dontsaystewardess

Wanted to put this question out to the group.

Is CP the only tier that really matters to Tempe?

With the new qualification level weeding out the 100 segment CP's and disappearing FC seats is Tempe saying "only REAL CP's (100/120) matter to us".

Your opinion??

McFlyPHL

All the tiers have changed quite a bit, in general for the worse. CP has fared no better. I wouldn't be surprised to see a WN-style system as the final product in all honesty. Single elite tier, milestones in a 12 month period earn you "stuff" (like TA upgrades), flat bonus miles, and upgrade priority based on rolling 12 months activity and/or fare bucket. Also known as "what have you done for my RASM lately?"

mikey110890

I do not even think CP matters to Tempe. Just look at all the changes in rules, policies and actual procedures. If their intention is to weed out the elites, than they are doing a fine job. Considering the cost of a "new" customer these days I just do not understand it. We obviously do not fit into their demographic anymore.

ClueByFour

What's the profile of the "average" flyer? Or "median?"

I would think that even somebody doing 25 segments (basically 1 R/T/month) would be important to an airline, but what do I know?

Tempe, apparently, disagrees.

Alphaguy

I'm not certain they could do this as a member of the*A.
I say this thinking how the other programs are set up and how they would determine * status, etc...

SOBE ER DOC

What makes you think we matter as Chairman's either?

The sand castle has made it crystal clear that elites are not a part of their central business plan. High loads and capturing more of the leisure market are the key to the new US's success.

I believe a post on another thread put it best...US will continue to drag us along to keep our business here until 2007. Then they will again quietly eliminate additional benfits hopng that we don't notice. If we do, cest la vie, US will have already completed more retooling of its business model toward O&D and leisure markets.

Notable slaps in the face:

1. Decreasing capacity in F across many planes in US East fleet

2. Elimination of pre-departure beverages in F

3. Eliminating snack (albeit a bad one) on shorter flights

4. Loss of upgrade opportunites on transatlantic routes to favor gate purchase of upgrades by non-elites

5. Chairman's Desk service and quality slipping

6. "Losing" our miles and segments during integration of the two web sites

7. Elimination of some of the upgrade transparency that we used to enjoy

8. Route reduction capacities on many transcon and business routes and shift what's left to inconvenient redeye service eastbound and late afternoon service westbound not to mention smaller aircraft to "adjust for demand"


In the past month, this US1 has spent over $2,500 on airfare over at DL. They may not be perfect, but at least they seem to value their business and elite pax.

SS255

I think the "bottom line" matters more to Tempe than any subgroup of flyers - frequent or otherwise. I just don't think they've made the connection yet that VFF's (if you can keep them) can actually improve the bottom line.

ClueByFour

Sure. They've made money. In a shrinking capacity market with rising fares.

Once they are done taking capacity out of the system, who do you think is going to be the bread and butter? The 1x/year family trip to Vegas or Cancun?

I've detailed the "cut and run to Cancun and Vegas" strategy in other threads and why that won't work--and when it fails, US is going to wish it had not jacked all of it's elites around, especially the ones out East.

JScottsAZ

Why is there so much endless -- and usually baseless -- speculation about what "Tempe" will do? Believe it or not, what the new US will be is what HP was/is. If you like or are OK with HP, you'll be OK with the new US.

HP has always differentiated itself from WN, so all this speculation that the new US will be just like WN -- cattle car/no real elite program, etc. -- is just absurd speculation.

And for the record, pre-departure drinks always have been and still always are given to F pax on HP flights. The elimination of these drinks was a US East thing -- and as catering and training integrate, the East flights should get them back. If you're gonna bash the "Sandcastle," at least blame them for their own mistakes. Heaven knows there are certainly enough of those.

DeacDiggler

I do think that now that the levels have been cleared out for 2006 we'll see a little more availability....and in 2007 even more so without any of the CPs that were minted on the promotions. For now, CP and GP are dime a dozen - next year we'll see a lot more Golds and Silvers and less CPs and even PPs.

MileKing

US is really in the dumper in my view. Pursuit of the leisure market is fine, but I don't know too many leisure travelers who are going to pay $400+ for a weekend trip IAD-CLT (as US is charging for flights six months out), especially when UA is pricing at $267.....still a rip-off, but better than US....and I can make the drive to BWI and fly AirTran for $180 or so.

They have gutted Dividend Miles with all the benefit cuts and reduced availability of 'saver' award seats to the point that I have stored my 1.5 miles / $ Mastercard and returned to using my Citibank AA Mastercard which is giving 1.25 miles / $ thru July 31. The 1/4 mile difference is a small price to pay for the much, much wider award availability on AA.

Perhaps I'll return to flying US at some point (I was Gold a few years back), but at the moment I don't see a good reason to give them my $ or collect US miles.

SOBE ER DOC

You see the thing is this...Tempe took the airline over warts and all. Therefore, as any business person will tell you, they are now responsible for every mistake made whether it be US-East or US-West making or having made the mistakes. It's Tempe's lipstick-covered pig now.

I have, up to this year, been a loyal US pax, especially since many of my friends work for US-East. I want the airline to succeed and I want to fly the airline as much as possible. I just can't justify it when I am not valued as a customer. Loyalty should have its rewards.

jerseyfinn

. . . Notable slaps in the face . . .

