that isn’t well managed. Do I have to police my area myself?

3. what is meal service like? I know it’s augmented but is it a huge change to prevent interaction as much as possible? I imagine the food quality has dropped from typical upper class fare. I’m sure it’s a bit dicey as a in order to eat you need to remove your mask. If they dump all the food at once then we could maybe scarf it down and get masks back in lol.

4. is disembarkation at LHR managed by class, and by row, or is it a free for all?

Thanks all for any input.

Greenpen

I cannot help but feel that, if you are as apprehensive as it seems, you are travelling to experience a business cabin at the wrong time. Leave it a few months, well give it 12, and you’ll be able to enjoy it.

I have made various decisions to remove the coronavirus risk from my life but they have been rather basic and routine. Loads of things have been spoilt by this wretched virus. The only bright side is that there will be loads of jobs in biomedical science and their pay will go up!

Flyingboogaloo

I appreciate you taking the time to reply.

I should have said in my post that not traveling is not an option for a bunch of reasons, that I won’t bore anyone with. I took a calculated risk and unfortunately it’s not looking like it’s paying off. Now I’m trying to see if I can somewhat “control” my environment to the extent that I can mitigate the risks that make us apprehensive about travel.

It would be last resort to cancel. Not to mention we would end up with a bunch of money sunk in VAA until we could maybe use the credit - possibly before the credit expires under covid re-booking policy, and for a lower class of cabin (or top up with even more money). I’d prefer to deploy that capital with other airlines or in other ways in the meantime.

Also, I’ve travelled Air New Zealand’s business class numerous times which is directly equivalent to VAAs offering, so I know what to expect (and hence the questions to see how current protocols differ) and am not traveling for the “experience”. Honestly I’d travel economy if I knew there would be no one within 8ft of my family for the duration because proper protocols were in place and being enforced.

sunshinebob

Once seated I feel pretty safe to be honest. The pinch points are not really in the cabin itself, I feel more likley to catch the virus getting on and off where the rush seems to put passengers brains into neutral as well as queuing at security or immigration. The other possible pick up points are toilets, lounges and the boaring gate. Being aware of others, masking up and hand washing on the other hand will massivly swing the odds back in your favour.

Not seated directly next to someone is the only real issue I worry about and you wont have that in Upper.

Flyingboogaloo

that’s good to hear, thank you


So cabin management is lacking at the more critical junctures. We will be masked up, face shield etc but our infant can’t do those things - so other people’s ignorance is perhaps where I speak up and ask that they step away if cabin crew are unwilling or unable to do so.

I had hoped that immigration and customs would have been better regimented at LHR, but if that’s not the case, we might just stand off to the side and wait for the rabble to pass - then cruise up through the least congested lanes.

Yes agreed - and very good points. All precautions will be taken - we aren’t going to use the restrooms in the airport (I think the plane restrooms are actually safer in this regard). We will use the lounge and hope we can have some kind of separation if we set ourselves up away from everyone. I’ve heard that Delta lounge (given virgins is closed) is actually very well managed for covid protocols.

I’m happy to board at the absolute last moment if necessary, rather than rush on like wildebeest- I mean the seat isn’t going anywhere. If upperclass has its own gangway then I wouldn’t be too concerned either about the boarding phase.

konagirl2

I don't have first-hand experience yet, so I hope someone who has flown can give you some more information about how crew are managing passengers, although my impression is the operating procedure is to request passengers stay seated as much as possible. But as I understand it:
1. The A350 boards from the second door (usually), next to the 'lounge', so economy and premium passengers do not pass business class, but you do all board from the same gangway.
3. I believe it's still the same under covid rules, the A350 has an ordering function on your screen. The meals are served on a tray (though no pre-flight alcoholic drink to avoid cabin crew milling in the cabin) with covers on the dishes.

Yes of course you have to remove your mask to eat or drink. Do note that the Virgin amenity kit has 3 surgical masks - so they are good for you not spreading the virus to other people when swapped every ~4 hours as recommended. But they won't protect you. Similarly a face shield does not protect you, it is designed / recommended to protect others from your spit/breath, hence they are used by retail staff or other client facing roles. Perhaps you are planning on wearing a FFP2 or N95 for the whole flight (recommended changing every 4-6 hours). I would urge you to have a really good read about the actual risk of exposure with the extraction and filtration systems that exist on modern commercial aircraft. The club suite seat on the A350 is very private and the air exchange system means you are unlikely to be breathing other people's stale air. Your risk at the airport, lounge, and transport to and from are probably far greater. "Can we still feel safe when flying?" If you must travel, then as said above just do the best you can, keep your hands clean, particularly before eating and drinking and when touching any surface, and keep a distance from other people - face away from them if you think they are going to sneeze or shout over you.

Flyingboogaloo

This is good to know and does help alleviate at least one of the concerning "pinch points" during the journey, and it is only a concern as I have not flown this plane so didn't know what to expect. I don't mind the same gangway, given there is typically staggered boarding by status and cabin class.

Interesting, perhaps we hold out order/service to another time after others have eaten. I guess we will figure that out at the time.

Just to be clear - the shield is only in ADDITION to our face masks (N95), never instead of. I roll my eyes at "those people" who only wear a shield...not to mention avoid them like the plague, pun intended.

You are correct, a Shield is predominantly used in customer-facing roles or those where you expect to be in regular close or proximal contact with others, however, to be clear when worn in conjunction with a mask then it does offer some additional protection to the wearer - CDC recommend wearing a shield - "In the advice..., the CDC recommends eye protection and face masks in locations with “moderate to substantial community transmission” to protect the eyes, nose and mouth .."

