BoeingBoy

It's there - the last item in the North America origin section.

Just scanning through it, what struck me was that most of the green in US' column was for J/F class (with some Y thrown in for Europe-Caribbean and areas US doesn't serve). A recognition that many people redeeming for J/F where US offers service are choosing other carriers, perhaps?

Jim

vysean

Thanks for catching that, Jim. If I swing back by the office tomorrow I'll update the speadsheet and move it out so it's more obvious.

I'm not sure I'd agree that most of the green is for J/F. In fact, US is favorable or at least competitive (not more expensive) in almost every class of service across every route with the notable exception of the Middle East and North Asia to South Asia (which, in fairness, would compare favorably if you tried to get a UA/CO itinerary from Japan to anywhere in Asia due to how the three carriers define their regions). They are also uncompetitive with RTW itineraries when compared to CO, but CO is the outlier here and the rest of the alliance seems to have standardized on 200/300/400.

I'd assume that most of US' customers redeem for coach awards, whether for domestic or international travel, and that US figured a small increase (miles-wise, not necessarily percentage-wise) would go unnoticed or at least unchallenged while reducing more liability.

On second read, perhaps this is what you were saying?

BoeingBoy

Sorry - hit the "Submit" button half way through typing this up....

Just looking at the green for Y - where US is the least expensive - I get:

N. America to/from N. Asia (US doesn't serve)
N. America to/from Africa (US doesn't serve)
Europe to/from Caribbean (US does serve)
Europe to/from S. America (US is about to offer one flight)
Europe to/from N. & S. Asia (US doesn't serve)
Europe to/from S. Pac (US doesn't serve)
N. Asia to/from C. Asia (US doesn't serve)
S. Asia to/from C. Asia (US doesn't serve)
Within C. Asia (US doesn't serve)

So one that US serves is less expensive in Y on US.

Compare this to where US is less expensive for J and/or F:

Within N. America (US serves)
N. America / HI (US serves)
N. America / Caribbean (US serves)
N. America / S. America (US will have one flight)
N. America / Europe (US serves)
N. America / N. & C. Asia (US doesn't serve)
N. America / S. Pac (US doesn't serve)
N. America / Africa (US doesn't serve)
Europe / HI (US serves)
Europe / Caribbean (US serves)
Europe / S. America (US will have one flight)
Europe / N., C., & S Asia (US doesn't serve)
Europe / S. Pac (US doesn't serve)
Europe / Africa (US doesn't serve)
N Asia / S & C Asia (US doesn't serve)
N Asia / S Pac (US doesn't serve)
S Asia / S & C Asia (US doesn't serve)
C Asia / S Asia & S Pac (US doesn't serve)
S Pac / S Pac (US doesn't serve)

6 areas where US serves are less expensive on US in J and/or F (7 if you count S America).

I was suggesting that US may recognize that it's J product may not be up to the standards of OAL's (especially foreign based) and is discounting it's own J cabin to get some award bookings back that would otherwise gone to those OALs, at least for part of the itinerary where possible. Note that on the second list everything down to Europe/Africa (about 2/3 of the list) can be at least partially flown on US even if for some of them it would be the long way around.

It's also worth noting that US incurs less cost (or more income from other FF programs) if people fly US instead of OALs, making it worth while to charge fewer miles if it gets more people to use US at least part of their award travel.

Jim

MikeLaw

Yeah, that's it. For instance the average value on awards leaving from North America (excluding the RTW) is:

CO C -- 57.92
UA C -- 59.17
US C -- 60.00

US J -- 95.00
CO J -- 99.17
UA J -- 102.92

US F -- 121.25
CO F -- 127.08
UA F -- 130.83

It is obviously an extremely crude way to look at things, but it does to result in ranking the charts as US > CO >> UA which is true. Just using a simple average is a bit misleading since certain routings are obviously much more likely to be used than others, but I can't think of a better proposal at the moment.

Sorry about missing the RTW award on your chart. Attention to detail is not my strong suit.

vysean

I'll update the chart in the morning, or post a second with the above.

As to attention to detail - not my forte either, as you can see from looking through the various promo threads here and seeing my many "doh!" moments.

MikeLaw

Jim:

I didn't know that. Please tell me that (I'm guessing this because of the codeshare thing) the city served will be Lima. That will save me a lot of miles because the only South American city I really need an award to is Lima and the increases in the new chart were really bumming me out, since I'm going to need 4 of those.

vysean

As for Lima, both CO and AC serve it. Why not book it now, before the new award chart goes into play?

BoeingBoy

CLT - GIG (Rio) starts on the 15th I believe. It will be a 767 with same flight number service to PHL (767 PHL-CLt and A320 family CLT-PHL). That will tie into the new codeshare with TACA - I understand their hub is in Rio.

Jim

MikeLaw

I will be able to book 2 of the awards, but I can't nail down the dates of the other two trips yet. On a side note, when I mentioned the increased price of the awards to my wife she sweetly offered to increase her credit card spend to offset the award cost.

I'm pretty sure that TACA's South America hub is LIM, at least that is what Wikipedia says:

TACA only serves one destination from GIG (which is Lima)

BoeingBoy

My mistake about TACA's hub...something in the intra-company communications about increased connecting opportunities in S America caused me to assume Rio was their hub.

Jim

HCA

I know it's going to come and it seems not too bad.
At least we can plan well for current "US partner promotion" without worry the mileage requrement change.

Tiki

This award is the whole reason we are in US DM so very relieved the C class stayed the same. We just returned from a BNE-PPT trip in Y and the BNE-AKL segments were in a 3-4-3 configuration which was very uncomfortable. Thanks to Grand Slam, the nest trip to RAR will be in C!

thyeri

Wow, excellent news! No change for North Asia to Europe and North America in First Class.
I am going to buy/share 500,000 miles before the end of current promotion. 1,500$US for First class trip from Hong Kong to Canada with a stopover in Switzerland, I want lots of them!

dtremit

This is a big relief. Not sure why I would fly TATL in Envoy via PHL or CLT when I can use LX or LH, so it means the new US-metal rates are essentially meaningless.

ArizonaGuy

Because the hard product is improving, however slowly. There's a thread with pics on the new Envoy suites. Soft product was still same old, same old. If you can get the new hard product, save the $50 award processing fee and 5K miles via the credit card benefit (DM Select), it might sway you. If not you, certainly some others.