I don't characterize them as slaps in the face ( maybe some gentle taps, but then again, some folks like handcuffs, leather, and that bondage routine ).

US is indeed an airline in flux. I completely agree that one of the fundamental factors propelling these changes are the capacity reductions which are showing up in the balance sheets as slight profits.

IMO, it does appear that US will attempt to offer CPs benefits and perks which may compel some customers to stick with US. How this will work for each CP ( or any level elite for that matter ) remains to be seen. US continues to reconfigure aircraft, tweak the schedule, and juggle fares while they move forward with their own consolidation while still competing against other carriers in a dynamic market.

In no way do I feel that US is out to get the elites. However, some of their operational changes may indeed impact certain elites and the opportunities they have to fully utilize their DM priviliges. US may end up forcing a showdown between Tempe's vision and elites.

1. Decreasing capacity in F across many planes in US East fleet

Recent discussions in US Aviation touch partly upon this issue. Tempe is juggling aircraft and routes between east and west as they tweak operations. One ( potentially unfortunate ) outcome is a decision to reconfigure AC along more standard lines between them. It seems that a conscious decision is being made to pare down F seats to better reflect the numbers of F fares they can actually sell. This is certainly an area which should concern the elites, particularly CPs. One should legitimately question the value of DM or CP status if one can't get UGs.

2. Elimination of pre-departure beverages in F
3. Eliminating snack (albeit a bad one) on shorter flights

I don't fret much over a lack of a drink upon boarding, likewise food on a short flight. On longer flights however, there remain standards of service which are suppossed to be followed by FAs.

4. Loss of upgrade opportunites on transatlantic routes to favor gate purchase of upgrades by non-elites

You refer to the PHL-LIS TAs. It is unfair to characterize this as a DM devaluation since the genesis is operational in nature. In this specific instance, ETOP rated 757s have been pulled into TA service to fly some of the new routes before any sort of AC reconfiguration could be undertaken. These planes fly without Envoy-configured seats and what is being sold as a TA F seat is actually a standard 57 F seat with limited pitch. Hopefully US will reconfigure these 57s after the season is over. If they do not do so, then one should indeed question this hybridization of TA service.

Also worrisome is the pending reconfigurations of the A330s which will reduce the numbers of Envoy seats and eliminate those row 1 seats ( which directly affects CPs). The overll UG impact upon CP should be minimal, but in certain seasons, other elites may find increased competition for UGs.

5. Chairman's Desk service and quality slipping

Haven't experienced this myself. The CP Desk remains attentive, helpful, and a seamless experience. Not to say that one can't encounter a rep having a bad hair day. But for CPs, having that special access line is one of the strong benefits of the program.

6. "Losing" our miles and segments during integration of the two web sites

Life is full of bumps and starts. That there's a period of transition when one can't fully access their DM account is an inconvenience, but hardly a slap in the face.

7. Elimination of some of the upgrade transparency that we used to enjoy

If one reads the new DM literature, it sounds to me as if CP UGs will be more transparent, not less. I myself will continue to call in at the 7 day window and confirm UGs.

The bottom line is that at present, the US DM program continues to hold many benefits, especially to CPs. That said, there has indeed been a devaluation in the program which at the very least will have some notable impact upon the other elite tiers. As operational, schedule, and AC issues more clearly unfold, it is possible that CPs could also feel a diminishment in benefits and priviliges. It's just too early to say this as a blanket statement.

US may indeed be making a conscious attempt to pare down the numbers of elites. Is this a good thing or a bad thing? It all depends upon how and to where you fly. A CP will always benefit more than other elites. A better question might be to ask what the future value of DM will be to platinums or golds.

Barry

DC-USCP-UAPE

There are a lot of little changes I found annoying. Stupid stuff like loss of roll over miles, promising being able to nominate someone silver (heck, one would think this is a great marketing tool for a VFF to bring in a collegue over to US) and then finding out that it doesn't take effect until you qualify for next year.

All this stuff is 'death by a thousand cuts'. I've stated it before, US is supposed to be a 'low cost, full service' airline. They seem to be cutting the full service in favor of the low cost, and at some point they are going to reach a tipping point. I wish they would just come out and state what's sacred and not going to go, and what's on the table.

Shrinking the FC cabin seemed inevitable. Their costs are largely fixed, so they need to make as much money during peak times (Mondays, Fridays, Holidays) as they can. Since they've cut quality of service in FC and aren't planning to invest in upgrading what they have, they are service is falling farther and farther behind competitors and the reputation as such is starting to catch up with them. Which means, FC isn't selling and becomes a drag on revenue. Hence, take out seats. A logical train of thought, but a real disappointment to those of FF on this board.

The real question is if they are going to become just a LCC, can they compete with those that started out as LCCs? For example, can they keep costs down when they run almost every type and make of plane in the air, while Southwest just uses the 737?

shuttle_boy

CP doesn't matter to US. S(%&W this...I got the..message..FF not wanted..I'll leave when I can match to new airline for 2007. Sad thing is I am one of the few people that would qualify for CP this year..but why bother it is easier to do elsewhere and you get more recognition