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US/AA merger- MASTER DISCUSSION THREAD/incl 'when will US leave STAR'

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US/AA merger- MASTER DISCUSSION THREAD/incl 'when will US leave STAR'

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Old Dec 8, 13, 9:45 am   -   Wikipost
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been on FT for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: aztimm
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There is an existing thread in the AA forum that may be useful to US and AA Flyertalkers:
US-AA Merger: Just the Facts thread

As facts become posted, that should be the place to look.

Merger discussion, speculation, and other questions can be directed here, or the similar thread in the AA forum:
MERGER: US and AA 9 Dec 2013 and implications for AA flyers (new)

AA - US Merger Agreement / Announcement / DOJ Action Discussion (consolidated, and now closed to new posts)
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Old Aug 15, 13, 6:52 am
  #1396  
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: SFO
Posts: 3,601
So is anyone else taking the 5k PQM for the US Club membership now, since United Club access should be good to go for a while? Even with Amex Platinum access, I've flown enough codeshares this year that it would have been nice to go in. Only reason I didn't was the pending merger and the Nov 1 rumor.
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Old Aug 15, 13, 9:03 am
  #1397  
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
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Originally Posted by tommyleo View Post
"The suit, the lawyers contend, ignores several benefits that the merger would bring to the market including more flights to more destinations, lower prices, and better service."

Pay some lawyers enough money and they'll say ANYTHING!
Ha. Maybe lower prices for them to operate the planes... but no way would they pass the savings onto the people that actually fill the planes.
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Old Aug 15, 13, 9:27 am
  #1398  
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: DCA/IAD
Programs: AA - Platinum; 1W Sapphire; HHonors - Silver; UA dirt
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Originally Posted by PWMTrav View Post
So is anyone else taking the 5k PQM for the US Club membership now, since United Club access should be good to go for a while? Even with Amex Platinum access, I've flown enough codeshares this year that it would have been nice to go in. Only reason I didn't was the pending merger and the Nov 1 rumor.
I renewed. Just hit 50,000 points thanks to it. Dont think I have enough motivation to shoot for Plat as my travel future looks very light for YE 2013.
IADCAflyer is offline  
Old Aug 15, 13, 9:32 am
  #1399  
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Originally Posted by BoeingBoy View Post
Fiscally responsiveness is but one factor in the choice of a CEO. Sometimes it can hurt more than help. Consider Frank Lorenzo, the creator of the modern Continental. He declared bankruptcy to bust the CAL unions and was successful - until he tried to dismantle EAL to benefit CAL, which lead to a strike by the IAM. The end result was that he was banned for life from ownership and management of airlines.

Later, Gordon Bethune was picked as CEO of CAL. He treated employees decently - giving away automobiles every quarter - and made CAL arguably the best U.S. carrier. As an aside, he learned airline management at PI.

Jim
A little OT: I've seen Jeff Smisek at UA referred to as FLIBS: Frank Lorenzo in a Better Suit.

You can see how well he's regarded by workers and customers alike.

Last edited by Superguy; Aug 15, 13 at 9:45 am
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Old Aug 15, 13, 9:34 am
  #1400  
 
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Originally Posted by skitch23 View Post
Ha. Maybe lower prices for them to operate the planes... but no way would they pass the savings onto the people that actually fill the planes.
I love those comments. It will VERY likely lower costs. Will it mean lower fares? Since when have you EVER seen a fare drop and remain in place for any period of time except when a competing carrier comes in and the incumbent carrier tanks fares in an effort to run the new entrant out?

Fares four years ago could be had in summer on transcon routes for $250 to $299. You're lucky to find a sub $400 fare today (save for the last week of August).

Add to that (assume we're talking about Kettles which is 5% of FT posters and 95% of the general flyer):

$25 per bag
$25 per ticket (using the phone)
$65 to book a "choice" seat
$9 for a meal


That $400 fare is well north of $500 when you add fees.
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Old Aug 15, 13, 9:43 am
  #1401  
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Originally Posted by DCann View Post
I've been reading everything I can since the Tuesday morning announcement.. I wish I had known about this conf call tho. It must have been quite interesting based on the several articles I've read incl this one

American, US Airways Outline Defense, Seek Speedy Trial to Revive Merger
I'd love to hear how less competition lowers prices, especially when Dougie and Co. are on the record as looking forward to raising fares due to less competition and reduced capacity.
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Old Aug 15, 13, 9:56 am
  #1402  
 
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Havent you heard? Doug Parker (through his counsel) has declared supply and demand curves to be soooo 20th century.

