ArizonaGuy

But gifting creates 100% net new miles in the recipient's account and if those miles are used on a ticket for the recipient then theoretically any potential "fraud" is avoided. Ticket for passenger X was purchased with miles in passenger X's account, not some unknown third party with a different last name, address, etc. None of that's against rules but who knows what is setting off these recent situations posted here.

dcpatti

I can also see where a red flag might pop up on this--- and while I am in no way accusing the OP of doing this, I can absolutely imagine a profiteer setting up a "shell" DM account, buying the miles, and offering to book Business class (C) international tickets for someone else at a profit. Again, not accusing the OP of doing this; simply saying I can see how someone who wants to exploit the various miles promos could do so, and leave very little paper trail doing it.

That said, it is total BS that US says "the matter is closed, please stop emailing us" if the OP has never had the opportunity to tell his side of the story. Involving attorneys and the press are certainly some possible outcomes but before things are taken that far, I would send a letter by certified mail to the Fraud Department using one of the public mailing addresses, and also call and ask to speak to a supervisor. Ask everyone you speak with for a direct callback number in case the phone call gets dropped.

I do not know what kind of proof it would take to show that these tickets were purchased following the rules but anything that proves relationship between the OP and the ticket recipients would help. Send all that in your registered/certified mail and start your phone call with "I wanted to treat my sister and her husband (or whoever they are) to a trip to Wherever for their anniversary." Most folks will not treat someone to an International business class ticket so spell out your reason, clearly and concisely. Keep the emotion out of your letter and try to limit it to a short paragraph or two because a lot of people who read incoming mail tune out when the letters are long or the words are passionate. You may consider cc'ing someone in DOT but I would give it one more try in a less "aggressive" manner simply because some people, when threatened, shut down. If you can get them to review your issue without backing them into a corner, you will have a better chance at getting this resolved to your satisfaction.

SS255

B of A did this to me once on an erroneous charge on my US Signature Visa card. They claimed that their "thorough investigation" discovered that there was a signature on the sales draft, so they concluded that I made the purchase. They therefore "closed" the matter and told me that I had to pay for the $329 charge.

I fired back that the account number on the sales draft (the copy of which they sent me) was not my account number (nor my name on the signature), and therefore it was not my purchase. I also copied the Office of the Comptroller of Currency on the letter. I received a response a few days later stating that they were removing the charge from my account.

My point is that just because a company "performs a thorough investigation," does not mean that the investigation was thorough. I knew that I was right and they were wrong, and I was not going to let it go. If I were in your situation, knowing that I played by the rules, I would fight this with everything in my power, and I would escalate the matter as high up as I needed to go to get somebody with decision-making authority to pay attention. I'm sure that all it will really take is one very strongly worded letter by an attorney with a copy to the DOT, and you'll get your miles back -- and hopefully something for your troubles, as well.

Good luck!

treznor

I seriously doubt that you would have any problems. The only thing that seems to be getting people in trouble is booking tickets for other people. That -shouldn't- be a problem either, but that appears to be what is setting the audits off as it could conceivably construed as selling points as I'm sure the thought in the fraud department is "What kind of person would buy points just to give a ticket to someone else without that person paying them for it somehow?".

AZ Travels the World

You have nothing to be concerned about. Your use is exactly what they anticipate people will be doing with the miles they purchase. If I were you, I would not give it another thought.

tommyleo

So US didn't anticipate anyone buying 100's of thousands (if not millions) of miles? How can you be that certain?

AZ Travels the World

I wasn't referring to the number of miles -- I meant people, with existing accounts (not newly created for this purpose), buying miles that they use for themselves.

I'm highly confident that people in that situation have no worries with regard to the fraud department.

tommyleo

Gotcha. Agreed. ^

DCAorBust

I understand what you're getting at here, but that's not what was said. He was merely giving comfort that the proposed activity is unlikely to raise a red flag. The poster was specifically aiming at 100k miles, which is definitely within the parameters of what US advertises (buy 50, get 100 / etc).

As for whether US contemplated people piling up hundreds of thousands or millions of miles, surely they they must have contemplated it, though at a cost of ~$1400 per 100k miles (as doubled), I would think that transactions yielding hundreds and hundreds of thousands would be relatively rare (though I can definitely imagine plenty of legit reasons to do it--take the whole family to Europe for cheap, etc.). US's new account "waiting period" before purchase suggests to me that that they considered the risks here and planned for them (perhaps insufficiently, but that's the risk that US bore).

I don't object to the review of accounts that are newly created and appear to churn up tons of miles in order to book *A awards. I think it's only responsible that they look into these things. OTOH I object to any such account being terminated in the absence of actual wrong-doing. Buying and swapping miles cannot be enough--that's what they've invited you to do. What really troubles me is the fact that there is no guarantee of a fair review of your account activity. Instead you're stuck with US's crack fraud department goon squad. Quite a risk you're taking when buying miles under this sort of scheme.

As for the question about what causes an audit, I tend to stick by the view that pigs get fat while hogs get slaughtered. This isn't to say that you can't legitimately make use of a promotion to its outer limits under the program, but it will certainly increase the likelihood that you'll come under the review of the goon squad.

jsciv

It may be too late for you to do this, but there can be a recourse short of courts for future readers. If you are purchasing miles and you use a credit card to purchase them, and then you are refused the ability to use those miles, within a certain period of the charge (60-90 days I think, call your credit provider to find out for sure) you can call the credit card company and dispute the charges since you were not provided with the service (the use of the miles) for which you paid. Then, as long as the matter is not resolved by the airline, they do not have your money. If you are refused service in the end, you are not charged the money, but if they want your money then they must complete the service that you purchased to your satisfaction.

kingbear

I would have loved to do that, except the TrackItBack purchase needed to be made by the end of 2009 and the miles weren't supposed to post until March. Additionally, as far as Jason from TIB and the CC company are concerned, I got what I ordered from TIB so there is no way to decline the charge and say I didn't get what I paid for.

kingbear

So what do you people recommend my first course of action be? Should I call and ask for Corporate Security? I don't think I'd ever get transferred to the right person. File a complaint with DOT or FTC? It can take months before anything materializes through those channels. Send a certified letter to Tempe? Who do I send it to? What do I say? They can just respond by saying that the matter is closed just like they have already through email. Contact the local paper? That may not be a bad idea...

Either way, what do all you folk think?

Oh, and for those hesitating to post about your own experience, please do. The time has come for us all to stand together and fight US on this.

formeraa

With all due respect, I would assume that most people at US are doing the job that they have been asked to do. I am friends with many past and current US/HP employees and most of them are particularly bright people. While you may have some opinion about US policies, I wouldn't necessarily denigrate the US employees. Furthermore, I do believe that US understands that they could be subject to a lawsuit when miles are confiscated.

So, I conclude that there must be some valid reason as to why these accounts were closed.

lougord99

And you must also conclude that every person accused of a crime is guilty for exactly the same reasons.

LHR/MEL/Europe FF

dcpatti - i also responded in another thread but certainly having a new account and buying lots of miles to use for a ticket does NOT seem to trigger the closure.

lots of my friends (all couples so living at the same address) did the same thing - opened accounts at the same time, waited the 11 days then shared/gifted/bought and redeemed the tickets.

Perhaps a trigger is buying the ticket for someone else without the same surname?