N830MH

Hi All,

I just thought that I would likely to know why US Airways does not have new nonstop from PHX-NAS/FPO/CZM/SJU/SDQ/STI/KIN/MBJ/BZE. There is good enough more limitation range for reachable into Caribbean. US will have to get more potential new first-ever nonstop to Caribbean. A320/A319/757 can have enough range for reaching into Caribbean. This is perfect opportunity to get more expanded new routes out of PHX. It will have enough more O/D dailies passengers whose connection the flight in PHX.

I knows last time JM has been short time for PHX-MBJ before 9/11 but, its has been discontinuation. That's why JM didn't work out very well. I don't really remember which the frequencies where JM flies out of PHX-MBJ is that? I'm sure US need to bring more capacity passengers growth. It's importance for leisure travelers to Caribbean. It will have easier access to get there in Caribbean for next day. So however, it will have more consideration to get more new routes out of PHX. Thanks all.

Regards

gtownguy

Think it's mostly due to demand - or lack thereof. Friend of mine who is a travel agent at a large agency in PHX says she rarely books anyone to Caribbean destinations. Seems consumers out west prefer going to Mexico or Hawaii. Certainly much easier to get to for them.

sbm12

It is partly a demand issue and partly that the flights are rather long, making them expensive to operate. Only two of those flights are under 2000 miles (CZM, BZE) and one is over 3000 miles (SJU). It makes way more sense for US to route the traffic through CLT where they can more efficiently and cost-effectively offer service.

kinglobjaw

I guess they could try PHX-SJU & CZM. Those two would make the most sense. Maybe BZE. Other than that PHX is a good Mexico and Latin America hub, while CLT is better for Caribbean flights.

Sort of off topic, but I've always wondered why US doesn't fly PHL-MEX. If they would time it right, they could steal some traffic from the nonstop European flights (Lufty, BA, Air France).

Schedule could be like this:

Leave PHL around 6:30PM and arrive in MEX that same evening.
Leave MEX 7AM or 8AM and arrive in PHL just in time for the connecting bank of flights to Europe.

-Kinglobjaw

PHL

Don't you mean SJO (San Jose, CR)? SJU is better served from PHL and CLT since, as suggested earlier, the westies don't typically go all the way East for a Caribbean getaway when they have Hawaii and Mexico.


They promoted the CLT-MEX route heavily. Not sure why they didn't offer PHL-MEX, as there aren't many nonstop options from the NE. CLT is better situated to funnel traffic through from anywhere on the East coast from Maine down to FL in order to continue onward to MEX. I doubt there is a strong market for Europe-MEX that would justify adding the route in hopes of gaining some of the connectors. Especially when the Europeans are very comfortable with their flagship carriers (LH, AF, BA, etc.).

kinglobjaw

[QUOTE=PHL;12094285]Don't you mean SJO (San Jose, CR)? SJU is better served from PHL and CLT since, as suggested earlier, the westies don't typically go all the way East for a Caribbean getaway when they have Hawaii and Mexico.[QUOTE]

US already runs a Saturday service to SJO from PHX. It's operated with a West A319.

But, yeah, I know what you are trying to say...

-Kinglobjaw

ClueByFour

PHX-SJU is a shade over 3000 miles, which means that it's probably going to require a 319 to make it (and even if it can, expect fuel stops westbound in the winter) or a 757. They won't blow a 757 on it. If there was money to be made running a 757 out of SJU to anywhere, AA either does it now or already tried it and determined it's no longer working.

The traffic does not exist from the entire west coast to Cozumel to make a flight worth it, much leess O&D out of PHX.

FWAAA

So if US flew from PHL to MEX, it could attract passengers from the nonstop flights to/from Europe and Mexico City? Passengers who today fly nonstop FRA-MEX, LHR-MEX and CDG-MEX would rather fly US and connect at PHL? Uh-huh. Sure they would.

That doesn't make sense on more than one level, not the least of which is the CBP requirement that connecting passengers would have to enter the USA in PHL.

FWAAA

There are no nonstop PHX-Caribbean routes for the same reason that UA doesn't run nonstops from SFO or LAX or DEN to the Caribbean. Same reason that AA doesn't run nonstops from LAX to the Caribbean (except to SJU, an AA hub). Same reason DL doesn't run nonstops from LAX or SLC to the Caribbean.

Lack of demand. The primary markets for Caribbean travel are on the East Coast and the eastern midwest. Not the western deserts.

GaryZ

Not sure what you mean by that since they already run PHX-CAN which is within easy commuting distance of CZM (or was that your point?).

perseus11

"I doubt there is a strong market for Europe-MEX that would justify adding the route in hopes of gaining some of the connectors."
That is exactly the reason US Air originally scoped and flew PHL-MEX.

US Air tried PHL-MEX with 757s for some time in the 90s, but eventually canceled it due supposidly to an inabilty to connect to the PHL European banks, because of late departure time restrictions set by the Mexican government. They then attempted PIT-MEX (primarily with connecting traffic) and that was quickly canceled. Mexicana served PHL-MEX for awhile also, but eventually decided to cancel it due to load inadequacy. From an O&D standpoint, CLT has almost 4x the number of mexican ancestory residents than PHL and the nearest competition is ATL - 250 miles driving distance. A significant population of mexican americans lives in northern NJ, but have better access to the cheap 6 or so daily mexicana/aeromexico/AA/DL services out of JFK (than PHL). Unless the route is positioned to have easy access to Mexican cargo and high yield business travelers (e.g., NYC-MEX), rather than the typical low yield connecting and O&D tourist traffic, I suspect the best Eastern oriented route for US is the shortest - CLT-MEX. Incidentally, Aeromexico has (again), as recently as January/February 2009, requested DOT authority to serve PHL-MEX. Refer to: http://www.airlineinfo.com/ostpdf73/150.pdf).
"By this application, Aeromexico seeks renewal of its exemption to engage in scheduled foreign air transportation of persons, property and mail between Mexico City, Mexico and Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. The authority is scheduled to expire on March 4, 2009. Although Aeromexico is not currently offering nonstop service on the route, hopes to institute nonstop service when warranted by traffic conditions. Consequently, it seeks to renew the authority."

warreng24

PHX-SJO is run daily during Winter and Spring.

Summer and Fall, PHX-SJO is only run once weekly.

A319 equipment.

CMK10

What demand exactly do you see for PHX-NAS?

Cltflyer1

Mexicana has also talked about looking at Charlotte a few years back but i havn't heard anything about it recently

gj83

My PHX-CLT flights are always full. Who do they seem to be full of?
...not West Coast people going to the Caribbean, but rather East Coast people returning from Hawaii.

My west coast clients all talk about Hawaii or Los Cabos, but never Jamaica. The passport regulations tip in hawaii's favor over the Caribbean (except USVI and PR).

Just my 2 anecdotal points.