New US policy: No more 500 mile minimum per segment
Feb 14, 2008, 1:44 pm
#151
Join Date: Aug 2004
Programs: SPG Lifetime Platinum, Hyatt Diamond, JetBlue Mosaic, AA Platinum, National Executive Elite
Posts: 599
I'm lucky enough that I can hold off on booking my tickets for about a week. If US doesn't change this INSANE decision by then...I'm out.
I have been Silver for 2 years now, and this year had a shot at platinum or even Chairman, before the switch. Just like everyone else, I'm in the Northeast.
What boggles my mind is that we (elite members in the northeast) already viewed the 500 mile min. as the ONLY positive for having to fly though Philly (the WORST connecting airport in the region). Now, I'd gladly even take CO, and fly Newark--and I can't even believe I typed that.
Goodbye, US. I thought we had something special together (I was able to look past the quality of your product, the fact that I could NEVER get a non-stop flight anywhere & your horrible hubs--minus CLT, and you gave me unlimited upgrades. Come to think of it, I'm not sure free booze on a flight was worth the issues BEFORE this change, anyway...
I have been Silver for 2 years now, and this year had a shot at platinum or even Chairman, before the switch. Just like everyone else, I'm in the Northeast.
What boggles my mind is that we (elite members in the northeast) already viewed the 500 mile min. as the ONLY positive for having to fly though Philly (the WORST connecting airport in the region). Now, I'd gladly even take CO, and fly Newark--and I can't even believe I typed that.
Goodbye, US. I thought we had something special together (I was able to look past the quality of your product, the fact that I could NEVER get a non-stop flight anywhere & your horrible hubs--minus CLT, and you gave me unlimited upgrades. Come to think of it, I'm not sure free booze on a flight was worth the issues BEFORE this change, anyway...
Feb 14, 2008, 1:47 pm
#152
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Programs: DL Silver, UA Silver, Marriott Lifetime Silver, IHG Plat, Hilton Silver
Posts: 5,695
Feb 14, 2008, 1:51 pm
#153
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: LHR - PHL - LHR - PHL - MAN - PHL - LHR....
Programs: US CP
Posts: 1,180
I guess we now know why the miles have disappeared from the booking pages 
Feb 14, 2008, 2:08 pm
#154
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: BZN
Programs: AA:LT Platinum DL:LT Gold UA:1P MAR:LT Titanium
Posts: 8,291
...price-conscious customers are neither valuable nor loyal as they will drive down the street for a better price. When you compete on price alone eventually everyone suffers as businesses fold, consumers are left with little choice and employees tend to suffer. Eventually, the cost-saving cuts start to cut into the bone...as is the case here..
Feb 14, 2008, 2:09 pm
#155
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: A menace to everything in the sky. Yes. Even birds.
Programs: Eh+ Rapid Rolleyes
Posts: 14,519
My divorce from US was executed over the summer, so I suppose I'm almost happy they made this decision. It's wonderful to be validated.
Although I have been flying the US Shuttle to maintain * status (LH is unavoidable for me). That ends today.
These folks have their heads so far up their own a$$es it's unbelievable.
Although I have been flying the US Shuttle to maintain * status (LH is unavoidable for me). That ends today.
These folks have their heads so far up their own a$$es it's unbelievable.
Feb 14, 2008, 2:09 pm
#156
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: ZRH
Posts: 659
Of course, Tempe being the typical underhanded organization that it is, they announce this after people have been racking up miles and segments for 6 weeks. I'm betting there are a ton of folks who either would not have flown nor credited DM with their flights in January had they known this before the 1st of the year.
This is a real kick in the teeth. What idiots. Now shuttle choice is more of a no-brainer, and flights to ILM, ROA, etc. also look a lot better on DL or anyone else.
I just tried to look at the '06 10-K to see what cost they're recognizing per mile based on the accrual, but couldn't figure it out b/c the cost and associated liability are buried in "other" expenses/liabilities, and the disclosures weren't much help (at least, based on my keyword searches.) But I'm going to guess that both the recognized and realized savings are rather minimal and won't offset the negative PR and defections/lost revenue.
