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-   -   US Airways Unveils "Envoy Suite" (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/us-airways-dividend-miles-pre-consolidation-american-airlines/995925-us-airways-unveils-envoy-suite.html)

PHL Sep 19, 09 4:22 pm


Originally Posted by T/BE20/G (Post 12404431)
Here's the planned schedule:

A/C . . . Delivered . . . Suites Installed
279 . . . 7/09 . . . . . . 1/10
280 . . . 7/09 . . . . . . 1/10
281 . . . 9/09 . . . . . . 11/10
282 . . . 11/09*
283 . . . 12/09 . . . . . 11/10
284 . . . 3/10*
285 . . . 3/10*
286 . . . 5/10*
287 . . . 5/10*
288 . . . 8/10*
289 . . . 10/10*
290 . . . 12/10*
291 . . . 3/11*
292 . . . 5/11*
293 . . . 6/11*

*: Airplanes delivered with the Suites

Surely they can come up with a way of shuffling those 2 odd-ball 332's in for reconfig before Summer 2010 rather than waiting an entire year. Hopefully they won't put those 2 odd-man 332's on premium routes that passengers pay top dollar for the suites. PHL-LAX would be nice if the T1 gates at LAX could actually handle the wingspan without displacing WN....

ClueByFour Sep 19, 09 8:11 pm


Originally Posted by PHL (Post 12407036)
Surely they can come up with a way of shuffling those 2 odd-ball 332's in for reconfig before Summer 2010 rather than waiting an entire year. Hopefully they won't put those 2 odd-man 332's on premium routes that passengers pay top dollar for the suites. PHL-LAX would be nice if the T1 gates at LAX could actually handle the wingspan without displacing WN....

Don't they need at least 2 332s to run to TLV? At all times?

There was a time when PIT-LAX and CLT-LAX were run with 767s. I'm too lazy to look up the wingspan differences with a 332, nor do I recall if US has given up gates at LAX since then.

gordo6 Sep 19, 09 11:57 pm


Originally Posted by ClueByFour (Post 12407650)
Don't they need at least 2 332s to run to TLV? At all times?

Yes they do, but they still could equip the other old 2 A332 with the new suites by 2/10 or 4/10 and not by 11/10.

fly747first Sep 20, 09 12:19 am


Originally Posted by DCAorBust (Post 12395470)
The press release says 20 seats on the 332, which is the same as current. That would be five rows of 1-2-1. It's silent on the 333, but AC manages to get 27 beds in front of 2L/2R on its 333, in what I would call a 1-1-1 config, so it doesn't seem too far-fetched. US might also take the opportunity to drop some closet space and reconfig the front galley to gain space in Envoy.

If you look at the US 332, it currently achieves 20 seats with a 4 row, 60" pitch layout. If you can get 5 rows of suites into that space, then I think this suggests that the suites require about 48" of pitch. The 333 has 5 Envoy rows w/ approx 60" pitch, plus one row of sleeper at 96". Back of the envelope math suggests that this would be enough space for 8 rows at 48", which would give you 32 suites (a net gain of 2 seats).

As far as "sit together," US's proposed layout is actually the first herringbone design that enables companions to sit together--and half the cabin is available as such. All other designs are either aisle apart or adjacent in the column, but different rows.

I'm not sure where you are getting your data from, but the numbers are way off. The first row of US Airways' A330-300s, which was the former First Class, has a seat pitch of 94 inches, certainly not 96. More importantly, there are only 4 rows of regular Envoy seats... Row 2 has rather limited space (circa 48-50 inches) while rows 3-5 have a 60-inch seat pitch.

flight62 Sep 20, 09 6:18 am

In my discussion with Hector, I discovered that the seat company has and IS being a pain in the butt, which is contributing to the lengthy time span to install the new seats on the 330-300's.

tahitigirl Sep 20, 09 6:45 am

Does anyone know if they plan on doing something with coach on the older 330? New seats and IFE?

PHL Sep 20, 09 8:40 am


Originally Posted by tahitigirl (Post 12408788)
Does anyone know if they plan on doing something with coach on the older 330? New seats and IFE?

I imagine some serious weight could be saved if they switched to the new Panasonic IFE since the Sony Passport system requires equipment in every row under some seats. From what I understand the Panasonic is a bit more streamlined and far lighter overall.

