LAX1K to AmWest

I would not advocate lawsuits against US Airways for being a bad airline, they are just a bad airline. The best way to really combat that is to walk to other airlines. I know many are addicted to the upgrades, but hey, it is not that much different than E+ on United... or the coach legroom on Southwest... it is just a bad airline.. and not getting too much better.

So the best way to let them know is to stop using them. It will not hit them immediately, but the average $/mile will drop... and then business users will move on.

I know, I am a CP, who is going to be a GP next year, due to me choosing to move on....

McFlyPHL

On that note, noticed today that US puts 12/138=150 on their A320s. So does B6, but with no F seats. Gosh... I wonder who's more comfortable? And more full service to boot.

crunchie

I think this makes a lot more sense and will be a lot more effective than a class action suit (which we haven't even been able to agree on the basis for). DP is making decisions and taking actions that driving away loyal business customers that provide a sustained, predictable revenue stream. I'm a database geek but this just smells like mismanagement and on the extreme, one could argue this is intentionally making bad decisions for the company to fill his own pockets (bad decisions for short term gains but long term problems = big bonus).

McFlyPHL

So you want to sue a management team that's producing above industry returns at present, and historically? Gosh, I wish I were the attorney who got paid for that losing proposition. Especially when their own preferred numbers show an increase (even if FFOCUS claims a drop).

jimcfsus

Remember there are all of those artificially created elites thanks to the "Everything Counts" promo last year. I think the real numbers this year will be an eye opener once things shake out.

me4yankees

FFOCUS shows a drop in BIS (read: real) elites. I am sure Tempe will show an increase in free Gold, "Everything Counts," "Try Preferred Status On For Size," "Half Everything Half Counts" Preferreds!

LAX1K to AmWest

Well, in my opinion, any company can force a short term gain at the loss of long-term sustainable profits. You can sell the world and cut costs and it takes people (and organizations) time to react. Just as you can add benefits and it takes time to see a real return on revenue, the opposite is true. The problem is, they will see these returns continue even as they "improve" things.

I still think Tempe over-simplifies the business flyer. All airline seats are not interchangable. And people will avoid US Airways as the cost of seats are higher than many competitors that frankly offer a better product.

Blumie

Even if US's financial performance sucked, the odds of this type of lawsuit succeeding is roughly zero.

McFlyPHL

I'm aware of what FFOCUS shows... but personally, I think it's anecdotal at best and sourced from a disgruntled, vocal minority. It's barely actionable information for a management decision, let alone from a legal perspective. Remember, FFOCUS' numbers have shown the sky to be falling for several quarters when, in fact, it hasn't.

me4yankees

Actually FFOCUS did conduct two e-mail surveys prior to the summer, and while I do not have the results in front of me, a majority of those who participated in the survey did indicate at the time that they were beginning to move away from US. However, you are correct in saying that perhaps it is a time for another survey of our almost 1000 members.

Also, I am not disgruntled. I am very disappointed and saddened by the way the merger has gone. I am also angry, because I only have three carriers to choose from and so I must still fly US sometimes even if I do not want to. This year I currently have 81 flights on US and I have flown 31 flights on other carriers, so when I comment on the experiences, I think I have some basis for comparison.

McFlyPHL

... unfortunately, that's only half the equation. There's also NEW customers and those who have increased their flying. Those are fairly unlikely to be members of FFOCUS. As a passenger advocacy group I'm impressed with FFOCUS. As a source of meaningful and actionable statistics it's got a long way to go.

Re: disgruntled/disappointed, we're in the same boat. I live in PHL and it takes serious effort to get me to consistently go out of my way to avoid doing business with US (90 flights on others, 28 on US - and some of those due to reroutes).

me4yankees

I would agree with you. New customers are less likely to be members because they would not have the history that we have with the airline and may be content with what the airline has to offer. If I were just looking for a cheap flight, a possible upgrade to a no-frills, less legroom F cabin with no place for my coat, inconsistent customer service, and wouldn't mind leaving late and arriving late for many flights, then US just might still be the carrier for me. Unfortunately I want and need a little more than that.

McFlyPHL

I'm with you! One thing I don't understand, though, is the complaints about coats on the 320s. Aside from a couple of flights on the 757's, every narrowbody AA flight I've had hangs coats on the bulkhead behind the last row of F. This for an airline with a hub in Chicago and a major presence in NYC. I've never had any problem of anywhere near the magnitude* folks make this out to be. What gives on the US flights?

*Except the one time when an FA at ORD inadvertently switched my coat with someone elses. The odds of another guy wearing a 48XL coat in the same color as mine being seated in an F cabin of 16 aside, AA tracked down the person with my coat before they left on their connection.

VanTheMan63

Well...one sec.....

What I think we've said at FFOCUS is that the direction of US is not sustainable and that the sky will fall...not that the sky HAS fallen. And as late as November 6, that view by investors seems to be taking hold: http://www.forbes.com/2007/11/06/usa...markets39.html

Bottom line: Being at war with FFers, VFFers, High yield pax and crapping all over their employees WILL catch up with them. Providing a TERRIBLE product while pax write in, only to get a "voucher" is NOT sustainable. It's not.

I don't think FFOCUS EVER said, "this airline will bottom out and crash in a week, or next quarter....I think what we've said is, "this airline is a mess, either the Sand Castle rocket scientists START listening and take some steps to fix the product or the profits WILL go away."

There are clues EVERYWHERE....starting with how many ways one can become a US Airways "elite" customer. All of you out there that belong to other programs, answer this one simple question: "How many offers have you received to try their elite program on for size? Or to buy up?"

How many? I belong to ALL OF THEM! I've received exactly ZERO offers....oddly enough, while being a passenger on all of them from time to time.

Meanwhile, as a US CP....I've received exactly THREE e-mails (that I read) asking me if I wanted to try Silver on for size...or if I wanted to buy Gold....the last one I received, I actually forwarded to the (miss)management team and asked, "what more do I get for trying Silver on for size that I'm not getting as a CP?"

No answer to the e-mail....which didn't surprise me.

If that's not a HUGE clue, someone tell me what is?

The writing is ON THE WALL....And the Zagat survey is just one more slice of evidence that FFOCUS is right! FFers and VFFers are leaving in droves.....and that will ultimately produce a very large hole in the side of the ship.

McFlyPHL

The decline is largely attributable to recent fuel price spikes. I'd like to think that it means the operation has to get better. Unfortunately, this is a commodity product. As long as they're reasonably cheap they'll be OK.

Sooner or later the results for US (and the entire industry) will go south. I just don't think that this management team is going to falter. They know pretty well what they're selling and who's buying. They aren't going to manage to "VFF" clientele - and so far that's proven to be a better approach than those who do so.

I don't like it, but that's the way it works (or seems to).