Keep the pretzels, give me my miles. Thanks. Another great way for US to differentiate itself from the entire industry. @:-)
Feb 14, 2008, 2:11 pm
#157
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: United, Delta, American, USAir, Northwest, Southwest
Posts: 3
Actually, it isn't. Not only does US control the earning of miles (flights, credit cards, etc) - they also control the redemption of those miles. It's a whole lot easier to tighten 25k awards even further than it is to make a change like this - at least in the public eye. Why? Tightening awards doesn't require a visible change and a "press release" email.
From the CNBC special on "A day in the life of AA", we learned that the marginal cost of redemption on an award ticket is extremely small. Tempe could have also looked at how the accrue the liability for miles (for example - do they value miles at .005c/mi or do they accrue for the marginal cost of a free ticket for every redeemable ticket earned?)
Tempe today has done nothing more than reaffirm my decision to fly anybody BUT them this year. And yes, that includes WN.
IIRC, it was FWAA who said it best - miles are cheap when you own the printing press and control the redemption.
From the CNBC special on "A day in the life of AA", we learned that the marginal cost of redemption on an award ticket is extremely small. Tempe could have also looked at how the accrue the liability for miles (for example - do they value miles at .005c/mi or do they accrue for the marginal cost of a free ticket for every redeemable ticket earned?)
Tempe today has done nothing more than reaffirm my decision to fly anybody BUT them this year. And yes, that includes WN.
IIRC, it was FWAA who said it best - miles are cheap when you own the printing press and control the redemption.
Feb 14, 2008, 2:25 pm
#158
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Commuting around the mid-atlantic and rust-belt on any number of RJs
Programs: TSA Random Selectee Platinum, * Gold, SPG/HH/MR mid-tier, and a tiny bag of pretzels.
Posts: 9,255
Here is the bet: AA won't do it--they already have a "carrot" approach for full fare flyers.
CO won't do it. Gordo's former crew likes to control the redemption side.
DL/NW probably won't do it, because they are too busy with the prenups, and DL is probably going to gain a lot on the shuttle side from it.
WN won't do it because they know better.
And the last is the point: see elsewhere in the thread, but US is going to be at such a disadvantage to WN in some cases that one can earn double the number of US domestic award tickets by flying the same flights on WN versus US. That's not a good state of affairs.
Feb 14, 2008, 2:28 pm
#159
Join Date: May 2006
Location: PHL/EWR
Programs: UA, AA
Posts: 1,821
Is it possible they are just trying to clean up the balance sheet to make themselves more attractive as a takeout?
Feb 14, 2008, 2:33 pm
#160
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: SYR
Programs: US SLVR, AMEX PLAT
Posts: 61
Thanks for continuing to fly with US.
=
Thanks for continuing to put up with our nonsense until we screw you the next time.
=
Thanks for continuing to put up with our nonsense until we screw you the next time.
Feb 14, 2008, 2:33 pm
#161
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,232
Hit back !