Dr Faucci has said "if you have one, you should probably use it"

Of course, the cleaning regimen that should be followed if you do intend to use a mask is important - as droplets and germs can stick to the shield - so that is something to consider. Most people aren't willing to put in the effort to properly use a shield, or are just too complacent, and would compromise themselves more than if they just didn't bother with the shield in the first place.

To reiterate, we will always wear a face mask (ours are N95, and we have replaceable filters for them) I feel that whilst we might feel conspicuous wearing shields, we probably will do so at the airport check in, security, terminal at both ends if those areas are particularly busy. A friend flew just the other day and he was the only person in TSA.....so I wouldn't bother with a shield if that was the case.

I have read every scrap I can find, there aren't many independently verified investigations/ reports on the efficacy - if you notice, most of the published studies have been prepared by, or peer reviewed by those with a vested interest in the airline industry (Chief medical advisors to the airline industry, the companies that make the HVAC systems and filters, the airlines themselves, IATA etc etc). I have a working knowledge of these systems (having dealt with them in a related field), and a lot of the science is indeed correct. However, the reports do not address that the tests are carried out in ideal conditions, in static, controlled environments, which do not resemble the real-world activity on a plane. This is where cabin management plays a key role in allowing the systems to operate as close to the ideal scenario as possible - i,e, everyone where a mask, it in their seat and don't move aorund!.

I have spoken with people who have travelled other airlines andthe cabin management is on the spectrum of "free for all monkey's tea party, no mask discipline, staff too scared to confront anyone" to "militantly strict" - I'm all for the latter.....

I am still keen to hear from anyone who has actually flown VAA in the last month or two and could comment on how passengers were managed- their input would be very interesting.

Britgirlnyc

I flew Upper JFK to LHR in September. Load was under 30 PAX both legs. Heartbreaking. I was totally comfortable, staff were very mindful of maintaining distance, always had masks etc and really made an effort to ensure I was comfortable and catered to, in spite of new protocols.
Boarding was no issue - hardly any pax! Disembarking will always be Upper first. Special Amenity kit had all you could need but I bought extra masks. I have taken to wearing 2 disposable masks for extra protection but I am less concerned inflight as to risk, due to increased air filter protocols. I do understand that LAX to LHR is 10 plus hours so lots to consider. JFK CH so I used Delta sky lounge which was dead. I am flying again soon to LHR and am not concerned but know that the flight will be busy they have only 1 flight a day going out currently. I hope you do travel and wish you and your family safe and healthy travels.

LondonElite

Some airlines will require you to wear a mask over a mask with a filter, or don't permit you to wear one with an exhaust filter at all. I don't know the VS policy on this.

Flyingboogaloo

Correct - I think you’re imagining that we have valved construction type masks where you can change the filter. Our masks are not that type and not valved. Check out Honeywell PPE dual layer face mask if interested. The filter essentially looks like an N95 mask with no loops for your head/ears, it inserts behind the face mask.

The mask is washable, and the filter part is N95 and is the second layer, so you keep the main mask part and change out the filter part.

for anyone interested there is a LONG wait time for these so only buy if you are prepared to wait for them 3 months.

ColOrd

Here is a YouTube review of a recent VS flight on the 350 although on a different route.

As others have stated - the main factors will be around boarding and at the gate, and then immigration at LHR some of these will not be under VS's direct control.

I seem to recall the gate area at LAX can get pretty confused and crowded at the best of times, last time I travelled I had a bad knee and it was all a bit of a mess back then, but this was due to the physical area rather than anything that VS could influence themselves, although I would like to hope that they are working with the airport to ensure that processes are in place.

On board the plane, generally whilst seated, you're in a good place, you will have plenty of distancing in every direction, the seats are pretty private, and even those closer together like the D&G row will mean that you're facing away from where other people would be breathing.

I love both designs of seats on VS, both the older ones on the 787 and the newer on the 350 but I would definitely say with the 350 you have lucked out as no matter how busy the cabin is you'll be able to maintain distance.

The crew are naturally trying to keep their distance and the service is cut down to minimise that. Meal service is all served at once is not currently plated or prepared other than heating. I think given that BA are reintroducing full catering from Jan, that VS might switch back up a little.

There are toilets at the aft and fore of the cabin. 1 at the front, two at the back if memory serves. Compared to other airlines on this route, I would say that AA is comparable in terms of layout of seats, although with slightly less privacy. BA would not be a club suite aircraft, so you would be closer to others and in the Ying-Yang set up, you'd feel closer to them too especially when the crew are serving. The other option (cost might make this a non option) would be to look at AA First or BA First, but there would be a huge cost increase for either, and those key points of boarding and immigration will still exist outside of the cabin and you'd pay more but with no increase in peace of mind.

That being said, lastly, immigration - I have seen some poor pictures of T2 and T5 (You will use T2 at LHR on VS for the moment) with social distancing unable to be maintained, if you're travelling post Brexit I am assuming this will get worse. I think LHR need to get T3 back open as soon as possible!

NOLAnwGOLD

What lounge did they use for LAX for J?

drew.clarke

LAX felt like a ghost town.

Terminal 2 check in at 6pm.


Tom Bradley


Plenty of social distancing at LAX last Friday, all pax boarded via the same door.

Only 10 of us in upper (A350), all well spaced, 60 total on plane plus 12 crew.

Everyone was keeping their distance at the gate unlike the usual scrum.

Crew were fantastic and chipper in tough circumstances.

drew.clarke

Delta lounge, no food, no drink, no point!

Flyingboogaloo

Thank you for your post as a great point of reference. I’ll have a mini report to provide too when I can get a bit of time to put it together.