PHL Sep 20, 09 9:55 am


Originally Posted by ClueByFour (Post 12407650)
Don't they need at least 2 332s to run to TLV? At all times?

There was a time when PIT-LAX and CLT-LAX were run with 767s. I'm too lazy to look up the wingspan differences with a 332, nor do I recall if US has given up gates at LAX since then.

Indeed, PHL-LAX was served with the 767 until around 2004. The wingspan is 156 feet/1 inch. Both the A332 and A333 are 197 feet/10 inches. If I recall, one limitation of the gate area at T1 was that the 767 was as big as they could cram in there. But I also recall reading something here not long ago that even now there isn't room for a 767 without displacing WN for the time it sits there.

fly747first Sep 20, 09 12:52 pm


Originally Posted by PHL (Post 12409305)
Indeed, PHL-LAX was served with the 767 until around 2004. The wingspan is 156 feet/1 inch. Both the A332 and A333 are 197 feet/10 inches. If I recall, one limitation of the gate area at T1 was that the 767 was as big as they could cram in there. But I also recall reading something here not long ago that even now there isn't room for a 767 without displacing WN for the time it sits there.

Don't forget that back then, US Airways also offered a daily CLT - LAX flight operated by a B767-200. Ah, the golden days...

T/BE20/G Sep 20, 09 7:43 pm


Originally Posted by gordo6 (Post 12404827)
Hi, Thanks for that. What is your source?
When you say 11/09 - you mean the end of November 2009 or the beggining of November 2009?
Do you know why aircraft 283 will be delievered without the new envoy?
Is there any chance that US will confirm in advance which A332 routes will be operated by aircrafts with the new envoy, like UA did after they just started refetting their 767 and 747 with their new business and like BA does with their new club world? If they will confirm, is there any chance you know if the TLV route will have the new envoy by May?

THX in advance.

The info is from the company newsletter. It was presented as a graphic, and was only specific as to the month that the suites would be installed in each airplane, not when in the month. Also, the dates seem to be when the installation will begin, since the first aircraft will get them installed in 11/2009, while they won't be in service until 12/2009. As for dedicated routes, I doubt it, but I don't know. If the ship numbers hold as planned, though, you can look at the gate before deciding whether to "GoEnvoy" or not :p

gordo6 Sep 22, 09 11:44 am


Originally Posted by T/BE20/G (Post 12411168)
If the ship numbers hold as planned, though, you can look at the gate before deciding whether to "GoEnvoy" or not :p

I will fly business anyway ;). I just have to choose for my November trip - US, LX or LY and for my May trip - US, LH, AC, BD, LY.

Can you upload here or send me that part of the newsletter? It's not that I believe you, I just want see how that part of the newlatter was designed....

allyc Oct 11, 09 4:00 am

It is definitely interesting to see that the on-line tour emphasizes a few things that have been the "complaints" about the UA new business seats (as this product compares to that vs. the UA first class suites)
1. that all suites face forward - you wouldn't expect this to be even mentioned, but they do plenty of times. Some people are wary of the rear facing seats on UA.
2. that there are several areas for storage of personal items - water bottle holder, on the side of the seat, underneath the footrest. A main complaint of UA's seats is a lack of storage space for personal items in the seats.
3. that all seats have aisle access -imo this is the most valid thing to trumpet, as UA is not the only business class with 2 4 2 configs. Not having to decide between being a stepper or steppee is HUGE!

I wonder what united thinks of this advertising that seems aimed at pointing out their deficiencies, and what US has done to fix them...

kudzu Oct 11, 09 5:48 am


Originally Posted by allyc (Post 12599564)
...I wonder what united thinks of this advertising that seems aimed at pointing out their deficiencies, and what US has done to fix them...

Friendly sibling competition is always good :). UA, as the "big brother" with vastly more international routes and frequencies to choose from, would always have the edge and should find no shortage of C pax. As for US, it's good to see they're responding to customer feedback and trying to improve the Envoy product, slowly but surely.

19103_aa Oct 11, 09 11:15 am

This is a substantial improvement. The US group who put this package together should be very pleased.

It's been 2 years since I set foot on a US plane. I would consider hopping on one of these for a short trip over the Atlantic.

munichmarcus Oct 13, 09 9:54 pm

The new Envoy Suite looks almost like the International First Class Suite of AA! One can just hope the level/quality of Service/Food/Wine will be improved as well and it could be again one of the best C over the Pond!


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