Just some thoughts/ideas to fight back
1. Opt out of all emails AND send a note to Travis Christ requesting that all email communication from US stop IMMEDIATELY
2. Stay away from US partners when able - tell the partners that you are avoiding them because of their relationship with US
3. Send ALL service failures and complaints to the DOT
4. Send all pics of duct tape etc. to media outlets
5. When you see filthy floors or unsanitary conditions in the Clubs - call the local health inspector and file a complaint/ask them to inspect the CLUB ASAP
6. When the service paid for is not provided - immediately contact your credit card issuer to dispute the charges
7. When you witness chaotic conditions - contact local media outlets and ask them to report on the situation
8. If you fly US to the EU and they are late or cancel or downgrade or do anything contrary to EU rules - file a claim for compensation
9. Contact your local Senator or Congressperson and ask them not to support any legislation that supports US Airways - or contact Senator Arlen Specter of PA and voice your dissatisfaction with US
10. Organize - such as FFOCUS - spread the word - try an airport rally at PHL or CLT or PHX
11. Redeem miles ASAP on PARTNER carriers in PREMIUM CLASSES
12. LOUDLY call for a Passenger Bill of Rights - email execs at other airlines and let them know that actions at US forced your hand to call for a Bill of Rights
TAKE AWAY THE REVENUE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IF YOU DON'T LEAVE - THEY WON'T CARE AND THEY WON'T CHANGE
CREATE FIRETRAVISCHRIST.COM
Just some venting/thoughts/ideas
1. Opt out of all emails AND send a note to Travis Christ requesting that all email communication from US stop IMMEDIATELY
2. Stay away from US partners when able - tell the partners that you are avoiding them because of their relationship with US
3. Send ALL service failures and complaints to the DOT
4. Send all pics of duct tape etc. to media outlets
5. When you see filthy floors or unsanitary conditions in the Clubs - call the local health inspector and file a complaint/ask them to inspect the CLUB ASAP
6. When the service paid for is not provided - immediately contact your credit card issuer to dispute the charges
7. When you witness chaotic conditions - contact local media outlets and ask them to report on the situation
8. If you fly US to the EU and they are late or cancel or downgrade or do anything contrary to EU rules - file a claim for compensation
9. Contact your local Senator or Congressperson and ask them not to support any legislation that supports US Airways - or contact Senator Arlen Specter of PA and voice your dissatisfaction with US
10. Organize - such as FFOCUS - spread the word - try an airport rally at PHL or CLT or PHX
11. Redeem miles ASAP on PARTNER carriers in PREMIUM CLASSES
12. LOUDLY call for a Passenger Bill of Rights - email execs at other airlines and let them know that actions at US forced your hand to call for a Bill of Rights
TAKE AWAY THE REVENUE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IF YOU DON'T LEAVE - THEY WON'T CARE AND THEY WON'T CHANGE
CREATE FIRETRAVISCHRIST.COM
Just some venting/thoughts/ideas
Feb 14, 2008, 2:34 pm
#162
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NYC
Programs: AA Platinum; US Gold; DL Silver
Posts: 941
The loss in revenues, especially for high-cost short-haul tickets, would have more of an impact on the balance sheet than mileage liabilities. After all, US's "liabilities" under DM can be discharged entirely at any time, for any reason. They could just announce DM is discontinued and all miles are worthless -- and it would only cause a bit less angst than this truly, truly boneheaded decision.
DM was what set US apart in a good way -- but now it's turned into a joke.
DM was what set US apart in a good way -- but now it's turned into a joke.
Feb 14, 2008, 2:37 pm
#163
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NYC
Programs: AA Platinum; US Gold; DL Silver
Posts: 941
Just some thoughts/ideas to fight back
1. Opt out of all emails AND send a note to Travis Christ requesting that all email communication from US stop IMMEDIATELY
2. Stay away from US partners when able - tell the partners that you are avoiding them because of their relationship with US
3. Send ALL service failures and complaints to the DOT
4. Send all pics of duct tape etc. to media outlets
5. When you see filthy floors or unsanitary conditions in the Clubs - call the local health inspector and file a complaint/ask them to inspect the CLUB ASAP
6. When the service paid for is not provided - immediately contact your credit card issuer to dispute the charges
7. When you witness chaotic conditions - contact local media outlets and ask them to report on the situation
8. If you fly US to the EU and they are late or cancel or downgrade or do anything contrary to EU rules - file a claim for compensation
9. Contact your local Senator or Congressperson and ask them not to support any legislation that supports US Airways - or contact Senator Arlen Specter of PA and voice your dissatisfaction with US
