Is It True: Club Agent Said Rule 120.20 Revenue Ticket Not Upgradeable? And Soapbox
Dec 15, 2004, 2:01 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: BOS
Programs: JetBlue Mosaic, WN A List Preferred, Hyatt Globalest, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Platinum, IHG Spire
Posts: 3,966
Is It True: Club Agent Said Rule 120.20 Revenue Ticket Not Upgradeable? And Soapbox
Here's a new one...
I had a ticket endorsed from UA to US under rule 120.20. I check in, and one segment that could be confirmed was upgraded on the spot (I am CP on US).
Another segment was not available in first, so I stopped by the club to be added to the airport upgrade list. Club agent advised that a rule 120.20 ticket was not upgradeable, and to check at the gate. Agent would not put me on upgrade standby list! I asked agt "aren't you partners with UA," and agt said they were, but that the rule 120.20 ticket could not be upgraded.
I went to a different agt outside the club, and of course, they put me on the upgrade list without quoting such nonsense....true or not.
I don't see the logic in not upgrading rule 120.20 tickets per the pax status or with an upgrade cert. It is my understanding US receives the revenue face value of the rule 120.20 tickets from the other carrier.
Another thing that is absurd is this rule they have where a UA flight# cannot be upgraded in advance or at all by telephone per US status when the flight is operated with US metal. The CP desk would not do an upgrade even on the same day. This doesn't make any sense to me since it is on US metal. I had heard of this policy before, but this was the first time I actually personally had a UA flight# operated by US.
It is these kinds of things that will drive customers away at a time when US needs as many pax as it can get.
When management makes up some of these rules, policies, etc., they should ask some very simple question:
Will the customer like this?
If I was a pax, would I like this?
Also OT I was reading in Fast Company, and it was talking about how I believe the case study was IBM, and it was saying how they stress your "customers" are clients, rather than customers. Defenitions:
customer=Based on a transactional purchase; vs.
client=an ongoing relationship based on mutual trust, etc.
So mgmt should also ask themselves:
Does the proposed procedure or policy treat are pax more like clients or customers?
Will the proposed procedure or policy make the pax want to buy more US tickets, and recommend us/US
to their circle of influence, or will the policy or procedure make them less likely to use us again and less likely to recommend us?
Its unbelieveable that even when someone reaches the CP level, what % of flyers are CP, that the company still feels it is ok to hassle these people with petty sort of things that don't ingender goodwill.
So for this stupid little one upgrade I interfaced with:
*The original check in, where they genuinely forgot to put me on list for that segment but did upgrade second segment;
*The CP Desk, and was quoted the rule about UA flight# on US metal;
*The club, where either a dumb rule was enforced or invented on the spot, no upgrades on rule 120.20 tickets even for Chairman;
*The agent who finally put me on the list, and they were typing for literally like 3-4 minutes, not sure what they had to do; and
*Finally checking at the gate to see if the upgrade cleared.
Thats 5 (five) (count them) countable customer service interactions about a silly one segment upgrade.
If they want to streamline operations getting rid of a lot of this red tape.(dumb rules) would go along way. Because of their arcane rules and procedures, I needed to have five encounters with 5 different personell in order to complete a very simple transaction, and two of the encounters (CP desk and club) were negative, and I would say the other three encounters were neutral.
This almost sounds like a good business school process case study.
I had a ticket endorsed from UA to US under rule 120.20. I check in, and one segment that could be confirmed was upgraded on the spot (I am CP on US).
Another segment was not available in first, so I stopped by the club to be added to the airport upgrade list. Club agent advised that a rule 120.20 ticket was not upgradeable, and to check at the gate. Agent would not put me on upgrade standby list! I asked agt "aren't you partners with UA," and agt said they were, but that the rule 120.20 ticket could not be upgraded.
I went to a different agt outside the club, and of course, they put me on the upgrade list without quoting such nonsense....true or not.
I don't see the logic in not upgrading rule 120.20 tickets per the pax status or with an upgrade cert. It is my understanding US receives the revenue face value of the rule 120.20 tickets from the other carrier.
