Virgin America misses payroll (ADP reportedly takes responsibility for it as mistake)
Feb 10, 2013, 11:40 am
#61
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2004
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1) End of third quarter 2012:
Cash: $14,800,000
Short Term Investments: $60,002,000 (same number as end of Q2)
2) Air Traffic Liabilities at end of third quarter 2012: $143,711,000
3) $23,518,000 (end of third quarter 2011 unrest cash/equiv on hand) + $150,000,000 (loan from hedge funds; likely Cyrus Capital and Virgin Group) - $159,815,000 (unrest cash/equiv on hand end of fourth quarter 2011) = $13,703,000 fourth quarter 2011 cash burn.
4) To help complete the math problem, $159,815,000 (unrest cash/equiv on hand end of fourth quarter 2011) - $110,809,000 (unrest cash/equiv on hand end of first quarter 2012) = $49,006,000 first quarter 2012 cash burn
SocalApproach, customers buy airline tickets with the assumption that they will be in business on the day that they fly that airline. When an airline is in shaky financial condition, it is best to take protective steps to make sure you don't get burned. Such as not purchasing tickets more than 90 days prior to departure, and only purchasing tickets via credit card. I am simply cautioning fellow travelers to be careful with future ticket purchases on Virgin America. Until Cyrus Capital/Virgin Group writes another check for $150 million, it is questionable whether the company is a going concern ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Going_concern ). This company has had a net loss of $120,394,000 in the first three quarters of 2012. That's not chump change.
Cash: $14,800,000
Short Term Investments: $60,002,000 (same number as end of Q2)
2) Air Traffic Liabilities at end of third quarter 2012: $143,711,000
3) $23,518,000 (end of third quarter 2011 unrest cash/equiv on hand) + $150,000,000 (loan from hedge funds; likely Cyrus Capital and Virgin Group) - $159,815,000 (unrest cash/equiv on hand end of fourth quarter 2011) = $13,703,000 fourth quarter 2011 cash burn.
4) To help complete the math problem, $159,815,000 (unrest cash/equiv on hand end of fourth quarter 2011) - $110,809,000 (unrest cash/equiv on hand end of first quarter 2012) = $49,006,000 first quarter 2012 cash burn
SocalApproach, customers buy airline tickets with the assumption that they will be in business on the day that they fly that airline. When an airline is in shaky financial condition, it is best to take protective steps to make sure you don't get burned. Such as not purchasing tickets more than 90 days prior to departure, and only purchasing tickets via credit card. I am simply cautioning fellow travelers to be careful with future ticket purchases on Virgin America. Until Cyrus Capital/Virgin Group writes another check for $150 million, it is questionable whether the company is a going concern ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Going_concern ). This company has had a net loss of $120,394,000 in the first three quarters of 2012. That's not chump change.
Feb 10, 2013, 2:13 pm
#62
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 460
It was established, several posts back, that this is a non-issue. Virgin did meet its payroll, and this was an issue with ADP. Why are people still pulling out their "big number ammo and extra-detailed analysis" on this? it's like they're hoping for failure. I know this site is full of wannabe airline executives, but maybe the thread should be closed.
Feb 10, 2013, 2:51 pm
#63
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Maryland, near DC
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Posts: 539
Because they'd rather waste their time on this....
It was established, several posts back, that this is a non-issue. Virgin did meet its payroll, and this was an issue with ADP. Why are people still pulling out their "big number ammo and extra-detailed analysis" on this? it's like they're hoping for failure. I know this site is full of wannabe airline executives, but maybe the thread should be closed.
Feb 10, 2013, 4:30 pm
#64
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 519
It was established, several posts back, that this is a non-issue. Virgin did meet its payroll, and this was an issue with ADP. Why are people still pulling out their "big number ammo and extra-detailed analysis" on this? it's like they're hoping for failure. I know this site is full of wannabe airline executives, but maybe the thread should be closed.
Last edited by HRDiva; Feb 10, 2013 at 6:52 pm
Feb 10, 2013, 5:54 pm
#65
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 460
The employees that I have spoken to were paid the same day.
Feb 10, 2013, 6:50 pm
#66
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 519
What employees? You?