10. Organize - such as FFOCUS - spread the word - try an airport rally at PHL or CLT or PHX
11. Redeem miles ASAP on PARTNER carriers in PREMIUM CLASSES
12. LOUDLY call for a Passenger Bill of Rights - email execs at other airlines and let them know that actions at US forced your hand to call for a Bill of Rights
TAKE AWAY THE REVENUE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IF YOU DON'T LEAVE - THEY WON'T CARE AND THEY WON'T CHANGE
CREATE FIRETRAVISCHRIST.COM
Just some venting/thoughts/ideas
1. Opt out of all emails AND send a note to Travis Christ requesting that all email communication from US stop IMMEDIATELY
2. Stay away from US partners when able - tell the partners that you are avoiding them because of their relationship with US
3. Send ALL service failures and complaints to the DOT
4. Send all pics of duct tape etc. to media outlets
5. When you see filthy floors or unsanitary conditions in the Clubs - call the local health inspector and file a complaint/ask them to inspect the CLUB ASAP
6. When the service paid for is not provided - immediately contact your credit card issuer to dispute the charges
7. When you witness chaotic conditions - contact local media outlets and ask them to report on the situation
8. If you fly US to the EU and they are late or cancel or downgrade or do anything contrary to EU rules - file a claim for compensation
9. Contact your local Senator or Congressperson and ask them not to support any legislation that supports US Airways - or contact Senator Arlen Specter of PA and voice your dissatisfaction with US
10. Organize - such as FFOCUS - spread the word - try an airport rally at PHL or CLT or PHX
11. Redeem miles ASAP on PARTNER carriers in PREMIUM CLASSES
12. LOUDLY call for a Passenger Bill of Rights - email execs at other airlines and let them know that actions at US forced your hand to call for a Bill of Rights
TAKE AWAY THE REVENUE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IF YOU DON'T LEAVE - THEY WON'T CARE AND THEY WON'T CHANGE
CREATE FIRETRAVISCHRIST.COM
Just some venting/thoughts/ideas
Just switch to another carrier. And if you're feeling spiteful about it, at the end of 2008, mail a photocopy of your Delta, Continental or jetBlue statement and your total spending amount to US.
At the end of this year, a great deal of the industry will be in trouble. I suspect US itself will be absolutely on its knees -- a lot of its pricing power on short-hauls came from Dividend Miles. Without the 500 mile minimum, US is an overpriced option -- other airlines at the same price point and service level will give you more miles, and other airlines (see jetBlue) will give you better service for less.
If US was hacking fares on PHL-BOS down to $99 each way, such a decision MIGHT make sense. But they're wanting the "legacy" fares AND the LCC FF program all at once. It doesn't work that way.
Feb 14, 2008, 2:40 pm
#164
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Long Island, NY
Programs: CoFounder and Chairman, FFOCUS (Frequent Flyers Organized and concerned about Unacceptable Service.
Posts: 1,341
All of the above is true.
FFOCUS is mobilizing to fight this with everything we've got. Remember--we organized after Black Tuesday, and we won that fight.
This is a different crew however in Tempe, and they are arrogant enough not to care. Let's see how they feel when the other airlines do not join in and they are left out to dry.
I am sure DL is saying thank you for sending so many high yield customers over to their shuttle!
We have a suggested letter-please visit the FFOCUS web site for more details.
FFOCUS is mobilizing to fight this with everything we've got. Remember--we organized after Black Tuesday, and we won that fight.
This is a different crew however in Tempe, and they are arrogant enough not to care. Let's see how they feel when the other airlines do not join in and they are left out to dry.
I am sure DL is saying thank you for sending so many high yield customers over to their shuttle!
We have a suggested letter-please visit the FFOCUS web site for more details.
Feb 14, 2008, 2:43 pm
#165
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NYC
Programs: AA Platinum; US Gold; DL Silver
Posts: 941
It's not worth the energy to fight -- just switch to another carrier.
Make sure you e-mail that carrier and tell them WHY you have switched, to ensure that they don't follow US's lead. Wasting time e-mailing/complaining to US isn't going to accomplish anything -- they have to feel economic pain as a result of their decision. A big letter-writing campaign or scorched-earth dramafest isn't going to accomplish anything other than sturm und drang.
Make sure you e-mail that carrier and tell them WHY you have switched, to ensure that they don't follow US's lead. Wasting time e-mailing/complaining to US isn't going to accomplish anything -- they have to feel economic pain as a result of their decision. A big letter-writing campaign or scorched-earth dramafest isn't going to accomplish anything other than sturm und drang.