Another thing that is absurd is this rule they have where a UA flight# cannot be upgraded in advance or at all by telephone per US status when the flight is operated with US metal. The CP desk would not do an upgrade even on the same day. This doesn't make any sense to me since it is on US metal. I had heard of this policy before, but this was the first time I actually personally had a UA flight# operated by US.
It is these kinds of things that will drive customers away at a time when US needs as many pax as it can get.
When management makes up some of these rules, policies, etc., they should ask some very simple question:
Will the customer like this?
If I was a pax, would I like this?
Also OT I was reading in Fast Company, and it was talking about how I believe the case study was IBM, and it was saying how they stress your "customers" are clients, rather than customers. Defenitions:
customer=Based on a transactional purchase; vs.
client=an ongoing relationship based on mutual trust, etc.
So mgmt should also ask themselves:
Does the proposed procedure or policy treat are pax more like clients or customers?
Will the proposed procedure or policy make the pax want to buy more US tickets, and recommend us/US
to their circle of influence, or will the policy or procedure make them less likely to use us again and less likely to recommend us?Its unbelieveable that even when someone reaches the CP level, what % of flyers are CP, that the company still feels it is ok to hassle these people with petty sort of things that don't ingender goodwill.
So for this stupid little one upgrade I interfaced with:
*The original check in, where they genuinely forgot to put me on list for that segment but did upgrade second segment;
*The CP Desk, and was quoted the rule about UA flight# on US metal;
*The club, where either a dumb rule was enforced or invented on the spot, no upgrades on rule 120.20 tickets even for Chairman;
*The agent who finally put me on the list, and they were typing for literally like 3-4 minutes, not sure what they had to do; and
*Finally checking at the gate to see if the upgrade cleared.
Thats 5 (five) (count them)
countable customer service interactions about a silly one segment upgrade.If they want to streamline operations getting rid of a lot of this red tape.(dumb rules) would go along way. Because of their arcane rules and procedures, I needed to have five encounters with 5 different personell in order to complete a very simple transaction, and two of the encounters (CP desk and club) were negative, and I would say the other three encounters were neutral.
This almost sounds like a good business school process case study.
Last edited by jetsetter; Dec 15, 2004 at 2:09 pm Reason: spelling/grammar
Dec 15, 2004, 2:11 pm
#2
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Reading, PA
Programs: US lowlife
Posts: 2,006
"show me the money"
when I get varying answers like that I start demanding proof of what they're saying, no matter who they (think they) are.
Case and point, I've had upgrade issues with Res (up through their Supervisor chain) that when they couldnt find any other answer than "its just like that" I was referred to DMSC. Same thing happened with the DMSC as well, "its just like that" and then was quoted it falls under something so general it was a total load of BS.
All said and done, your upgrade was handled so all is not lost.
-JC
when I get varying answers like that I start demanding proof of what they're saying, no matter who they (think they) are.
Case and point, I've had upgrade issues with Res (up through their Supervisor chain) that when they couldnt find any other answer than "its just like that" I was referred to DMSC. Same thing happened with the DMSC as well, "its just like that" and then was quoted it falls under something so general it was a total load of BS.
All said and done, your upgrade was handled so all is not lost.
-JC
Dec 16, 2004, 5:32 am
#3
Moderator: Coupon Connection & S.P.A.M
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Louisville, KY
Programs: Destination Unknown, TSA Disparager Diamond (LTDD)
Posts: 57,952
Rule 120.20 tickets are most certainly upgradable, unless you were interlined on a coach award ticket, in which case they might argue that the $0.00 base fare isn't giving them any revenue (which couldn't be further from the truth).
To avoid this problem, and security-related problems, always book your own reaccommodations yourself and have the carrier that is interlining you either print your ticket or write you a FIM (flight interrupt manifest). Hand one of those items + your confirmation # to the carrier that will transport you and confirm your upgrade. Also, it's better to do this inside rather than outside security to further reduce the possibility of unwanted haraSSSSment at the checkpoint.
To avoid this problem, and security-related problems, always book your own reaccommodations yourself and have the carrier that is interlining you either print your ticket or write you a FIM (flight interrupt manifest). Hand one of those items + your confirmation # to the carrier that will transport you and confirm your upgrade. Also, it's better to do this inside rather than outside security to further reduce the possibility of unwanted haraSSSSment at the checkpoint.