/sarcasm
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Old Aug 15, 13, 10:05 am
  #1403  
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Originally Posted by Superguy View Post
I'd love to hear how less competition lowers prices, especially when Dougie and Co. are on the record as looking forward to raising fares due to less competition and reduced capacity.
I really want to read the transcripts from the case if the counsel actually tries to argue this in court..
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Old Aug 15, 13, 10:06 am
  #1404  
 
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Originally Posted by stockmanjr View Post
I really want to read the transcripts from the case if the counsel actually tries to argue this in court..
The depositions may be very, very LOLworthy.
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Old Aug 15, 13, 10:21 am
  #1405  
 
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LOL if that is the best defense the new AA/US has this will be a slam dunk for the government.

I did open a US credit card for the signup bonus in anticipation of the merger, but I would gladly use my 35k DM's on just a domestic award if it meant no merger. Reading about this pretty heavily for the last few days and it is clear US flyers and AA flyers are both happy with the airlines as is and don't want to come together.
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Old Aug 15, 13, 10:28 am
  #1406  
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
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Originally Posted by DCann View Post
I've been reading everything I can since the Tuesday morning announcement.. I wish I had known about this conf call tho. It must have been quite interesting based on the several articles I've read incl this one

American, US Airways Outline Defense, Seek Speedy Trial to Revive Merger
This is the most interesting part to me:

“Of course,” the lawyers said, “there are connecting flights that are theoretically competitive but that’s true of any transaction in the airline industry.”
Whether there is a connection or not, both airline's are selling a ticket from A -> B. If they didn't see this as competition, they would have no problem with hidden city ticketing.
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Old Aug 15, 13, 10:33 am
  #1407  
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Originally Posted by ITRADE View Post
Fares four years ago could be had in summer on transcon routes for $250 to $299. You're lucky to find a sub $400 fare today (save for the last week of August).
Which wouldn't even cover the cost of the fuel to fly you 5,000 miles, let alone the plane lease or purchase, the labor, airport landing fees, and so on. This was also at a time where most airlines were losing money like crazy during the recession.

If your argument is that we need an airline industry where everyone is 5 minutes from Chapter 11, and where airlines can't afford capital investments, regularly employees on their promised commitments, and there's no reasonable expectation that companies can offer return on shareholder investment, that's amazingly short-sighted.
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Old Aug 15, 13, 10:35 am
  #1408  
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
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Originally Posted by eponymous_coward View Post
Which wouldn't even cover the cost of the fuel to fly you 5,000 miles, let alone the plane lease or purchase, the labor and so on. This was also at a time where most airlines were losing money like crazy during the recession.

If your argument is that we need an airline industry where everyone is 5 minutes from Chapter 11, and where airlines can't afford capital investments, regularly employees on their promised commitments, and there's no reasonable expectation that companies can offer return on shareholder investment, that's amazingly short-sighted.
Not every seat needs to be a teaser fare, just as not every seat needs to be a full Y fare. However, it appears that the lack of competition has lessened the incentive for carriers to actually compete against each other.

When was the last time we had a fare war?
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Old Aug 15, 13, 10:40 am
  #1409  
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
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Originally Posted by ITRADE View Post
I renewed. Just hit 50,000 points thanks to it. Dont think I have enough motivation to shoot for Plat as my travel future looks very light for YE 2013.
Yup, my wife will probably be the club member this year, as the 5k will get her to Gold. I don't think I have a shot at getting past Silver unless I buy up. However, with our last booking, we just determined that my 1 year old will hit Silver in December. If not, she was going to have to be the club member

I'm getting kind of excited that this merger might not happen, even though I was initially for it. I'm starting to realize I'm better off as a bottom tier elite on US than any other airline's bottom tier. This could be a win for all of us kettles in disguise.
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Old Aug 15, 13, 10:58 am
  #1410  
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: PHL
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Originally Posted by eponymous_coward View Post
Which wouldn't even cover the cost of the fuel to fly you 5,000 miles, let alone the plane lease or purchase, the labor, airport landing fees, and so on.
Interesting. How much fuel is actually used to fly one person (say 170 pounds) 5000 miles?
tommyleo is offline  

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