For the last and final time for those that don't read. Direct deposit did not work due to an error (my years of experience say it was a VX error, but one person on the web said it was ADP's fault but won't come back to prove it). People expecting to be paid on 1/31 had to wait for a check in the mail. If they were on a trip, it was a several day wait. Then they had to deposit it and be subject to deposit holds.
Stop arguing about payroll procedures in an attempt to mask the truth. You are arguing with someone who knows how payroll is processed, the law and teaches it.
For the last and final time for those that don't read. Direct deposit did not work due to an error (my years of experience say it was a VX error, but one person on the web said it was ADP's fault but won't come back to prove it). People expecting to be paid on 1/31 had to wait for a check in the mail. If they were on a trip, it was a several day wait. Then they had to deposit it and be subject to deposit holds.
Stop arguing about payroll procedures in an attempt to mask the truth. You are arguing with someone who knows how payroll is processed, the law and teaches it.
Feb 10, 2013, 8:19 pm
#67
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SFO
Posts: 335
What employees? You?
For the last and final time for those that don't read. Direct deposit did not work due to an error (my years of experience say it was a VX error, but one person on the web said it was ADP's fault but won't come back to prove it). People expecting to be paid on 1/31 had to wait for a check in the mail. If they were on a trip, it was a several day wait. Then they had to deposit it and be subject to deposit holds.
Stop arguing about payroll procedures in an attempt to mask the truth. You are arguing with someone who knows how payroll is processed, the law and teaches it.
For the last and final time for those that don't read. Direct deposit did not work due to an error (my years of experience say it was a VX error, but one person on the web said it was ADP's fault but won't come back to prove it). People expecting to be paid on 1/31 had to wait for a check in the mail. If they were on a trip, it was a several day wait. Then they had to deposit it and be subject to deposit holds.
Stop arguing about payroll procedures in an attempt to mask the truth. You are arguing with someone who knows how payroll is processed, the law and teaches it.
This lady is a total whack job! Lol She has some demented agenda against VX. Everyone ignore her. Our company has taken great care of us and the issue has been resolved. We've all moved on. See you in the skies!
Feb 10, 2013, 8:57 pm
#68
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 519
I have reported your post as a personal attack. How dare you.
Feb 10, 2013, 9:13 pm
#69
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Programs: AA Gold,DL Gold
Posts: 858
She says she knows from experience so she was probably party to this before. Hmm I wonder which role she was in, the smaller company making the mistake or ADP the monolith wondering why the little people can't figure out their easy to use system.
Mind you the rest of us grounded in reality know better.
HRDiva are you Chris Dorner??
Please lock, VXCabinCrew is right this thread has gone so far off the rails we are at ludicrous speed.
Feb 10, 2013, 9:27 pm
#70
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 519
HRDiva is absolutely certain that ADP is not at fault after all how can they ever be wrong. I'm sure its possible for Virgin to make a mistake but in her mind there is no possible scenario where ADP can ever mess up.
She says she knows from experience so she was probably party to this before. Hmm I wonder which role she was in, the smaller company making the mistake or ADP the monolith wondering why the little people can't figure out their easy to use system.
Mind you the rest of us grounded in reality know better.
HRDiva are you Chris Dorner??
Please lock, VXCabinCrew is right this thread has gone so far off the rails we are at ludicrous speed.
She says she knows from experience so she was probably party to this before. Hmm I wonder which role she was in, the smaller company making the mistake or ADP the monolith wondering why the little people can't figure out their easy to use system.
Mind you the rest of us grounded in reality know better.
HRDiva are you Chris Dorner??
Please lock, VXCabinCrew is right this thread has gone so far off the rails we are at ludicrous speed.
I think you are all the same person posting and I know who you are. What a joke. And I have reported this post as a personal attack too.
Last edited by HRDiva; Feb 10, 2013 at 9:41 pm
Feb 10, 2013, 10:09 pm
#71
Moderator: American AAdvantage & Marriott Bonvoy
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Posts: 8,116
Good lord -- clean up on aisle 4.
Enough!
-AZ
Moderator
Enough!
-AZ
Moderator